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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 11:33 am 
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Nardi wrote:
I'm told Ishbia has offices in Nashville and graduated from Vandy.

Also: owns part of all of the Nashville soccer team.

Counterpart: he lives in a public park in Winnetka.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 11:54 am 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
Nardi wrote:
I'm told Ishbia has offices in Nashville and graduated from Vandy.

Also: owns part of all of the Nashville soccer team.

Counterpart: he lives in a public park in Winnetka.

Wasting money on a house is peanuts compared to wasting money on the Chicago White Sox.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 1:58 pm 
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Nardi wrote:
I'm told Ishbia has offices in Nashville and graduated from Vandy.

I'm also told the White Sox draw when they are good. That's wrong. They were good in 2021. You have to go back to 2012 where they drew 2 million. Which isn't hard for upwards of 18 teams. Cincinnati drew 2 million last year. 2006 is like Colorado's normal attendance every year. Radio and TV which was thriving? yikes. 5 people listen in cars and 26 watch on TV.

They are dead. The fandom is dead. JR murdered them over the period of 45 years.
A new stadium? That will work for about 3 or 4 years. Tourists will come but after a while, right back to Wrigleyville.

Leave. Go away. Don't waste money here.

I do agree that JR has suffocated the fan base for last 45 years, but I wouldn't call the White Sox dead. I wouldn't ever expect them to surpass Wrigley Field but the fanbase could be rejuvenated by a complete change in Ownership and operational culture. The fact that the team's projected market value by Forbes is right in the middle of MLB teams at $2 billion tells me there is life remaining in the fan base.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 2:09 pm 
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BigW72 wrote:
Nardi wrote:
I'm told Ishbia has offices in Nashville and graduated from Vandy.

I'm also told the White Sox draw when they are good. That's wrong. They were good in 2021. You have to go back to 2012 where they drew 2 million. Which isn't hard for upwards of 18 teams. Cincinnati drew 2 million last year. 2006 is like Colorado's normal attendance every year. Radio and TV which was thriving? yikes. 5 people listen in cars and 26 watch on TV.

They are dead. The fandom is dead. JR murdered them over the period of 45 years.
A new stadium? That will work for about 3 or 4 years. Tourists will come but after a while, right back to Wrigleyville.

Leave. Go away. Don't waste money here.

I do agree that JR has suffocated the fan base for last 45 years, but I wouldn't call the White Sox dead. I wouldn't ever expect them to surpass Wrigley Field but the fanbase could be rejuvenated by a complete change in Ownership and operational culture. The fact that the team's projected market value by Forbes is right in the middle of MLB teams at $2 billion tells me there is life remaining in the fan base.

I'd advise the board to get that $2b before it's too late.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 2:13 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Even then, JR had some major missteps in overseeing development of Comiskey II.
The biggest misstep was not turning the park around. They wanted to keep the address on Shields, and turning the park around would have prevented that. I'm sure given the way JERRY was connected to Thompson there probably was an easy workaround. Keep everything with the park as is, and flip it around so that its more open in the back lending views to the Lake and the Skyline, and the narrative of the park is almost completely different. With nicer views, suddenly those undesirable steep seats become somewhat of an attraction.

Nardi wrote:
I'm also told the White Sox draw when they are good. That's wrong. They were good in 2021. You have to go back to 2012 where they drew 2 million. Which isn't hard for upwards of 18 teams. Cincinnati drew 2 million last year. 2006 is like Colorado's normal attendance every year. Radio and TV which was thriving? yikes. 5 people listen in cars and 26 watch on TV.
The Reds won 77 games last season and were at .500 as late as August 12th (or about) which at least gives a glimmer of hope to grab a Wild Card. The Sox drew well in 2021. You have to factor in that games in April and May were capped at like 8,000 fans. Masks outdoors and ziptied seats. Remember those days? :lol:
When you look at the Sox history in seasons they do well and the one immediately following, they draw well by Sox standards (being an average of about 22-24K per game). They drew 2 million in 2022 when it was very evident the team had turned lazy and unlikable.

All else aside, 2021 was a fun, well attended season. So was 2008. Same with 2012 until about the final 12 games or so. It would be nice to have more of those more regularly. I am very cautiously optimistic a new owner could provide something like this fairly easily.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 2:25 pm 
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2012 was the last time they drew 2 million.

2 million puts you in 19th place last year. So I would propose 2 million isn't good enough. AND they haven't and will not have done it for 13 years.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 2:30 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
All else aside, 2021 was a fun, well attended season. So was 2008. Same with 2012 until about the final 12 games or so.


2010 was fun. 2 million.
2011, not fun but 2 million fans

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 2:33 pm 
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Nardi wrote:
2012 was the last time they drew 2 million.

2022 Chicago White Sox AL Central 81 81 2nd Tot 2,009,359 Avg 24,807 8th of 15 $167,458,334 Guaranteed Rate Field

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:07 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Nardi wrote:
2012 was the last time they drew 2 million.

