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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2024 10:38 pm 
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From an older BA article but interesting.

Position Players ranked #1-10 are "Busts" 37.4% of the time. #11-20 are "Busts" 40.8% of the time, and then it jumps up to 60%+ from there.

Pitchers ranked #1-10 are "Busts" 59.2% of the time. #11-20 are "Busts" 62.7% of the time, and then it jumps up to 79%+ from there. Maybe it's smart to sell high on pitching prospects...

About 70% of Top 100 prospects fail


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 8:13 am 
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Great! Prospects fail at same rate as the game’s best hitters. .300!

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 9:05 am 
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Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
I heard Jim Callis interviewed this morning about the trade and the prospect return. He thinks that Teel will be a very good defensive catcher who can hit at least 12 HR and maybe up to 20 a year with a solid average.

I think a solid comp is Matt Wieters, who underperformed expectations as a top draft choice. When his OPS+ was in the 90s, he was a 1.5-2 WAR starter. The couple of years where he had 20 HR power and got his OPS+ closer to 110, he was a 4-5 WAR guy. Teel will probably be closer to the solid 1.5 WAR guy who has one season where he goes on a tear for 50-60 games and jacks up his stats. That would be a #6/7 hitter on a good team.


then that's a terrible return and heavily dependent on montgomery


Well Montgomery is a first round pick. And the White Sox have done so well with first and second round outfielders...

I would have held out for Marcelo Mayer straight up. Yes he's also a shortstop but he's also ticketed for AAA this year so they can delay his service time start. Colson can move to either 3B or 2B depending on his arm.


I think Crochet will have a first half similar to last year's and his value would have gone up, but by how much. Teams seem to love their prospects more than they ever have.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 10:31 am 
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 7:20 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Chet Coppock's Fur Coat wrote:
I heard Jim Callis interviewed this morning about the trade and the prospect return. He thinks that Teel will be a very good defensive catcher who can hit at least 12 HR and maybe up to 20 a year with a solid average.

I think a solid comp is Matt Wieters, who underperformed expectations as a top draft choice. When his OPS+ was in the 90s, he was a 1.5-2 WAR starter. The couple of years where he had 20 HR power and got his OPS+ closer to 110, he was a 4-5 WAR guy. Teel will probably be closer to the solid 1.5 WAR guy who has one season where he goes on a tear for 50-60 games and jacks up his stats. That would be a #6/7 hitter on a good team.


then that's a terrible return and heavily dependent on montgomery


Well Montgomery is a first round pick. And the White Sox have done so well with first and second round outfielders...

I would have held out for Marcelo Mayer straight up. Yes he's also a shortstop but he's also ticketed for AAA this year so they can delay his service time start. Colson can move to either 3B or 2B depending on his arm.


I think Crochet will have a first half similar to last year's and his value would have gone up, but by how much. Teams seem to love their prospects more than they ever have.


They do, even when you compare 2024 to 2016/2017. Revenues are dropping and prospects are cheap.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 10:40 pm 
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Classic Bruce Levine predicting if Robert is traded for a Crochet like haul they could be .500 in '26.

Levine also implying it's perfectly acceptable for Jerry's White Sox not to resign their good players after 6 years of control.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2024 11:21 am 
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vitoscotti wrote:
Classic Bruce Levine predicting if Robert is traded for a Crochet like haul they could be .500 in '26.

Levine also implying it's perfectly acceptable for Jerry's White Sox not to resign their good players after 6 years of control.


By most things I have read, they wouldn't get a top 100 prospect for him and would be trading him at significantly reduced value. The main reason to trade him would be to dump his contract.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2024 11:54 am 
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1st win total released for 2025....49.5
Has to be the lowest total in many years.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2024 12:44 pm 
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ShortTimeLurker wrote:
1st win total released for 2025....49.5
Has to be the lowest total in many years.


I wasn't surprised to see that. This team's roster is going to be worse than when it finished last season with Crochet traded and the only moves they are likely to make are for end-of-bench types. Their lineup to start the season shouldn't contain any prospects, but will have easy outs like Lee, Sosa, Baldwin, DeLoach, Vaughn, Vargas, etc. Their best offensive players are Robert and Benintendi who are both question marks.

The rotation is young and full of unknowns...Thorpe, Martin, Cannon, Burke, Nastrini....I'm sure they will add another veteran or two, but, again, these guys would not be more than borderline rotation options for most teams.

If there's any good news, this *should* be the bottom. By mid-season, or before, Montgomery, the catcher's, maybe the IF they acquired from Boston should be in the majors...question marks about them until they prove themselves, but it should be a rough 60 games or so before they start bringing players up.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2024 11:29 pm 
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On BetMGM, the White Sox’s win total line is at 49.5 — the lowest in the league by 11 games. According to SportsOddsHistory.com, it’s the lowest in the recorded history of sports betting, which, thankfully for the White Sox, only goes back to 1990.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 7:28 am 
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They'll win at least 50 games and shock the world.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 8:11 am 
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But Jerry said hiring Getz would be the fastest way to turn it around!

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 8:27 am 
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At this point, I don't know how they win more games than last year. Bullpens are fickle beasts and their pen could be better just by virtue of the fact that the calendar will read "2025" instead of "2024." However, their starting pitching is demonstrably worse and they've done nothing, and are not likely to do anything, that will improve their hitting and defense.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 9:03 am 
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Warren Newson wrote:
At this point, I don't know how they win more games than last year. Bullpens are fickle beasts and their pen could be better just by virtue of the fact that the calendar will read "2025" instead of "2024." However, their starting pitching is demonstrably worse and they've done nothing, and are not likely to do anything, that will improve their hitting and defense.

