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Terry's Peeps
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:05 pm 
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tommy wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
Hatchetman wrote:
No GM could succeed with this crappy ownership.
Define succeed.

I am not a Kenny Williams ALS'er, but in his twelve year tenure the Sox were 80+ games over .500 and won a World Series title. Only one other playoff appearance outside of that is not very good, but what has there been four teams that have won more than one title in the past 25 years?


Yes Kenny's last few years soured many but he was a successful GM. And Ron Schueler before Kenny wasn't bad either.

But not a sustained history of getting to the playoffs. That's what galls me.


I know. Me too.

Frank Coztansa wrote:
I would rather two playoffs with one being a World Championship over the course of 10-12 years, then 5 or 6 playoff appearances with nothing to show for it like the Twins of the 00's.


I know. Me too.

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:07 pm 
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It would be nice to have both, like hopefully 2019/20 thru 2025 will be.

I'll take a Championship over pretty much everything else.

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:15 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
5 playoff appearances in 37 years is an embarrassment. how many worse?
Yeah, that is not very good.

One GM has 40% of those appearances and a World Series title with an overall W-L record that is pretty good.

So again, define succeed.

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Hatchetman
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:16 pm 
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I'll take two championships and 9 playoff appearances over the same timeframe.

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
I'll take two championships and 9 playoff appearances over the same timeframe.
Are you talking ownership or GM?

You said that "No" GM could succeed with this ownership group. I pointed out that Kenny Williams had, at the very least, some success.

Now you are talking 30+ years of the same ownership group. Pick a lane.

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Hatchetman
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:19 pm 
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KW has been in charge of baseball operations for like the last 20 years.

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:21 pm 
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He actually hasn't. He was GM for a while.

Again, pick a lane.

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Terry's Peeps
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:25 pm 
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Nah Hatchet is right.

He was named GM in 2000 and got kicked up to President of Baseball Operations (where he still oversees everything) in 2013.

That's nearly 20 years of being in charge.

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:41 pm 
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Kenny's first year as GM was 2001. Since then, there have been three teams have 2 World Series titles; Red Sox, Cardinals, & the Giants are the only one with 3.
(Of the major sports, there have only been a handful of teams in each league that have repeat titles as well)

The Yankees have 12 playoff appearances since 2001. The Twins are second with seven appearances.

So while I want the Sox to be better, Hatchetman seems to define success as nothing short of the Yankees of the 40s-50s. That just isn't going to happen in today's sports.

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Terry's Peeps
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:45 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Kenny's first year as GM was 2001. Since then, there have been three teams have 2 World Series titles; Red Sox, Cardinals, & the Giants are the only one with 3.
(Of the major sports, there have only been a handful of teams in each league that have repeat titles as well)

The Yankees have 12 playoff appearances since 2001. The Twins are second with seven appearances.

So while I want the Sox to be better, Hatchetman seems to define success as nothing short of the Yankees of the 40s-50s. That just isn't going to happen in today's sports.


I get that.

I just meant the Kenny has been in charge for nearly 20 years part is correct.

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Hatchetman
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:48 pm 
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That is idiotic. Since 2001 the Sox have won 90 games twice. BAD

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Frank Coztansa
 Post subject: Re: Carlos Rodon
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 4:07 pm 
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Hatchetman wrote:
That is idiotic. Since 2001 the Sox have won 90 games twice. BAD
And?

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