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1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
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Author:  Curious Hair [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:05 am ]
Post subject:  1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
This is significant to me because I grew up having to listen to 890 in the car. Now while Roe and Garry weren't all that bad once upon a time, I really resent the fact that I had to grow up around a station that carried Rush Limbaugh.

So I'm looking through radio-online and see that 890 is down to a 1.4 -- one-point-four! -- for the spring 2014 rating period, down from 2.7 about a year ago. The Big 89 is now a small #24, trailing such luminaries as K-Hits, US 99, Power 92 (#1 in the streets!), the anodyne and directionless 100.3, the Mexican polka music on the old 'NUA, and in what must be the greatest indignity to right-wing radio, WBEZ. Of course, WBEZ is where NPR stands for "nice, polite, rich," so it's not exactly like Roe Conn's losing to Democracy Now or some shit, but still, ten years ago I never would have imagined that a public radio station could beat a conservative AM blowtorch. The climate of radio, particularly public radio, just never would have allowed for that. But here we are.

Actually, looking at the stations that aren't ahead of WLS, all I see are suburban stations, Spanish stations, and WFMT. So if I'm not mistaken, 890 is the worst-performing anglophone commercial station in the city of Chicago. ♫ DOUBLE-U-ELLLL-ESSSS!!!! ♫

I also bring this up because for all the talk about every little move WGN makes and how they're always about to be in serious trouble, their ratings actually indicate that conditions are pretty stable. Of course, a corpse's condition is also stable, and corpses seem to be WGN's target audience these days, but still, a 4.0 for spring (4.6 in May surely on the winds of Blackhawks playoffs) is not that bad for a station whose programming is that bad. WLS, though, just as much a heritage AM station as WGN, they're just circling the drain here and comparatively speaking, no one's talking about it. So I figured maybe we could.

Ratings-wise, 890 is now the weakest performer in the Cumulus cluster, behind KQX, WLS-FM, and the Loop. We can't speak for billing yet because no solid numbers have come in on how KQX bills (nor the Loop under Cumulus), but I remember Feder did a piece on 2013 billing and 890 was down $2MM (or 13%) from 2012, and a 13% drop in billing certainly sounds precipitous to me. KQX is killin' it in the ratings, though. I hear it in public a lot.

As I said in one of the Mac threads (too many to keep straight, thx Beardown), it wouldn't surprise me if 890 goes sports. Cumulus handles distribution for C-B-S-SPORTS-RA-DI-O!!!, which has minimal carriage in Chicago. I don't know whether CBS could block it; the very fact that two media conglomerates are in on this together still kinda boggles my mind. Also, it looked like they were trying to prime the pump for a move to sports by doing that awful "Sports Pregame Show" with Lou Canellis, Steve Stone, and a host who only seems to care about Dancing With The Stars.

Would you be happy with WLS going sports?
Author:  bigfan [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
If they could go WGUY without being WGAY, I think it's a solid format. can be 75% sports. Give me a barbq show, even the fishing show, sports equipment, I will even take the fitness guy twice a week,comedy, give me more wagering info, throw in some web talk for guys, etc etc.

I love my sportstalk, but when I hear the Golf report on Saturday, it's brutal. I like playing golf, I don't mind a tip or two, but that show is the biggest handjob on radio ever.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
I think you have the right idea. Figure that what's left of the WLS audience already consists mostly of middle-aged white males (though it's the only station my grandmother listens to :(), so turning it into guy-talk/sports wouldn't be much of a migration. Do it right and they could pull the rug out from under the Game and their "liking sports without being defined by them" crap.
Author:  donspiracy [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
KILL THE TRAFFIC ON THE 5's!!!!! The station can only get better from there. I know that it has a sponsor, but it is a shitty and useless report filled with nothing that is relevant to me.

The morning and show before Limbaugh is radio wasteland. Such a historic signal is in serious need of a complete rebuild.
Author:  Beardown [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Sports or "All News" seems like the only thing that make money in local radio. So 890 might as well go to one of them.

Nobody wants to hear a general talk show anymore.
Author:  donspiracy [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
You can do general talk, but the hosts HAVE to be in possession of personality. Danny Mac to afternoon drive time WLS!
Author:  Peoria Matt [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
I was listening the day lujack barged in on Steve and Garry and threatened to beat steve up.
Author:  Beardown [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 1:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
I don't understand how music stations make money now-a-days. If they do make a profit, it can't be that much.
Author:  Beardown [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Don't you find it amazing that a market like Chicago only has one "All News" station.

WBBM makes the most money of all radio stations in Chicago. If WLS is just decent at it, they could take a chunk of WBBM's listener ship. They certainly would do better than what they're making now.

