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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 2:52 am 
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I appreciate what Hendry has done. 3 Playoff appearences in the last 6 years. Very impressive. However, when you can spend money like a drunken sailor and don't get the ship into port something has to happen.

Hendry has given out the following contracts

Derrick Lee
Zambo
Bradley
Marquis
Lilly
Fukodome
Aramis
Dempster

Not to mention the horrible Pierre trade, the botched Furcal signing.

Again I appreciate the winning season Jim, but a gorilla with an open pocked book could have signed the above contracts and had the same success.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:22 am 
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You should have stuck with one post.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:56 am 
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Don't forget that he traded Jason Marquis, who is tied for the NL lead in wins and all he could manage to get in return is a shitty reliever that he's paying to pitch for the Cleveland Indians.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:57 am 
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RFDC wrote:
You should have stuck with one post.


:lol: :thumleft:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:43 am 
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ted lilly was one of the best signings for a pitcher in the last 5 years


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 1:56 pm 
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Yeah, thanks for D lee!!!!!!

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 3:32 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Don't forget that he traded Jason Marquis, who is tied for the NL lead in wins and all he could manage to get in return is a shitty reliever that he's paying to pitch for the Cleveland Indians.


Marquis has done this before...I want to say it was 2005 when he was with the Cards they he was having one hell of a first half...he ended up not even making the playoff roster...


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:04 pm 
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Even if Marquis doesn't win another game Dan O'Dowd (Rockies GM) took Hendry to the cleaners on that deal.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:09 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Even if Marquis doesn't win another game Dan O'Dowd (Rockies GM) took Hendry to the cleaners on that deal.


But I didn't think that the Marquis deal was made to get talent, I thought it was made to dump salary, but I could be wrong.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:27 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Don't forget that he traded Jason Marquis, who is tied for the NL lead in wins and all he could manage to get in return is a shitty reliever that he's paying to pitch for the Cleveland Indians.


Why the fuck are you complaining about it? Every time Vizcaino pitches against the Sox, you benefit. You should send a Thank You card.
Wins are an overrated stat. That said, the Marquis deal was a wretched one, it's true. Hendry has made some very good deals, but until he put together a WS champion, he can be pilloried for every mistake he makes.
So be it.
It gives some Sox fans something to do.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:28 pm 
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crosscheck wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
Even if Marquis doesn't win another game Dan O'Dowd (Rockies GM) took Hendry to the cleaners on that deal.


But I didn't think that the Marquis deal was made to get talent, I thought it was made to dump salary, but I could be wrong.


I believe you're right. However, it was done to either help land Peavy (which he didn't) or sign Bradley (which has been an unmitigated disaster)

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:09 pm 
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I'm no Hendry fan at all, but Marquis's numbers this year could not have been predicted, and for what he did in Chicago he was vastly overpaid. Not to mention, the Cubs starting rotation has hardly been their problem. And it's true that Lilly has been one of the best signings among pitchers that you can find over the last several years.

However, I wonder if there is any mathematical formula that could be used to prove that the Cubs outfield is the most overpaid outfield in history, as far as dollars for performance. Soriano, Fukudome, and Bradley, wow. $40 million (at least) this year alone, and if not for Soriano's early HR burst, their stats added together would be disappointing for ONE player, much less three.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:30 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Don't forget that he traded Jason Marquis, who is tied for the NL lead in wins and all he could manage to get in return is a shitty reliever that he's paying to pitch for the Cleveland Indians.


At least the guy gave up the winning hit on Friday. So in effect, he got paid to help the Cubs win and did just that!!!

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:45 pm 
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24_Guy wrote:
I'm no Hendry fan at all, but Marquis's numbers this year could not have been predicted, and for what he did in Chicago he was vastly overpaid. Not to mention, the Cubs starting rotation has hardly been their problem. And it's true that Lilly has been one of the best signings among pitchers that you can find over the last several years.

However, I wonder if there is any mathematical formula that could be used to prove that the Cubs outfield is the most overpaid outfield in history, as far as dollars for performance. Soriano, Fukudome, and Bradley, wow. $40 million (at least) this year alone, and if not for Soriano's early HR burst, their stats added together would be disappointing for ONE player, much less three.


He wasn't vastly overpaid until this year because the deal Hendry gave him was heavily backloaded.

The starting rotation hasn't been the problem (yet) but if they kept Marquis that would have allowed Marshall to be in the bullpen from the get go. The bullpen has been a major problem.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 1:34 pm 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
He wasn't vastly overpaid until this year because the deal Hendry gave him was heavily backloaded.

The starting rotation hasn't been the problem (yet) but if they kept Marquis that would have allowed Marshall to be in the bullpen from the get go. The bullpen has been a major problem.



