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Hudson's First Start https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=48904 |
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Author: | deepdish [ Sun Aug 01, 2010 4:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | Hudson's First Start |
Not saying if the trade was good or bad here. But Hudson's stats: 8 innings 3 hits, 1 run, 4 k and 1 walk. Looks like Edwin has something to shoot for. |
Author: | Keyser Soze [ Sun Aug 01, 2010 6:35 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Yeah, a playoff spot. Good for Hudson. |
Author: | good dolphin [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:49 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Everyone always says that you have to wait for things to play out in order to evaluate trades. I, on the other hand, look at it as an evaluation of current values. I cannot see how Hudson's value relative to other pitching prospects is less than Jackson's. Even if Jackson turns things around, I think KW gave up more value than he got...especially because you know that THE BEST you get out of Jackson is 1 1/4 seasons. |
Author: | johnnyfontane [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
good dolphin wrote: Everyone always says that you have to wait for things to play out in order to evaluate trades. I, on the other hand, look at it as an evaluation of current values. I cannot see how Hudson's value relative to other pitching prospects is less than Jackson's. Even if Jackson turns things around, I think KW gave up more value than he got...especially because you know that THE BEST you get out of Jackson is 1 1/4 seasons. I don't know if you can take The Club seriously, especially since it's just a series of edited clips, but it was pretty clear that Kenny considered EJ an upgrade over Hudson. Why, I'm not sure. Hudson was shaky in his first few starts, sure, but wasn't this kid supposed to be really good? Did three big league starts change Kenny's mind? How tightly have the Red Sox hung onto Clay Buchholz and now it's paying off for them? I also saw Kenny in The Club last night say that he DID NOT offer Washington EJ for Dunn. So that mean EJ is Kenny's guy, for sure, not trade bait. Puzzling. I'd rather hang on to the young pitcher. |
Author: | WittyMoniker2 [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 5:19 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
johnnyfontane wrote: good dolphin wrote: Everyone always says that you have to wait for things to play out in order to evaluate trades. I, on the other hand, look at it as an evaluation of current values. I cannot see how Hudson's value relative to other pitching prospects is less than Jackson's. Even if Jackson turns things around, I think KW gave up more value than he got...especially because you know that THE BEST you get out of Jackson is 1 1/4 seasons. I don't know if you can take The Club seriously, especially since it's just a series of edited clips, but it was pretty clear that Kenny considered EJ an upgrade over Hudson. Why, I'm not sure. Hudson was shaky in his first few starts, sure, but wasn't this kid supposed to be really good? Did three big league starts change Kenny's mind? How tightly have the Red Sox hung onto Clay Buchholz and now it's paying off for them? I also saw Kenny in The Club last night say that he DID NOT offer Washington EJ for Dunn. So that mean EJ is Kenny's guy, for sure, not trade bait. Puzzling. I'd rather hang on to the young pitcher. Isn't EJ only 26? I believe Hudson is 23, not much of a difference in my view. Yeah, I wanted to see Hudson's potential as a member of the Sox, but if Jackson can pitch as well as he did against the Tiger, then I'm definitely OK with that. Also, possibly for next year, Jackson might have more trade value than Hudson. There's a part of me that would love to see for next year: Peavy (big ?), Dank, Floyd, Sale and Buerhle. Or keep Jackson and trade Buerhle for some prospects. Or is that blasphemy on my part? |
Author: | Rod [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 5:24 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
johnnyfontane wrote: good dolphin wrote: Everyone always says that you have to wait for things to play out in order to evaluate trades. I, on the other hand, look at it as an evaluation of current values. I cannot see how Hudson's value relative to other pitching prospects is less than Jackson's. Even if Jackson turns things around, I think KW gave up more value than he got...especially because you know that THE BEST you get out of Jackson is 1 1/4 seasons. I don't know if you can take The Club seriously, especially since it's just a series of edited clips, but it was pretty clear that Kenny considered EJ an upgrade over Hudson. Why, I'm not sure. Hudson was shaky in his first few starts, sure, but wasn't this kid supposed to be really good? Did three big league starts change Kenny's mind? How tightly have the Red Sox hung onto Clay Buchholz and now it's paying off for them? I also saw Kenny in The Club last night say that he DID NOT offer Washington EJ for Dunn. So that mean EJ is Kenny's guy, for sure, not trade bait. Puzzling. I'd rather hang on to the young pitcher. If you believe Cowley's Twitter feed the Sox never considered Hudson to project as more than a fifth starter and more likely as a middle reliever. |
