The Izzo stuff was coming from Terry Hutchens and Peegs. It wasn't fans.

Bennett clearly was the choice before Crean. Montgomery was certainly considered before him. There are articles out that put them as the two leading candidates still available today.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Yeah Bennett was up there. I was thinking Montgomery was considered before Sampson, not before Crean. But there were so many names being tossed around hard to remember. Hell even some thought Coach K would take the job before Sampson.

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

IU also was in bad shape to find a coach though. It just seems like it's how college basketball works now. It will be interesting to see what happens when Kirkwood runs Crean out of town.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

My hope is that Stevens is tired of massaging big egos in the NBA when that happens.

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

I want Josh Pastner.

He has the modern greasy college basketball coach look. And he learned how to cheat from the best in Calipari.

Let me first off state that I don't have too strong an opinion on this topic, but I was more curious than anything...so, when comparing the Texas football job to the Illinois basketball job, I wanted to find out when was the last time someone left Texas for another job...seeing as one of the knocks I hear against Illinois being a top-tier position is that coaches use it as a stepping stone to something bigger and better...

So imagine my surprise when, going back to the mid-eighties, good old Fred Akers left Austin for, of all places, Purdue.

Funny how the CSFMB works sometimes.

Funny how the world of sports has changed since then. Can you imagine Mack Brown leaving Texas to take the Purdue job

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

He was supposedly really bad though. To be honest, I'd probably take Mack Brown now though.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

You'll get Dane Fife and like it.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I wasn't really comparing Texas football to Illinois basketball. I think I have a pretty good idea of where both programs fit.

But the idea that Illinois is some stepping-stone program is absurd and really just based on one guy- Bill Self. Self went to Kansas which is admittedly one of a handful of programs more storied than the Illini. Beyond that, he had deep roots in that part of the country and had previously worked at KU as an assistant. He left for his dream job at one of the very elite programs, a place where the man who invented the game had worked.

The only other guy who ever left Illinois was Gene Bartow who went to UCLA, which is the Texas of college basketball. And after his 8-18 season, nobody was too concerned about him leaving. And it was a mistake on Bartow's part. The guy won 50 games in two seasons and they ran him out of Westwood. He wasn't John Wooden. Of course, no one else is.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.

He will be 54 when the season starts.

_________________

Since the one and done rule hit college hoops, the Landscape has changed.

top 10 high school kids are looking for where they can get exposure nationally and Champaign Urbana isnt on that list.

They can get there, maybe but they need to develop a history of winning again. not just one decent year or 2 wins int he NCAA. a program needs to develop now. Go get some big guys that just dont have the skills they need yet, they take longer to get good, but if they get there, you really have something.

Outside of kentucky, UCLA, Duke, UNC, Kansas, Arizona, .....would Groce leave if Louisville came knocking? Texas? Oklahoma? Schools that sink money into the arena and the program? I think he would...thus making it a stepping stone of a program. Illinois's best chance is getting connected to the CPS feeder system, which the top programs are already in.

However, Illinois isnt connected into any Prep school system like Duke, UNC and Kansas are on the east coast or the way AZ and UCLA are from Bishop-Grom, or Findlay....these guys are recruited to come to these schools....years ahead of day 1. The Findlay facilties are nicer than the U of I facilities.

Groce is a stepping stone of a coach as well. Its not that he isnt good...because I think he is....but a top 100 player who gets calls from guys he knows...Self, Coach K, Pitino, Donovan.....sorry, but that call from coach Groce isnt returned.

Groce has a chance to be one of those guys. He has a program with some tools to develop a good team that gets National rankings, national TV and face time.

Then when that happens the BIG TIME programs come knocking....most guys like Groce are walking.

Shaka Smart didnt. Its a very unique case, but it was his chance to get a shot at one of these elite top 10 programs.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

One and done really has harmed college buckets

_________________
Elections have consequences.

It has created a bigger gap that teams like Illinois need to close. They arent going to close it by getting top 10 players, because they might get 1 every few years, but they will never get 3 top 10 players like kentucky or even a top 10 player each year.

Wisc has done a very good job of finding the big guy white connection. While they might not be a top tier program, they have fringed with final 4 showings and winning years. They now have a reputation and get those players they recruit.

Every year, every coach, every fan says "We need to re-establish that public league connection".

What Illinois needs to do is to get in with that Cartwright Basketball Academy and build it. Get some donor money involved in it. Same Donors for that and the U of I, gets a great head start on getting chicagos top talent. creating a new pipeline.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

One and done sucks. Funny how letting kids go straight from high school to the NBA made for a better college basketball environment.

_________________

What you're saying is true in that Illinois isn't likely to have a super-team loaded with one and done guys. But that's a double-edged sword for teams like Kentucky. They have to constantly keep reloading. And that has resulted in getting beaten by Robert Morris and the rise of programs like Butler and VCU.