How much of the backloaded contract are the Cubs on the hook for? If they're still on the hook for a lot, then it still stands that he was overpaid. If they got off the hook, then it was a good move. And we still have to see where Marquis' numbers are at the end of the year. We're not even halfway through yet.

True Marshall could have been in the pen from the start of the season, but, to me it's been the Cubs offense that has cost them many more games than the bullpen (and it was the offense that the Marquis dump was intended to help, even if it hasn't worked so far).


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:47 pm 
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right now id rather have randy wells for his price than overpaying marquis for being mediocre


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:22 pm 
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24_Guy wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
He wasn't vastly overpaid until this year because the deal Hendry gave him was heavily backloaded.

The starting rotation hasn't been the problem (yet) but if they kept Marquis that would have allowed Marshall to be in the bullpen from the get go. The bullpen has been a major problem.



How much of the backloaded contract are the Cubs on the hook for? If they're still on the hook for a lot, then it still stands that he was overpaid. If they got off the hook, then it was a good move. And we still have to see where Marquis' numbers are at the end of the year. We're not even halfway through yet.

True Marshall could have been in the pen from the start of the season, but, to me it's been the Cubs offense that has cost them many more games than the bullpen (and it was the offense that the Marquis dump was intended to help, even if it hasn't worked so far).


The cubs paid the Rockies $1M and took back an awful contract ($3.5M + $.5M buyout) in Luis Vizcaino. So essentially the cubs are paying $5M for Marquis to win games for the Rockies and Vizcaino to lose games for the Indians. Definitely not one of Hendry's better moves.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 7:56 am 
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One Post wrote:
the botched Furcal signing.

Someone spell their name wrong on the contract?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 8:31 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
24_Guy wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
He wasn't vastly overpaid until this year because the deal Hendry gave him was heavily backloaded.

The starting rotation hasn't been the problem (yet) but if they kept Marquis that would have allowed Marshall to be in the bullpen from the get go. The bullpen has been a major problem.



How much of the backloaded contract are the Cubs on the hook for? If they're still on the hook for a lot, then it still stands that he was overpaid. If they got off the hook, then it was a good move. And we still have to see where Marquis' numbers are at the end of the year. We're not even halfway through yet.

True Marshall could have been in the pen from the start of the season, but, to me it's been the Cubs offense that has cost them many more games than the bullpen (and it was the offense that the Marquis dump was intended to help, even if it hasn't worked so far).


The cubs paid the Rockies $1M and took back an awful contract ($3.5M + $.5M buyout) in Luis Vizcaino. So essentially the cubs are paying $5M for Marquis to win games for the Rockies and Vizcaino to lose games for the Indians. Definitely not one of Hendry's better moves.


Lets keep in mind the trend Marquis has established in the past several years, starting with the Cardinals and continuing with the Cubs, of doing very well in the first half of the season and then getting torched the 2nd half. Thats why he always has double digets in the win collumn, but is left off the playoff rosters-or in last seasons case, just never used. I suspect we will see Marquis tailing off very soon .

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:41 am 
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Marquis was 9-4 with a 3.27 era in june with the cardinals in 2005.

he finished 13-14 with an era over 4


he was 9-5 in june in 2006

he finished 14-16 with an era over 6


he was 9-5 with a 3.14 era in june in 2007

he finished 12-9 with a 4.60 era


he was 9-5 last year in june

he finished 11-9 with a 4.53 era



i think its pretty safe to say hell finish this year pretty shitty


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:52 am 
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Elmhurst Steve wrote:
Lets keep in mind the trend Marquis has established in the past several years, starting with the Cardinals and continuing with the Cubs, of doing very well in the first half of the season and then getting torched the 2nd half.

Just like the Cubs trend. Doing pretty well in the regular season, and getting torched in October.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:56 am 
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JasonB wrote:
ted lilly was one of the best signings for a pitcher in the last 5 years


One good sigining compared to 10 bad ones does not make a good GM.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:59 am 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
One Post wrote:
the botched Furcal signing.

Someone spell their name wrong on the contract?


Hey, that could happen ... I just ran across this blog post:

D.H. wrote:
Putting the wrong name on a contract happens way more often than you think ... shit, I was all set to set-up this state-of-the-art website where radio no-names and has-beens could all congregate and, free from all things successful, would be able to ply their trade badly to their heart's content all the while using money I'd pocketed from a number of other schemes to create a medical company as a front for laundering it all.

So when the day came to sign all the paperwork and documents, I accidentally use my real name (for legal reasons I'll just say D. Hernandez ... no, I mean David H.) instead of the name I had taken the time to create a legal identity for, Dick Lickington. You win some, you lose some I guess.

