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Kobe demands to be traded
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Author:  Bagels [ Wed May 30, 2007 1:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Kobe demands to be traded
Great investigative work by Screamin' A... :roll:

I say he gets what he deserves. He could have signed with the Bulls or Clippers who were both in much better position as far as supporting casts. Plus his gigantic contract makes him pretty much impossible to trade. I guess he does have an opt out clause in a few years
Author:  MUScholar21 [ Wed May 30, 2007 1:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Not going to happen. He just wants someone on his team to be able to knock down an open shot.


Please. Its hard for others to knock down open shots when you are taking more than 25% of your team's shots - they aren't getting the ball when he takes more than double the amount of shots the next person on the team took. Also, he ranks 7th out of 14 on his TEAM in Field Goal Percentage, where 5 of the 6 guys ahead of him had over 200 attempts this season; that means he isn't taking many open shots either. He attempted 1757 fields goals this season, which was first in the league by more than 100 shots. Kobe can't EVER complain his fellow players don't make open shots, because they never get them.
Author:  KDdidit [ Wed May 30, 2007 2:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I was Kobe and was surrounded by the stiffs the Lakers have I'd shoot too. The best chance they have every night of winning is with him scoring 50, not him passing to Smush Parker and Kwame Brown.
Author:  Mac Sucks [ Wed May 30, 2007 2:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Kobe is making between 20 and 25 mil a year the next 3 years I believe. You will have to match the money and talent, the Bulls have both. Heinrich is signed to a big deal and you can re-up Deng for a ton of dough. Trade both of them, the 9th pick and either Noccioni or Duhon. Bulls could then move Gordon to PG, Kobe at SG, Rashard lewis the Bulls will sign, Tyrus Thomas will start at PF next year with Ben Wallace in the middle. That team can compete for the title. All 4 of those players are better then anybody outside of Kobe on the Lakers.
Author:  Bagels [ Wed May 30, 2007 2:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
How would they be able to sign Rashard Lewis after making that trade?
Author:  Brick [ Wed May 30, 2007 2:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
Mac Sucks wrote:
Kobe is making between 20 and 25 mil a year the next 3 years I believe. You will have to match the money and talent, the Bulls have both. Heinrich is signed to a big deal and you can re-up Deng for a ton of dough. Trade both of them, the 9th pick and either Noccioni or Duhon. Bulls could then move Gordon to PG, Kobe at SG, Rashard lewis the Bulls will sign, Tyrus Thomas will start at PF next year with Ben Wallace in the middle. That team can compete for the title. All 4 of those players are better then anybody outside of Kobe on the Lakers.


Ben Gordon is not going to be effective playing with Kobe.
Author:  Darkside [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
Mac Sucks wrote:
Kobe is making between 20 and 25 mil a year the next 3 years I believe. You will have to match the money and talent, the Bulls have both. Heinrich is signed to a big deal and you can re-up Deng for a ton of dough. Trade both of them, the 9th pick and either Noccioni or Duhon. Bulls could then move Gordon to PG, Kobe at SG, Rashard lewis the Bulls will sign, Tyrus Thomas will start at PF next year with Ben Wallace in the middle. That team can compete for the title. All 4 of those players are better then anybody outside of Kobe on the Lakers.


A very odd coherent post from Mac sucks. Perhaps he thought he was logged in as someone else?
Author:  Tall Midget [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I would love to see him in a Bulls jersey.


...And I would love to see him in some sexy lingerie.
Author:  Darkside [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
Tall Midget wrote:
Quote:
I would love to see him in a Bulls jersey.


...And I would love to see him in some sexy lingerie.


:shock:
Author:  BD [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Nas wrote:
I would love to see him in a Bulls jersey. Keep Kirk and let Ben go


I'm sure the Lakers would NOT jump at taking on a declining Ben Wallace.