Or just go all sports. It's cheaper to produce than "all news".
Author:  Curious Hair [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Beardown wrote:
Sports or "All News" seems like the only thing that make money in local radio. So 890 might as well go to one of them.

Nobody wants to hear a general talk show anymore.


I think what made Roe and Garry's show work was that they didn't take politics that seriously, the same way B&B didn't take sports seriously (though they sure seem to now). That and Garry Meier is more talented than Richard Roeper. ABC was actually pretty good at not running WLS as a fortress of right-wing lunacy. Obviously, it was still a conservative station, but they had Jay Marvin, Mike Malloy, a few other liberals sprinkled in, plus Roma, who must be some sort of pinko flake from the way she spent years doing live reads for bacteria pills that helped you shit your guts out every day. Plus Roe and Garry weren't really that conservative, and they picked up Coast to Coast overnights.

Under Citadel and Cumulus, though, it's been pretty far to the right. They had Sean Hannity, replaced him with Michael Savage, they still have Mark Levin, and overnights are some sort of trucker show. Weekends seem to be syndicated or brokered and of the Investment Tips For Gold And Silver variety. Radio wasteland indeed.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Beardown wrote:
Don't you find it amazing that a market like Chicago only has one "All News" station.


Well, we had a second one in 2011-2012, but it was predicated on the idea that women are retarded and can't handle men telling them about world events, so all their "news" was just about where you could find a sale on shoes. Also, everything was pre-recorded and then the audio files were mislabeled so that nothing ever ran properly. It was as if WBBM had been handed over to Score interns.

I would say that at this point, WBEZ functions as a second news station. True, they're not live/local all day, or even very much at all, but between Morning Edition, ATC, and the Afternoon Shift, they're providing a lot of news programming.
Author:  Erotic Lawyer [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
I honestly listened to Don and Roma a lot simply because they were on when 9-11 happened and I was in my office. Their coverage well anyone's on that day meant a lot. I'm neither liberal nor conservative though and 890 was way too heavy handed, I assume they still are. Yeah move the game there everyone will be happy.
Author:  No Clever Moniker [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 8:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
CBS Sports Radio is in markets where CBS doesn't have a sports station. No way in hell they confuse advertisers/listeners by adding a national show to their current sports cash cow.

There was another news station in Chicago but it changed formats, WMAQ-670.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
I don't remember, was WMAQ the more intense short-cycle kind of news radio (think 1010 WINS) while WBBM did more longform news stories, or was it the other way around? I don't really remember WMAQ.
Author:  Peoria Matt [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Curious Hair wrote:
I don't remember, was WMAQ the more intense short-cycle kind of news radio (think 1010 WINS) while WBBM did more longform news stories, or was it the other way around? I don't really remember WMAQ.


You're right, CH.

"You give us 10 minutes, we'll give you the world" was what I thought their old slogan was but it was 22 minutes.
Author:  DannyB [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
They should go back to the Top 40 format and do the best 100 songs of all time survey every year. American Pie, Hey Jude and Stairway to Heaven would still win.
Author:  Rod [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
DannyB wrote:
They should go back to the Top 40 format and do the best 100 songs of all time survey every year. American Pie, Hey Jude and Stairway to Heaven would still win.


"Seasons in the Sun"! Topping the 1974 Big 89 Countdown. My disappointment was palpable.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
It sounds crazy now, but Garry Meier basically saved WLS from getting flipped back to music -- satellite-fed country, if I'm not mistaken -- because of how poorly the station was doing in the early '90s. The O.J. trial and Roe & Garry were the big turning points for the station. Crazy to think that someone would have given up on right-wing talk radio in 1994.

The "younger, hipper" WLS-FM did end up getting flipped to country, though, the first of many flips before they finally settled on oldies a few years ago.
Author:  Minooka Meatball [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Peoria Matt wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
I don't remember, was WMAQ the more intense short-cycle kind of news radio (think 1010 WINS) while WBBM did more longform news stories, or was it the other way around? I don't really remember WMAQ.


You're right, CH.

"You give us 10 minutes, we'll give you the world" was what I thought their old slogan was but it was 22 minutes.