I gotta get goin' ... it's kinda tough for me now - I'm like mint jelly, 'cause I'm on the lam.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:39 am 
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sjboyd0137 wrote:
JasonB wrote:
ted lilly was one of the best signings for a pitcher in the last 5 years


One good sigining compared to 10 bad ones does not make a good GM.


just pointing out he doesnt belong on the list of bad signings


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:48 am 
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JasonB wrote:
sjboyd0137 wrote:
JasonB wrote:
ted lilly was one of the best signings for a pitcher in the last 5 years


One good sigining compared to 10 bad ones does not make a good GM.


just pointing out he doesnt belong on the list of bad signings


Neither does Aramis Ramirez. Both were good signings. Ramirez may not be giving them anything now, due to being hurt, but he has produced very well. He's one of the better 3rd basemen in the game today (combining offense and defense) and a clutch hitter. Lilly has been a very dependable pitcher, who almost always gives the team a solid chance to win. When the Cubs got him, he had won 15 games for Toronto. Since being with the Cubs, he has equalled or exceeded that total, rather than falling short of career highs, as so many free agents do.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:54 am 
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This Cubs team should have been left as is. The changes that Hendry made were clearly at the request of Lou, who "wanted to get more left handed". I've got your left hand right here!
No way does Hundry go out and sign players without Lou's endorsement.
Trading Derosa & replacing him with Miles was just foolish. Signing Bradley was foolish. Jason Marquis was a decent #3 or #4 starter who now has 9 wins for the Rockies.
I am looking forward to the day in which both Hendry & Lou are gone.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:57 am 
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JohnKirk wrote:
This Cubs team should have been left as is.


And if Hendry leaves it alone, people are bitching about that.

Quote:
Jason Marquis was a decent #3 or #4 starter


Marquis was never a 3 or 4 for the Cubs. He was always a 5. Losing Marquis is not that big of a deal, he starts strong and finishes bad. I am pretty sure he will do that again this year.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:38 am 
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RFDC wrote:
JohnKirk wrote:
This Cubs team should have been left as is.


And if Hendry leaves it alone, people are bitching about that.

Quote:
Jason Marquis was a decent #3 or #4 starter


Marquis was never a 3 or 4 for the Cubs. He was always a 5. Losing Marquis is not that big of a deal, he starts strong and finishes bad. I am pretty sure he will do that again this year.


Clearly, Hendry had to go to work on the bullpen. Kerry Wood got 10 million a year for 2 years, with an option. No way was Hendry going to match anything like that, for a guy who had as many trips to the DL as Wood had. Plus, Howry was not going to be brought back and Eyre was jettisoned even before the end of 2008. With Fukadome's bad 2nd half, it was anything but certain that he was going to be a regular starter. Moves had to be made, but Jim Hendry made some poor choices. Abreau or Ibanez would have been better choices over Bradley. DeRosa provided protection at several positions, as well as being solid at 2nd. He should have been retained-especially considering his modest salary (5 million). Trading Marquis, is something I will never rag about. He sucks in the 2nd half of the season and can't be counted on when you need him most. With Bradley hitting better lately, Lee hitting as well as just about anyone in the league the past couple weeks and Soto's bat coming out of hibernation lately too, the team may be ready to make a big move. Winning 4 in a row is exciting and all, but I have to keep in mind that it was 4 games won against losing teams (White Sux and Indians). So lets see if the good string continues against Atlanta tonight and then in the series vs the Tigers.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:42 am 
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My take: Hendry has been pretty good as a GM...has had the luxury of an open checkbook most of the time...and I think he's taken advantage of it most of the time.

hes a b-

Epstein being an A
J.P. Ricardi a C
Jim Bowden an F


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:43 am 
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Elmhurst Steve wrote:
Neither does Aramis Ramirez. Both were good signings. Ramirez may not be giving them anything now, due to being hurt, but he has produced very well. He's one of the better 3rd basemen in the game today (combining offense and defense) and a clutch hitter. Lilly has been a very dependable pitcher, who almost always gives the team a solid chance to win. When the Cubs got him, he had won 15 games for Toronto. Since being with the Cubs, he has equalled or exceeded that total, rather than falling short of career highs, as so many free agents do.


hes really done quite a few good things for this team despite alot of his shortcomings. getting aramis and lofton for bobby hill was a great move. and i support resigning aramis i agree he is one of the best 3rd basmen in atleast the national league if not all of baseball. he traded hee sop choi for derrek lee and you can say whatever you want about him but that was a one sided deal in the cubs favor. and honestly im fine with giving him the deal he got. signing mark derosa for 3/$13 mil was a great deal. then theres finding reed johnson and jim edmonds off the garbage pile last season. hes not all bad but hes made some awful moves too


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