Besides, that interview on the Dan Patrick show with kobe, it just sounded like if the Lakers provided him with some tissue, he'd stay. He went from saying he wants to be traded to he'd love to finish his career with the team he loves provided that some things change. He has no leverage, and he'll be on the court for the Lakers.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Kobe is making between 20 and 25 mil a year the next 3 years I believe. You will have to match the money and talent, the Bulls have both. Heinrich is signed to a big deal and you can re-up Deng for a ton of dough. Trade both of them, the 9th pick and either Noccioni or Duhon. Bulls could then move Gordon to PG, Kobe at SG, Rashard lewis the Bulls will sign, Tyrus Thomas will start at PF next year with Ben Wallace in the middle. That team can compete for the title. All 4 of those players are better then anybody outside of Kobe on the Lakers.


None of the things you mentioned are possible with the Bulls’ current financial situation.

To bring in Kobe, you’d likely need the 2 Bens, Gordon & Wallace, and perhaps even the 9 pick (or swapping your 9 with their 19).

Really, any combination of Wallace and one of your young players (those unaffected by BYC and/or PPP), with or without the pick, would make it work contractually.

Whether the Lakers allow themselves to get burned is another question entirely.
Author:  M_C [ Wed May 30, 2007 3:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Heinrich is signed to a big deal and you can re-up Deng for a ton of dough. Trade both of them, the 9th pick


What "regular" poster in this section hates Heinrich?
Author:  schmitty1121 [ Wed May 30, 2007 4:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Paxson needs to make this trade happens. This is as far as this group can go. Its time for him to prove that hes trying to win a championship. Pax has been all talk, time to show us you want it.
Author:  Bulldog Scott [ Wed May 30, 2007 4:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
I don't think they can take on Kobe's contract without using Wallace's. And the only way they could get somebody to take Wallace's contract is if they took a contract on that was worse. I don't think there is a contract in the league that is less valueable than Ben Wallace's.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Wed May 30, 2007 4:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
Nas, what Mitch would or would not accept has nothing to do with the problem at hand, which is that outside of Wallace, we have no way of making the contracts work. At bare minimum, the deal would have to be Big Ben and another player. I threw out Gordon because A) he’s probably who the Lakers would want in return, and B) you’re not going to give Gordon a $50-$60 million dollar extension this summer and then move him back to the bench.
Author:  BD [ Wed May 30, 2007 7:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Spinnin' Bucket wrote:
Nas, what Mitch would or would not accept has nothing to do with the problem at hand, which is that outside of Wallace, we have no way of making the contracts work. At bare minimum, the deal would have to be Big Ben and another player. I threw out Gordon because A) he’s probably who the Lakers would want in return, and B) you’re not going to give Gordon a $50-$60 million dollar extension this summer and then move him back to the bench.


Buckets - I think Bryant has 0% chance of being traded, but if the Bulls got serious about acquiring a big man like Randolph, what are the rules on a sign-and-trade with P.J. Brown involved - Is there some rule against maxing him for 1 year as our own free agent, or can we only give him what we have available under our cap currently ??? Also, if we were willing to move Ben Gordon in a trade, it would have to be after he signs an extension. He's not a free agent, so is there any reason why we couldn't extend his deal as part of a trade ???
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Wed May 30, 2007 8:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
Minimum for S&T is 3 years, though I don't believe you have to guarantee all 3 years. He's probably not going to accept a S&T to Portland, though. Remember, the Bulls don't control his rights. It's entirely up to PJ where he plays next year, if at all (Nocioni is in the same boat). He'll either retire, play 1 more year with us, or play 1 more year with a legitimate contender. But it's very improbable that he'd spend his last year in the NBA with a team that's 4-5 years away from its prime.

Gordon becomes a PPP contract after the extension. His new deal won't help much in terms of being able to take back a large contract. The same goes for Deng. Hinrich & Nocioni will both have BYC contracts, also difficult to move.

$10-$11 mil a year. That's about how much the Bulls can trade for without disrupting the core. This includes a S&T w/ Nocioni, plus the expiring contracts of Duhon & Khryapa.
Author:  mr_gimp [ Wed May 30, 2007 9:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
instead of changing teams, Kobe should first change his tampon!

Talk about loving drama, this whiny little biatch isn't content unless he is the center of attention.