1010 WINS still uses the 22 minutes tag. Same as the old 'MAQ, as they were both Westinghouse stations back in the day, and WINS carries on the tradition :salut:
Author:  Dallas Winston [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Curious Hair wrote:
It sounds crazy now, but Garry Meier basically saved WLS from getting flipped back to music -- satellite-fed country, if I'm not mistaken


You're not mistaken, but then Meier turned out to have the financial sense of Mike North, and cost himself millions by letting his wife convince him he was anything more than the perfect second banana. I guess he learned nothing from the Dahl fiasco. Now he gets to talk with Leslie Keiling, which is painfully obvious he doesn't want to do, and pretend that he knows anything about sports. Meier's Mojo? :lol:
Author:  sinicalypse [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
"no mister bond, you have never defeated an opponent like me, for if you give me 22 minutes I will give you the world!!!!!"

i always loved that pomposity as a kid.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 1:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Minooka Meatball wrote:
1010 WINS still uses the 22 minutes tag. Same as the old 'MAQ, as they were both Westinghouse stations back in the day, and WINS carries on the tradition :salut:


Thanks. I always get my Westinghouse/Infinity wires crossed. Did WMAQ have the teletype chattering in the background like WINS still does?
Author:  good dolphin [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
all I needed to know about the current WLS was presented to me about a month ago when I caught Mark Levine with special guest Stephen A. Smith. That is not a typo.
Author:  Curious Hair [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
July ratings are in and they're still at 1.4. But oh crap, Score's down to a 1.9 for July:

WSCR-AM 2.3 2.4 2.0 1.9

White Sox!
Author:  Curious Hair [ Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
from Larz:
Quote:
Looking now at the highly-desired demographic (by advertisers, and therefore station owners) of Persons 25-54...

Two one-time AM radio powerhouses, WGN-AM and WLS-AM, are not even in the Top 20. WGN-AM has fallen to #25 with a lowly 1.5 share in this demo (its worst ratings of the year so far), while WLS-AM has fallen to #29 with a 0.7 share. (That 0.7 is just above its worst ratings in its nine decades history. The worst was last month when it sunk to a 0.6 share.) The only Chicago radio stations on the AM frequency in the Top 20 for Persons 25-54 are WBBM-AM (#11 with a 3.4 share) and WSCR-AM (#20 with a 2.0 share).


Bad programming, an aging demographic, and a growing distaste for incendiary conservative media have WLS on the run!
Author:  Curious Hair [ Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
Gaze, if you dare, at WLS's weekend schedule:

Saturday
12:00 a.m. - 4:00 a.m. - Red Eye Radio
4:00 a.m. - 5:00 a.m. - Wall Street Journal This Weekend
5:00 a.m. - 6:00 a.m. - Online Power Trading
6:00 a.m. - 7:00 a.m. - Inside Health
7:00 a.m. - 8:00 a.m. - America's Wealth Management
8:00 a.m. - 9:00 a.m. - Drive Chicago with Paul Brian
9:00 a.m. - 10:00 a.m. - The Mutual Fund Show
10:00 a.m. - 11:00 a.m. - The Law Show
11:00 a.m. - 12:00 p.m. - Power Trading Radio
12:00 p.m. - 1:00 p.m. - Purity Products
1:00 p.m. - 2:00 p.m. - Network Capital
2:00 p.m. - 3:00 p.m. - Connected to Chicago with Bill Cameron
3:00 p.m. - 6:00 p.m. - Larry Kudlow
6:00 p.m. - 7:00 p.m. - CSE Show
7:00 p.m. - 10:00 p.m. - Kim Komando
10:00 p.m. - 11:00 p.m. - Wall Street Journal This Weekend
11:00 p.m. - 12:00 a.m. - John Batchelor

Sunday
12:00 a.m. - 4:00 a.m. - Red Eye Radio
4:00 a.m. - 4:30 a.m. - Two Lights Media
4:30 a.m. - 5:00 a.m. - Dr. Newton's Naturals
5:00 a.m. - 5:30 a.m. - Nature's Tech
5:30 a.m. - 6:00 a.m. - Two Lights Media
6:00 a.m. - 7:00 a.m. - The Safe Money People
7:00 a.m. - 8:00 a.m. - Garden Sense Radio
8:00 a.m. - 9:00 a.m. - Securing Your Financial Future
9:00 a.m. - 11:00 a.m. - Ric Edelman
11:00 a.m. - 11:30 a.m. - Natren
11:30 a.m. - 12:00 p.m. - My Pillow
12:00 p.m. - 1:00 p.m. - Real Estate Today
1:00 p.m. - 2:00 p.m. - Financial Safari
2:00 p.m. - 3:00 p.m. - Tom Bevan
3:00 p.m. - 6:00 p.m. - Bob Brinker
6:00 p.m. - 8:00 p.m. - Beyond the Beltway with Bruce DuMont
8:00 p.m. - 12:00 a.m. - Stephanie Trussell

"My Pillow" sounds like appointment radio. This is supposed to be a major station.
Author:  sinicalypse [ Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
my pilow is on from 11:30am - 12pm on a sunday?

do they have their target demographic nailed or what?
Author:  Douchebag [ Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.4, not looking good for WLS-AM, is it?
AM radio is a wasteland on weekends. I can't believe anytime would pay for time on these stations,
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