2022 Chicago White Sox AL Central 81 81 2nd Tot 2,009,359 Avg 24,807 8th of 15 $167,458,334 Guaranteed Rate Field


got em!
i feel for the sox STH. had to have been hard to hit the payment button for this upcoming season


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:13 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Nardi wrote:
2012 was the last time they drew 2 million.

2022 Chicago White Sox AL Central 81 81 2nd Tot 2,009,359 Avg 24,807 8th of 15 $167,458,334 Guaranteed Rate Field

2022 Chicago White Sox 1,976,344 24,704

Meet you somewhere to settle this.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:18 pm 
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ATTENDANCE FIGHT!! ATTENDANCE FIGHT!!!!

My guy tells me Nardi is going with ESPN and didn’t look at the total game count: Frank went with the tried & true baseball reference and from this observer’s perspective, seems to have the upper hand. Whatever happens, this one’s gonna be good folks. Sit back, relax and strap it down. We might have a 30 pager ahead of us.

Image

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:23 pm 
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Is this the juiced ball cornfield game year?


Last edited by Nardi on Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:23 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Nardi wrote:
2012 was the last time they drew 2 million.

2022 Chicago White Sox AL Central 81 81 2nd Tot 2,009,359 Avg 24,807 8th of 15 $167,458,334 Guaranteed Rate Field

More than double what the Bulls got. Wow!

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:26 pm 
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Nardi wrote:
Is this the juiced ball cornfield game year?

Nobody knows

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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
“We’ll just wait until a bad thing happens to worry about something.”


Hate to tell ya this "Amigo", but that is sort of the essence of how life works.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:32 pm 
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Just as well. I'm not parking on the side of the tollway.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:45 pm 
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my faith in nardi is shaken

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2025 3:51 pm 
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I'm sorry if you feel your faith is shaken. It will pass.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2025 11:08 am 
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Nardi wrote:
Meet you somewhere to settle this.
We can either do this at 711 Coldwell Street or the docks at Millennium Park. No liftgate required.

Brick wrote:
More than double what the Bulls got.
Wins too!

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2025 1:23 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
The biggest misstep was not turning the park around. They wanted to keep the address on Shields, and turning the park around would have prevented that. I'm sure given the way JERRY was connected to Thompson there probably was an easy workaround. Keep everything with the park as is, and flip it around so that its more open in the back lending views to the Lake and the Skyline, and the narrative of the park is almost completely different. With nicer views, suddenly those undesirable steep seats become somewhat of an attraction.


I agree that it would have made the park a lot better to face northeast instead, but that whole "keeping the address" story never made sense to me. I suspect they could have sought special dispensation to say that it's still "on" 35th Street irrespective of where home plate was. I mean, think of all the stadiums and arenas with "1 Championship Drive" vanity addresses. I'd have to see some primary sources to think otherwise, but it feels more like they didn't really care about the scenery facing southeast until everyone yelled at them about all the park's various shortcomings, and then made up some cock-and-bull story about how it was the only way to preserve their 35th Street address.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2025 1:30 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Even then, JR had some major missteps in overseeing development of Comiskey II. His was the last of the 60s-70s style cookie cutter stadiums. The next stadium built after JR was Camden which became the blueprint for a new era of stadiums. Comiskey II was almost immediately obsolete in terms of design AND the architectural firm gave him a retro Camden-like design for Comiskey II that JR rejected.

JRs entire design philosophy was to maximize the number of luxury suites. EVERYTHING else was subservient to the luxury suites. Decades later, several suites were not even built out for lack of interest. Meanwhile, the feature raised the height and slope of the upper deck, which has made them undesirable in good times and unsellable in the (many) bad times.


Pretty clear parallels to New Soldier Field, another stadium that was architecturally out of step from day one and whose purposes was to extract money from the wealthy to the exclusion of almost everything else. Oops, we did it again.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:30 pm 
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The Doctor Of Style wrote:
This Ends in Antioch wrote:
“We’ll just wait until a bad thing happens to worry about something.”


Hate to tell ya this "Amigo", but that is sort of the essence of how life works.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:37 pm 
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Looks like the Sox logo.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:39 pm 
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So they're issuing official hats for Concepts Of A Plan now?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:40 pm 
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“Expansion” team

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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
“We’ll just wait until a bad thing happens to worry about something.”


Hate to tell ya this "Amigo", but that is sort of the essence of how life works.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:04 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
“Expansion” team

It seems like the best way to get an expansion team is to let Jerry use you for leverage.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:17 pm 
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The Giants and Mariners cockteased Tampa Bay after Reinsdorf got them to build the dome, too. It was truly a concerted effort to get them a bad expansion team that no one likes.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:22 pm 
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Oakland and San Antonio on deck.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:30 pm 
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Oakland's done forever. It squeezed in and got squeezed back out. It's like how the NHL will never go back to Hartford.

San Antonio and Austin have basically exurban-sprawled into each other and I'm sure the powers that be are salivating over that. I think San Antonio made a play for the Marlins around 2004 when it looked like Miami wasn't going to get shaken down.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:54 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:

like the look of that

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:59 pm 
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They are going to wear a hat with another hat on top that's sideways?


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