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| Trade Chris Sale https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=80496 |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Trade Chris Sale |
are people out of their fucking minds? Give me the #1 prospect in baseball for Sale. Assume that he maxes out on his potential. That guy is still not as good as Sale. This is the best Sox pitcher in my lifetime who still has lots of potential for improvement and is on a favorable contract for another six or so years. I suppose you could offer me that #1 prospect, plus an MLB ready top pitching prospect plus another MLB ready prospect and I might think about it. That offer isn't happening, so the whole discussion is nonsensical. The Rays got a kings ransom for James Shields. Sale is worth about 50% more than Shields because of a combination of age, talent and contract. |
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| Author: | Northside_Dan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
If a GM offers something similar to the package you speculated on, I'd likely take the deal or Chris Sale will become White Sox speak for Felix Hernandez. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
This team is going nowhere for the foreseeable future. Trade him if you can get a REAL NICE package. |
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| Author: | Peoria Matt [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
No harm in seeing what the offers are. |
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| Author: | Northside_Dan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Hatchetman wrote: This team is going nowhere for the foreseeable future. Trade him if you can get a REAL NICE package. By cracky |
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| Author: | Peoria Matt [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Hatchetman wrote: REAL NICE package. over by dere....... |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Northside_Dan wrote: If a GM offers something similar to the package you speculated on, I'd likely take the deal or Chris Sale will become White Sox speak for Felix Hernandez. But who is doing that? That is an "offer he can't refuse" type of trade. The speculation I hear begins with the idea to trade him and find the best offer like this is some guy who won't sign on the last year of a deal. |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Hatchetman wrote: This team is going nowhere for the foreseeable future. Trade him if you can get a REAL NICE package. You have him for six more years. Fortunes change in the blink of an eye in this league. |
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| Author: | Frank Coztansa [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
He's 6-8. No room for a losing pitcher on this club! |
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| Author: | Kirkwood [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
I don't think the Sox can get a team to pay what Sale is actually worth. I may have recency bias but I don't think ace trades have really worked out other than Greinke. Twins - Santana Blue Jays - Halladay Indians - Lee Indians - Sabathia Mariners - Lee All those teams got fucked. And with teams are so overprotective with prospect nowadays. The Sox won't get equal value. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
good dolphin wrote: You have him for six more years. Fortunes change in the blink of an eye in this league. Not really when you have zero talent. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
good dolphin wrote: are people out of their fucking minds? Give me the #1 prospect in baseball for Sale. Assume that he maxes out on his potential. That guy is still not as good as Sale. What? You think the best prospect in baseball maxing out their potential is not as good as Sale? Is that a joke or a hyperbole? Cause if it's not, you're crazy. |
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| Author: | Northside_Dan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
good dolphin wrote: Hatchetman wrote: This team is going nowhere for the foreseeable future. Trade him if you can get a REAL NICE package. You have him for six more years. Fortunes change in the blink of an eye in this league. That's kind of the problem, they usually don't. It's generally a 2-3 year process. The Orioles last year being the most recent exception, but in the past 25 years, only 12 teams have improved by 20 games from one season to the next. I agree that Sale is on an extremely friendly contract, but if you can flip 1 GREAT player to 3-4 very good players, I think you have to do it. Also don't think a GM would pay what I'd want, but if it were to happen you have to do it. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Northside_Dan wrote: The Orioles last year being the most recent exception, but in the past 25 years, only 12 teams have improved by 20 games from one season to the next. Hey, nice stat. Where'd you get that? That is 1.6% of teams. |
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| Author: | Northside_Dan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Hatchetman wrote: Northside_Dan wrote: The Orioles last year being the most recent exception, but in the past 25 years, only 12 teams have improved by 20 games from one season to the next. Hey, nice stat. Where'd you get that? That is 1.6% of teams. http://www.pressboxonline.com/story/102 ... ound-Years Assuming it's true, apologize if it's not. Enjoy the fact that the Cubs are two of the 12 examples 
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| Author: | Bucky Chris [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Cliff Lippert @Cliffy46405 29m Ken Rosenthal just speculated that another name pitcher BIGGER than Garza might get moved. Just said this on WEEI. Floated Chris Sale name |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Well even if half the sample can't really improve by 20 games (if you already won 90, you're not going to win 110.) Even if the true probability is 5%, that is still pretty slim. |
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| Author: | Rod [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:00 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Frank Coztansa wrote: He's 6-8. No room for a losing pitcher on this club! There's a good reason why Frank is a breakfast scout and not a baseball scout. |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Northside_Dan wrote: good dolphin wrote: Hatchetman wrote: This team is going nowhere for the foreseeable future. Trade him if you can get a REAL NICE package. You have him for six more years. Fortunes change in the blink of an eye in this league. That's kind of the problem, they usually don't. It's generally a 2-3 year process. The Orioles last year being the most recent exception, but in the past 25 years, only 12 teams have improved by 20 games from one season to the next. I agree that Sale is on an extremely friendly contract, but if you can flip 1 GREAT player to 3-4 very good players, I think you have to do it. Also don't think a GM would pay what I'd want, but if it were to happen you have to do it. but we are not talking about 2-3 years. The Sox have him through 2019...the year Joe Sheahan thinks the Cubs will be in the world series, just to put the shifting of fortunes into perspective. |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