Twenty-five years ago I would have been extremely depressed had my team lost Snider and Alexander on signing day after it appeared they were coming. Now, it's not as big a deal. To tell you the truth, I'm not sure you're better off with one year of Snider than with four years of Tate. Having a guy like Snider was certainly going to set back the development of a guy like Tate, if not causing him to transfer to a mid-major where he might kick your teeth in in a second round game a couple seasons down the road when Snider is gone.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.

Why is Akron being argued about in this thread?

_________________

Why Jim Mora said no to Texas

I spoke with two sources today who confirmed what Adam Schefter previously reported, that Jim Mora was effectively offered the job at Texas and turned it down.

Both sources confirmed what we reported as soon as word broke that Mora was involved...that there was no way Mora was going to accept the job. Mora has four children and they are a very important part of his life. Jim's oldest son recently began college in California. He has two more in high school and another who I believe is in junior high. They love where they are and Jim doesn't plan to leave anytime soon.

Both sources concurred that the next move Mora will make, and it doesn't sound like it will be soon, will be back to the league as a head coach.

Oh, and if you were looking for just one more reason to like Jim...we hear that nearly the entire negotiation with UCLA (when the Washington job came open and UW came courting) was related to additional compensation and security for his staff. When those numbers are revealed (no idea when that might be) we are told some of his staff members will be the highest or among the highest in the country at their position.

_________________

Quality of life in Westwood is OK. Austin is good as well, but Mora is a young guy, he's happy has a good program on upswing and at the ned of the day he doesnt see the UT job as that big of a deal.

he is an NFL guy and wants to go back for a shot at a Super Bowl.

UT having a Big 10 like problem right now. Some people just dont see UT as big as UT sees UT.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

Kruger went to the Atlanta Hawks.

_________________
My Maserati does 186.

Yeah, different business, only marginally related. Pitino went to the NBA from Kentucky too. That isn't a move up. It's a career change.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.

But the TV money is there. Just like it's in the Big Ten.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.

Mora grew up in the NFL, the guy is NFL legacy, if he does well at UCLA he will be offered another NFL job, not many guys get that shot of going from NFL to college back to the NFL.

The guy wants to win a Super Bowl, he just doesnt care that much about Texas and the $3.5 mill he is getting at UCLA is fine for the next 3-4 years. He can feed Goulds kids.

So, the pride of Texas, hookem, fly your plane is all great, but the guy is happy where he is, he could win a Rose Bowl..or even bigger....

The new LA ZOOM...your head coach Jim Mora Jr!

Its no secret the NFL wants back into the LA market.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

This is a dream for Strong. Perfect timing for him.

This is (another) big, red flag for Texas football.

_________________

One and done is fine. You still get to see some future NBA talent but others can make up for it by being better teams.

I'd prefer two and done but I think things are fine. It's not that hard to figure out who the top freshman are in college basketball. ESPN will devote November and December to making sure you know who they are.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'm not really a fan of one and done, but I do think it's actually a handicap for the "power teams" and creates more parity within college basketball. I mentioned as much in a previous post in this thread. For every group that Calipari puts together like the one that won the championship with Anthony Davis et al. there are going to be a couple capable of getting beat by Robert Morris. That fact is evidenced by the rise of mid-majors that consitently put together strings of solid teams based on three and four year players.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.

In college, even the great players need to adjust to what wins in college. It's not intentionally created as a superstar league though there are some guys(Aaron Craft) that seemingly play with a different set of rules. If we were playing with NBA rules, Jabari Parker would score 60 a night.

That has been the biggest problem with Calipari's teams and I think he's all but admitted that some of his freshman classes have not embraced the college game whereas others took to it because they wanted to win. You can tell when his teams are basically practicing for the NBA. Sadly, this team, which should be all time great good may be looking forward to draft day already. Others like the one you mentioned, and the Derrick Rose team, embraced the challenge and had a goal of winning.

I think it makes things more interesting. If you aren't interested to see what happens with Jabari Parker and the Kentucky freshman then you just don't like basketball. It's more compelling to me than watching Lebron James do what we all know he will do and win another title.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

You're touching on the thing that always puzzles me when bernstein simultaneously worships NBA coaches and denigrates the college game. The strategy in the college game is so much deeper and more complex and varied than that in the professional game. And this even after all types of rule changes at the collegiate level to emulate pro basketball.

The NBA is largely based on the simple concept of the "two-man game" and no use of jargon or piping about back screens and such will change that. There isn't the same kind of ball pressure in the NBA which is why true ball-handling point guards have never really been at a premium. You have all these professional "businessmen" drinking coffee and opening mail, playing 82+ games a season and you're going to aks them to go balls out and press the ball every night? Ask Rick Pitino where that got him.

_________________
The Court will accord substantial deference to the government's immigration policies, particularly those that implicate matters of national security.