Author: | johnnyfontane [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 6:09 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: johnnyfontane wrote: good dolphin wrote: Everyone always says that you have to wait for things to play out in order to evaluate trades. I, on the other hand, look at it as an evaluation of current values. I cannot see how Hudson's value relative to other pitching prospects is less than Jackson's. Even if Jackson turns things around, I think KW gave up more value than he got...especially because you know that THE BEST you get out of Jackson is 1 1/4 seasons. I don't know if you can take The Club seriously, especially since it's just a series of edited clips, but it was pretty clear that Kenny considered EJ an upgrade over Hudson. Why, I'm not sure. Hudson was shaky in his first few starts, sure, but wasn't this kid supposed to be really good? Did three big league starts change Kenny's mind? How tightly have the Red Sox hung onto Clay Buchholz and now it's paying off for them? I also saw Kenny in The Club last night say that he DID NOT offer Washington EJ for Dunn. So that mean EJ is Kenny's guy, for sure, not trade bait. Puzzling. I'd rather hang on to the young pitcher. If you believe Cowley's Twitter feed the Sox never considered Hudson to project as more than a fifth starter and more likely as a middle reliever. Well if that's the case the trade makes sense. |
Author: | Rod [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 6:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
johnnyfontane wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: If you believe Cowley's Twitter feed the Sox never considered Hudson to project as more than a fifth starter and more likely as a middle reliever. Well then the trade makes sense. I'm not saying that's true, but Cowley tweeted it and used that nugget to tweak Phil Rogers who had written about what a bad trade it was. Rogers actually compared Hudson to Jered Weaver which is pretty ridiculous in my mind. |
Author: | OldSchoolScoreFan [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Would not be shocked if Jackson signed a short extension and either Floyd or Danks were traded in the offseason. Going forward, they may not be able to keep them both long-term. |
Author: | good dolphin [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:34 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
OldSchoolScoreFan wrote: Would not be shocked if Jackson signed a short extension and either Floyd or Danks were traded in the offseason. Going forward, they may not be able to keep them both long-term. Boras. Jackson is here a MAXIMUM of 1.3 years...at over 8 per year. |
Author: | good dolphin [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:36 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: johnnyfontane wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: If you believe Cowley's Twitter feed the Sox never considered Hudson to project as more than a fifth starter and more likely as a middle reliever. Well then the trade makes sense. I'm not saying that's true, but Cowley tweeted it and used that nugget to tweak Phil Rogers who had written about what a bad trade it was. Rogers actually compared Hudson to Jered Weaver which is pretty ridiculous in my mind. That's utter horseshit. They moved him up 4 levels in one year. If you do that to a person you project as a middle reliever or 5th starter, you have serious organizational problems. See, I'm not that smart or that connected and even I could punch holes in that bullshit logic. Shouldn't an unbiased beat reporter be able to do the same. |
Author: | Keyser Soze [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:40 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
I think they said he's a 5th starter or middle reliever NOW. He'll be a middle guy on a good team. Again, they just didn't trust him in a pennant race. |
Author: | johnnyfontane [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:41 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Well, regardless, Kenny obviously thought EJ gave them the best chance to win this year, so he pulled the trigger. Did he mortgage the future? Maybe, but as somebody said, Hudson is only 3 years younger than EJ. And I gotta admire that, btw. The Club has really given me a new perspective on Kenny and Ozzie. I like them both much more now that I have seen what they're all about. Kenny wants to win, and he pushes the envelope every year. I like that. |