rogers park bryan wrote: good dolphin wrote: are people out of their fucking minds? Give me the #1 prospect in baseball for Sale. Assume that he maxes out on his potential. That guy is still not as good as Sale. What? You think the best prospect in baseball maxing out their potential is not as good as Sale? Is that a joke or a hyperbole? Cause if it's not, you're crazy. Apparently the Royals don't think I am crazy as they traded the #1 prospect + for James Shields, who is older, is paid more, is currently not as good and has nowhere near the potential to get better. Profar is currently the #1 prospect, if I am to believe Sir. Who is his comparable in MLB. Is that better than what Sale is? Is that player better than what Sale projects to be? |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
good dolphin wrote: rogers park bryan wrote: good dolphin wrote: are people out of their fucking minds? Give me the #1 prospect in baseball for Sale. Assume that he maxes out on his potential. That guy is still not as good as Sale. What? You think the best prospect in baseball maxing out their potential is not as good as Sale? Is that a joke or a hyperbole? Cause if it's not, you're crazy. Apparently the Royals don't think I am crazy as they traded the #1 prospect + for James Shields, who is older, is paid more, is currently not as good and has nowhere near the potential to get better. Profar is currently the #1 prospect, if I am to believe Sir. Who is his comparable in MLB. Is that better than what Sale is? Is that player better than what Sale projects to be? The key phrase is "assume he maxes out his potential" The top prospect in baseball potential maxed out is usually hall of fame. Its semantics, but I just find the phrasing odd |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
rogers park bryan wrote: good dolphin wrote: rogers park bryan wrote: good dolphin wrote: are people out of their fucking minds? Give me the #1 prospect in baseball for Sale. Assume that he maxes out on his potential. That guy is still not as good as Sale. What? You think the best prospect in baseball maxing out their potential is not as good as Sale? Is that a joke or a hyperbole? Cause if it's not, you're crazy. Apparently the Royals don't think I am crazy as they traded the #1 prospect + for James Shields, who is older, is paid more, is currently not as good and has nowhere near the potential to get better. Profar is currently the #1 prospect, if I am to believe Sir. Who is his comparable in MLB. Is that better than what Sale is? Is that player better than what Sale projects to be? The key phrase is "assume he maxes out his potential" The top prospect in baseball potential maxed out is usually hall of fame. Its semantics, but I just find the phrasing odd Who is he if he maxes out? What do the scouting reports say is his comparable? Is that guy better than Sale? More importantly is that guy better than who Sale might be? If you say he is Miguel Cabrerra, that would certainly give me pause. If he is (just for arguments sake as he was also a top prospect at one point) Konerko, I'd never make the move. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Profar maxed out will be Roberto Alomar or Alex Rodriguez Konerko was probably seen as maxing out at Pujols |
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| Author: | Keyser Soze [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 9:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
An ace is the hardest thing to find in baseball and the Sox have one in Sale. They have four starting pitchers under the age of 30 two of which are under the age of 25. They also have Erik Johnson and Andre Rienzo in Triple A and plenty of bullpen arms in the system. Peavy is also under contract for next season. The Sox have about $25M comig off the books in Floyd, Konerko, Thornton and Crain. Upgrades to centerfield and shortstop and this team can be right back in contention next season. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
For the record, I think it would be crazy to trade Sale (unless there is some unknown medical issue) |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
rogers park bryan wrote: For the record, I think it would be crazy to trade Sale (unless there is some unknown medical issue) motherfuck...I just got Ricked! |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
rogers park bryan wrote: Profar maxed out will be Roberto Alomar or Alex Rodriguez Konerko was probably seen as maxing out at Pujols I wouldn't trade Sale for Alomar. Who did Alomar get traded for early in his career? |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Agree, no reason to trade Sale unless you think he's too injury prone to last until the Sox are good again. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Keyser hitting the crack pipe early this morning. The Sox need upgrades at virtually EVERY position on the diamond. 2014: C: Phegley, could be an average C.....hopefully. 1B: Dunn? otherwise they have nothing. Will have to sign a scrap heap guy or Konerko. BAD. 2B: Beckham, likely a below average hitter no matter what. .330 average and .350 OBP? C'mon. SS: Cancer stick. Dude makes $10mildo, not going anywhere 3B: Gillaspie. dude is replacement level at best. looks like a little leaguer out there. LF: Viciedo. One of the worst hitters in the league combined with bad defense. CF: DeAza. very average, hopefully someone desperate will take him RF: ?? Hopefully not Rios and his $12MM salary. Need a FA signing. OOOPS, there aren't any good FA this offseason DH: Keppinger. The single worst hitter in the majors. |
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| Author: | Frank Coztansa [ Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Trade Chris Sale |
Northside_Dan wrote: but in the past 25 years, only 12 teams have improved by 20 games from one season to the next. You don't need to improve by 20 wins to make the playoffs, especially now with the play in wild card.2007 Cubs improved by 19 games and went from worst to first in their division. 2008 White Sox improved by 17 games and went from 4th to first in their division. |
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