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Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?
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Author:  Caller Bob [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:40 am ]
Post subject:  Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

The numbers sure say so...

Author:  good dolphin [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

no

now shove off you wanker

Author:  badrogue17 [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.

Author:  Caller Bob [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

badrogue17 wrote:
He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.


He is the MVP, but the legitimacy will have an *, just like his Green Card.

Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Sox on the brain!

Author:  Caller Bob [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Frank Coztansa wrote:
Sox on the brain!

Symptom of COVID

Author:  Brick [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

I'd rather be the worst MVP than everyone else who lost to the worst MVP in that season.

Author:  Bagels [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Brick wrote:
I'd rather be the worst MVP than everyone else who lost to the worst MVP in that season.

:lol:

Author:  Juiced [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

badrogue17 wrote:
He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.


Probably doesn't keep it up for a full season but it wasn't a full season. It was a 60 game season that we was the MVP.

Not much to argue about.

Author:  Regular Reader [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Juiced wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.


Probably doesn't keep it up for a full season but it wasn't a full season. It was a 60 game season that we was the MVP.

Not much to argue about.

He's still better than Bryant.

Author:  HawaiiYou [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 8:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

can someone explain why he kept punching himself in the face after he won? Is that some kind of celebration in Cuba?

Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

HawaiiYou wrote:
can someone explain why he kept punching himself in the face after he won?
He read a bunch of your posts.

Author:  Crick Ramp [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Frank Coztansa wrote:
HawaiiYou wrote:
can someone explain why he kept punching himself in the face after he won?
He read a bunch of your posts.

Hahahaga

Author:  Juiced [ Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Regular Reader wrote:
Juiced wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.


Probably doesn't keep it up for a full season but it wasn't a full season. It was a 60 game season that we was the MVP.

Not much to argue about.

He's still better than Bryant.


Which is why he won the MVP. :?

A drunk T.LaRussa hits for a better average then Bryant.

Author:  good dolphin [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

lead the AL in RBI each of the last two years

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Regular Reader wrote:
Juiced wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
He had a nice 60 games . Good for him.


Probably doesn't keep it up for a full season but it wasn't a full season. It was a 60 game season that we was the MVP.

Not much to argue about.

He's still better than Bryant.

Not in Bryant's MVP and World Series Champion season though.

Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

Author:  tommy [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

:lol:

Damn, soldier. Way to put down the insurrection.
rogers park bryan wrote:
If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

I love ya, RPB, but I dunno about this argument of yours.

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

tommy wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

:lol:

Damn, soldier. Way to put down the insurrection.
rogers park bryan wrote:
If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

I love ya, RPB, but I dunno about this argument of yours.

I love you too. What I wrote is accurate and apt.

But Im a big Abreu fan so congrats to him. Good guy, probably buys drinks.

Author:  Brick [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

rogers park bryan wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

WAR is a flawed statistic. You seem to see it now.

Author:  good dolphin [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

This is the asterisk season and yes, 2020 MVP are inferior to any other season. He had a great season within that context.

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Brick wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

WAR is a flawed statistic. You seem to see it now.

All statistics are flawed if they are applied incorrectly.

Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Except for vote totals!!!!!

Author:  Hawg Ass [ Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

rogers park bryan wrote:
tommy wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

:lol:

Damn, soldier. Way to put down the insurrection.
rogers park bryan wrote:
If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

I love ya, RPB, but I dunno about this argument of yours.

I love you too. What I wrote is accurate and apt.

But Im a big Abreu fan so congrats to him. Good guy, probably buys drinks.


Now has the right manager.

Author:  Brick [ Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

rogers park bryan wrote:
Brick wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
60 games in 2016
Bryant 2.73 WAR

60 games in 2020
Abreu 2.8 WAR

If replacement levels were always the same year to year and position to position you'd have a point. And if the physical toll and evening out of 60 games was the same as 162.

But alas....

WAR is a flawed statistic. You seem to see it now.

All statistics are flawed if they are applied incorrectly.
It was designed to compare different positions and different years. What's the point of the baseline of "replacement player" if you can't compare them if they aren't in a different year or a different position in any year. You are saying that WAR is simply a ranking of a person at the position they play in that year. Nothing carries over to any other position or year. Using WAR, you can only figure out who is the better player compared to the players who play that position during the same year.

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

Brick wrote:
]It was designed to compare different positions and different years.

It was not

Brick wrote:
What's the point of the baseline of "replacement player" if you can't compare them if they aren't in a different year or a different position in any year. You are saying that WAR is simply a ranking of a person at the position they play in that year. Nothing carries over to any other position or year. Using WAR, you can only figure out who is the better player compared to the players who play that position during the same year.

You can use it across years, it's just not a perfect comparison. 2.8 as a LF in one year is not necessarily better than 2.7 as a SS 3 years later

But if a guy is consistently putting up 3+ WAR, hes a good player. It can be used as a comparison just not the way you want to use it.

Author:  Brick [ Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

rogers park bryan wrote:
It was not
It was certainly designed for different positions.
http://m.mlb.com/glossary/advanced-stats/wins-above-replacement
Quote:
Why it's useful
WAR quantifies each player's value in terms of a specific numbers of wins. And because WAR factors in a positional adjustment, it is well suited for comparing players who man different defensive positions.


The same logic would apply across different seasons especially in regards to it being pretty close in terms of years compared.

rogers park bryan wrote:
You can use it across years, it's just not a perfect comparison. 2.8 as a LF in one year is not necessarily better than 2.7 as a SS 3 years later

But if a guy is consistently putting up 3+ WAR, hes a good player. It can be used as a comparison just not the way you want to use it.
My ultimate point is that it is a deeply flawed statistic, and you just keep on adding unwritten rules about when you can and can't use it.

Ultimately though, your argument is that WAR is only good for comparing players that play the same position in the same year.

Author:  rogers park bryan [ Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

No, that's not my argument. My argument is context is necessary just like with any stat.

But I've never said it was perfect or used it like a definitive number so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

It's a fine stat with context just like every other stat.

Author:  Brick [ Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Is Jose Abrue the worst MVP winner since Ryan Howard?

rogers park bryan wrote:
No, that's not my argument. My argument is context is necessary just like with any stat.

But I've never said it was perfect or used it like a definitive number so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

It's a fine stat with context just like every other stat.

You said it can't be used to compare different positions. MLB says that's the whole point of the stat.

I still don't see why you can't compare it year to year though.

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