Author: | good dolphin [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:46 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
So Jackson gets you past the Yankees? I know of guys who bet big amounts all the time and lose. I don't admire them. |
Author: | Rod [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:06 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Keyser Soze wrote: I think they said he's a 5th starter or middle reliever NOW. He'll be a middle guy on a good team. Again, they just didn't trust him in a pennant race. Nope. Supposedly at best. http://twitter.com/cst_sox "By the way, privately Sox felt that Hudson was a future No. 5 starter/middle reliever at best. Sorry Phillip, do some work." |
Author: | Rod [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:08 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
good dolphin wrote: That's utter horseshit. They moved him up 4 levels in one year. If you do that to a person you project as a middle reliever or 5th starter, you have serious organizational problems. Or you have nothing else. Or you're playing the hell out of your hand and moving him along for a lot more than he's worth. You have to admit Kenny's been pretty good at doing exactly that. |
Author: | RFDC [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:11 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Keyser and gd talking Sox is always fun. Oh and JORR STFU! |
Author: | Rod [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Oh and RFDC, Go Fuck Yourself. TWICE. |
Author: | johnnyfontane [ Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:47 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
good dolphin wrote: So Jackson gets you past the Yankees? I know of guys who bet big amounts all the time and lose. I don't admire them. Name the rotation that gets you past the Yankees. Tell your guys to bet on the Yankees. Big. |
Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
johnnyfontane wrote: good dolphin wrote: So Jackson gets you past the Yankees? I know of guys who bet big amounts all the time and lose. I don't admire them. Name the rotation that gets you past the Yankees. Tell your guys to bet on the Yankees. Big. I kind of like the Rangers and the Braves, but not necessarily just because of the rotations. The point is, despite what he might think, this is not a world series caliber team and the addition of Jackson makes them only incrementally better. There was not reason to mortgage the future (I know it's an overstatement) for Jackson. There is a strong chance that he would not even start should they reach the world series. I just see no way that this move is a win, and you can be damned sure KW will be saying his "cannot spend a dollar when you have 50 cents" this offseason as Jackson is due his 8 million. |
Author: | johnnyfontane [ Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:57 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
good dolphin wrote: johnnyfontane wrote: good dolphin wrote: So Jackson gets you past the Yankees? I know of guys who bet big amounts all the time and lose. I don't admire them. Name the rotation that gets you past the Yankees. Tell your guys to bet on the Yankees. Big. I kind of like the Rangers and the Braves, but not necessarily just because of the rotations. The point is, despite what he might think, this is not a world series caliber team and the addition of Jackson makes them only incrementally better. There was not reason to mortgage the future (I know it's an overstatement) for Jackson. There is a strong chance that he would not even start should they reach the world series. I just see no way that this move is a win, and you can be damned sure KW will be saying his "cannot spend a dollar when you have 50 cents" this offseason as Jackson is due his 8 million. It really all goes back to what they thought of Hudson. I was under the impression that he was a stud prospect, but that may not have been the case. |
Author: | Rod [ Tue Aug 10, 2010 11:21 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
johnnyfontane wrote: It really all goes back to what they thought of Hudson. I was under the impression that he was a stud prospect, but that may not have been the case. Well, Cowley insists they didn't think much, but he sure has looked like a stud in his first two out for Arizona. |
Author: | Aggravated Sox Fan Bob [ Tue Aug 10, 2010 11:45 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
The Sox haven't had a STUD PROSPECT pitcher in 20 years. |
Author: | OldSchoolScoreFan [ Tue Aug 10, 2010 1:48 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Hudson's First Start |
Aggravated Sox Fan Bob wrote: The Sox haven't had a STUD PROSPECT pitcher in 20 years. Yes they have... Scott Ruffcorn Rodney Bolton James Baldwin Lance Broadway Brandon McCarthy |
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