Not getting swept 4 and 5 and 6 times in a row will get you 5 more wins. It's the other 4 wins you have to come up with to get to 50.

50 isn't a big ask. I think you bet the over just on general randomness baseball principle. What if they hit for a month? What if they field for a month? What if they pitch for a month? Boom, steak dinner, you got the other 4 wins.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 9:14 am 
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Nardi wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
At this point, I don't know how they win more games than last year. Bullpens are fickle beasts and their pen could be better just by virtue of the fact that the calendar will read "2025" instead of "2024." However, their starting pitching is demonstrably worse and they've done nothing, and are not likely to do anything, that will improve their hitting and defense.

Not getting swept 4 and 5 and 6 times in a row will get you 5 more wins. It's the other 4 wins you have to come up with to get to 50.

50 isn't a big ask. I think you bet the over just on general randomness baseball principle. What if they hit for a month? What if they field for a month? What if they pitch for a month? Boom, steak dinner, you got the other 4 wins.


Agree…I’d pound the over just based on the randomness.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 9:36 am 
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I'm not pounding it. But I am getting in on it.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 10:20 am 
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In '25 110-120+ losses, tiny attendance, John Schriffen & Stone heap praising, low payrolll, f-y Jerry chants, fleeced in trades.

It'll be fun!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2024 10:57 am 
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I'm still not as high on this farm system as others. To me, it's much improved (obviously), but top heavy and only in certain positions. There's this new excitement about having 2 highly ranked catchers - I assume that means they rotate them between C, 1B, DH, maybe OF (I think Teel has played out there), but Montgomery still has more questions than he did a year ago on if he's a long-term answer at SS. They have the OF from Boston now as a legitimate prospect...but I think they are still another 2-3 prospects away on the offensive side to feeling better about the depth. Is their 1st round pick from 2 years ago (the SS) a legitimate prospect? Vargas after his regression? Ramos could be a guy but is our 3rd baseman now? Some of these guys could work out, but think they are still lacking on infielders/OF's.

Pitching has the 2 top prospects, again, great start. Do we like any of the talent behind them? Iriarte? Grant Taylor is getting some hype...

They are moving on past the Sosa's soon enough it would seem, just think they are another 1-2 good drafts...especially since they don't appear to be, and have no proven track record, of spending on difference makers in free agency. The farm system is much, much better, but you have to keep stacking there.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2025 12:56 pm 
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Some quotes from Red Sox Nation concerning the Crochet trade:

"With the enormous wealth of Prospects that were given up to get Crochet the extension needs to be at least through the 2030 season to hope to break even on the trade."

"The guy Crochet is good, but my goodness they gave up so much. Larry Anderson comes to mind."

It's always interesting to see the other side of these things.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2025/01/ ... talks.html


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2025 1:24 pm 
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I'm semi-excited over the catcher. To solve that key position long term would be fantastic.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2025 10:59 am 
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Warren Newson wrote:
Some quotes from Red Sox Nation concerning the Crochet trade:

"With the enormous wealth of Prospects that were given up to get Crochet the extension needs to be at least through the 2030 season to hope to break even on the trade."

"The guy Crochet is good, but my goodness they gave up so much. Larry Anderson comes to mind."

It's always interesting to see the other side of these things.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2025/01/ ... talks.html


Boston is projecting Crochet as an ace and will probably have to pay him $20-$25M+ at some point in the very near future despite some concerns still about his long-term health and that the White Sox limited him to around 50 pitches an outing for the last two months to preserve his health. One really good season where he was dominant at times....We'll see, but hoping he does well in Boston.

As for the White Sox, I am tired of them trading ace type pitchers (Sale, Cease, now Crochet) vs. keeping elite players around. They talk about having a strong foundation and that's needed, but you also need elite players to win and the White Sox have none. I also understand that they completely ripped this apart to the point that Crochet pitching for them for 3-4 years wasn't going to make a difference in the standings if they weren't going to invest at the MLB level and were rebuilding a bad minior league system. This move potentially allows them to fast track their minor leagues on the offensive side with a highly regarded C, OF and an IF who will be on the team next season. Whether these guys actually pan out is the question, probably 1 does and the other two are either busts or not what they were projected....

We'll see....First half of next season will likely be historically bad once again before we start to see some of these kids.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2025 1:16 pm 
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Ky Bush (No. 12 prospect, acquired from Angels in Giolito+Lopez deal) blew out his elbow first week of spring training

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2025/02/ ... rgery.html


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2025 9:47 pm 
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Reared on the Score wrote:
Ky Bush (No. 12 prospect, acquired from Angels in Giolito+Lopez deal) blew out his elbow first week of spring training

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2025/02/ ... rgery.html


I'm waiting for a similar "out for season" announcement on Drew Thorpe.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2025 1:47 am 
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Joey Gallo, lol.

The GMs may change, but the Sox penchant for signing over-the-hill sluggers stays the same.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2025 6:30 am 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
Joey Gallo, lol.

The GMs may change, but the Sox penchant for signing over-the-hill sluggers stays the same.



We all thought it was Kenny, maybe it is Jerry?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2025 6:36 am 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
Joey Gallo, lol.

The GMs may change, but the Sox penchant for signing over-the-hill sluggers stays the same.

Did you say Joey Gallo? With a G? Joey Gallo is dead.

They signed Joey Callo. C-a-l-l-o.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2025 4:40 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Joey Gallo, lol.

The GMs may change, but the Sox penchant for signing over-the-hill sluggers stays the same.

Did you say Joey Gallo? With a G? Joey Gallo is dead.

They signed Joey Callo. C-a-l-l-o.

:lol:

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