I want him nowhere near Chicago... and neither do any of the female hotel receptionists!
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu May 31, 2007 12:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
something else to consider…

big men under rookie scale contracts (or those that received extensions small enough to be financially obtainable via Duhon and/or Viktor, plus any combination of the #9 outright or trading down in the draft)

BOS – Al Jefferson
NJ - Nenad Krstic
NYK - Channing Frye
CLE - Drew Gooden
IND - Ike Diogu
MIL - Andrew Bogut
ATL - Shelden Williams
CHA - Emeka Okafor
ORL - Dwight Howard
POR - LaMarcus Aldridge
SEA - Nick Collison
SEA - Chris Wilcox
GS - Andris Biedrins
LAL - Andrew Bynum

I’d say that Howard, Okafor, Jefferson, Bogut, Aldridge, Biedrins, and Bynum are all probably out. I doubt you could land any of those players with expiring money and the 9 pick. Players like Krstic, Frye, Gooden, Diogu, Williams, Collison, & Wilcox are more reasonable options. I wouldn’t give the 9 outright for any of those players, but I might seriously consider, for example, trading Viktor and the 9 to New Jersey for Krstic and the 17. The Nets probably would want a bit more (assuming they were willing to part with him at all), but in any case, that’s the type of deal the Bulls are in a position to make. All of this Randolph/Gasol/Garnett stuff is not going to happen. Pax would have already done it when he had 2 large expirings, 2 years in a row. To go out and try to pull off some circus move at this point would be borderline insane.
Author:  _Mac [ Thu May 31, 2007 12:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
instead of changing teams, Kobe should first change his tampon!

Talk about loving drama, this whiny little biatch isn't content unless he is the center of attention. I want him nowhere near Chicago...


Neither do I.
Author:  Tall Midget [ Thu May 31, 2007 12:47 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
All of this Randolph/Gasol/Garnett stuff is not going to happen. Pax would have already done it when he had 2 large expirings, 2 years in a row.


I thought you were arguing a few months ago, around the trading deadline, that the Bulls would have a good shot at Garnett or O'Neal this offseason.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu May 31, 2007 12:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I thought you were arguing a few months ago, around the trading deadline, that the Bulls would have a good shot at Garnett or O'Neal this offseason.


Midge, that was all under the premise that they traded PJ for Kurt Thomas, who's contract was similar in dollars but ran an extra year. I'm sure it occurred to Pax, but I suspect Reinsdorf vetoed it.
Author:  Tall Midget [ Thu May 31, 2007 1:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
OK, I forgot about that. Have you given your selection for the #9 pick yet? Your choice of Aldridge last year looks good, although Thomas wasn't a bad pick.
Author:  Zippy-The-Pinhead [ Thu May 31, 2007 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  O'Neal?
Bucket - Sam Smith has written on a couple of occasions that Jermaine O'Neal would end up in LA (with Kobe). My question is...Who do the Lakers have with any trade value other than (perhaps) Bynum? Don't the Bulls have more bait? :?:
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu May 31, 2007 1:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Have you given your selection for the #9 pick yet?


It’s a little early to call just yet, Midge, but at the moment I’m projecting the most likely candidates as Noah & Hawes. I’ve read in multiple sources that they are very high on Yi, but landing him would require a bit of maneuvering, perhaps more than Pax is comfortable doing.

Speaking of maneuvering, there’s a good chance of some heavy trade activity within the first dozen picks. After Oden & Durant, there are a bunch of players at a variety of positions that are very close in terms of draft value. If you were to look at all 30 teams’ draft boards for the top 10, you’d likely find prospects all over the map once you got past the first 2.

Should be entertaining. Atlanta, at 3, will have a big impact on the rest of the lottery, especially if they pass on Conley. Boston, at 5, is another team to watch closely, as there has been talk of trading the pick. Minnesota could go several different directions with their pick at 7. Etc, etc.

Quote:
Who do the Lakers have with any trade value other than (perhaps) Bynum? Don't the Bulls have more bait?


Zippy, it’s not about value, it’s about contracts. The Lakers have the salaries (primarily Kwame Brown’s expiring contract) to make it happen. The Bulls have virtually no way to make this work. Their biggest expiring contract is just over $3 mil (Chris Duhon).
Author:  good dolphin [ Thu May 31, 2007 1:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
Are there any worthy NBA draft sites out there?
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu May 31, 2007 1:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Two of the better ones are www.draftexpress.com and www.nbadraft.net. Draft Express has a lot of good articles and sends writers on location to watch workouts, etc. NBAdraft.net is usually pretty close on their final projections, though sometimes I find inaccurate info on their site and they have a tendency to be too generous when they make comparisons between prospects and current players.

Outside of that, Hoopshype is quick to update their article links, so I check there sometimes. Though similar to NBAdraft.net, you will occasionally find bad info (ie: salary discrepancies, etc). ESPN has decent coverage, though much of it requires you to be an Insider subscriber.

There are others, too, depending on what type of info you’re looking to find. In the end, you can find just about anything you want via a search through Google News.
Author:  Mustang Rob [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Bucket,
Disect this Bill Simmons proposal please.

Quote:
Deal No. 2: Chicago trades Luol Deng, Ben Gordon, Victor Khryapa and the No. 9 pick for Kobe.

Additional notes: This deal works as long as the Bulls renounce P.J. Brown's rights; also, it means the Lakers would receive a mammoth (and appealing) trade exception in the deal.

Comments: This seems like the most natural home for Kobe -- it's a big city; they're a contender in the East; there's enough talent left after the deal to make a run, and even the MJ-Kobe symmetry works nicely -- as well as the best possible haul for the Lakers. The deal could work in a variety of ways: Instead of renouncing Brown's rights, the Bulls could include Andres Nocioni as a sign-and-trade (starting at around $5 million per) and renounce Mike Sweetney's rights instead of Brown's. If they wanted to get even more creative, they could make it Deng, Gordon, P.J. Brown (sign and trade -- one year, $10 million) and the No. 9 for Kobe. They could try to substitute Ty Thomas and a future No. 1 for Deng. Etc., etc., etc.

Two big obstacles here:

(A) Would the Bulls ever give up Deng? The Lakers would have to get him back in a Kobe deal, right? I feel like he's become slightly overrated over the past season -- he's definitely a potential All-Star; he definitely could become the second-best player on a championship-caliber team, but I don't see him getting much better than he is right now. Do you ever see him scoring 27-28 a game? Do you ever see him being the crunch-time scorer on a great team? If you could land Kobe and keep Kirk Hinrich, Ben Wallace, Ty Thomas, Chris Duhon and Thabo Sefolosha, then sign one more veteran to help them out, that's a potential 2008 title team. Isn't the whole point to win a title?

(B) Would John Paxson ever roll the dice with a mega-deal for someone like Kobe? He seems to be happier stockpiling young assets and waiting for one of these other teams to offer him the likes of KG or Jermaine O'Neal for 30 cents on the dollar. By making a Kobe deal, Paxson would be shoving his chips to the middle of the table ... something he's been completely unwilling to do. We will see.
Author:  Bulldog Scott [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
What is the purpose of renouncing someobody's rights?

Also, I didn't think that his proposal would work because the salaries won't match up.

Simmons also had a 5 way trade in his column today. It doesn't make any sense.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
Simmons isn’t doing his homework here. First of all, you cannot execute a sign & trade with the #9 pick. The draft occurs prior to the start of free agency when you can start re/negotiating contracts. If you want to pair the 9 with a player, it has to be an existing contract and not an expired one. Secondly, Kobe makes roughly $19.5 mil next year. The combination of salaries for Deng, Gordon, & Viktor amount to just over $10 mil. Basically, this means the Bulls would have to be $9.5 under the cap next year. Right now, with 9 players under contract, the Bulls are at about $47 million. This does not include the cap hold for Nocioni or for the 9 pick. The official cap number for the 07-08 season has not yet been released, but unless it jumps dramatically and disproportionally to previous years, renouncing PJ Brown’s rights is not going to get them $9.5 million under the cap.
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