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KC reports Noce has an offer
https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=12944		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:  KC reports Noce has an offer
Quote:
A source said the Bulls' five-year offer starts near $6.3 million to $6.4 million for the first season. Factoring in a 10.5 percent increase of the first season's salary annually, the total package sits at approximately $38.1 million to $38.7 million.

The Bulls could increase that offer and also would have seven days to match any offer sheet Nocioni signed with Memphis. General manager John Paxson has vowed to match any offers for his hyperactive forward.

Per the collective bargaining agreement, the Bulls are allowed to offer Nocioni a six-year contract. Sources said the Grizzlies have yet to tender Nocioni an official offer.

It's unclear whether any oral offers or promises of an offer have been made. Nocioni is believed to be the Grizzlies' No. 1 target. The Grizzlies, however, can offer only an 8 percent increase in their package. Thus, a five-year offer starting at $7 million is worth $40.6 million, a figure the Bulls almost surely would match.

Should the Grizzlies start a five-year package at $8 million, that deal would be worth $46.4 million. That number might give Paxson pause, although nothing on the Grizzlies' roster beyond Pau Gasol interests the Bulls in sign-and-trade scenarios.

And Paxson has vowed not to lose Nocioni for nothing.

There are no indications the Grizzlies will make Gasol available. In fact, contradicting that notion, the Memphis Commercial Appeal reported that Gasol personally recruited Nocioni with a phone call while new Grizzlies general manager Chris Wallace visited Nocioni in Buenos Aires.


If this is true, then this is your team going forward. Luol & Gordon can still be extended with the team remaining under the luxury tax, but the figures above for Noce eliminate any potential cap window after the 2009 season.
Author:  mr_gimp [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:10 am ]
Post subject: 
if the article is true, Noc would be terribly overpaid.
Author:  Mustang Rob [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:32 am ]
Post subject: 
mr_gimp wrote:
if the article is true, Noc would be terribly overpaid.


He would be as a Bull, but the Grizz look at him as a starting SF and that contract is in line with Mehmet Okur's 6yrs $50Mil
Author:  mr_gimp [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:44 am ]
Post subject: 
Well, now I'm reading at RealGM that some Argentinian paper is reporting Memphis has offered a 5X46M to Noc. If that's accurate, I smell a S&T brewing.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:57 am ]
Post subject: 
Read that as well. So far, none of the Chicago/Memphis papers have jumped on board with that story. That's Hinrich's contract essentially (5 for $47.5). I would like to keep Noce, but this is getting excessive. And at the risk of being sacrilegious, this could be the first signing by Pax that outlives his tenure. I hope not.
Author:  Mustang Rob [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:41 am ]
Post subject: 
mr_gimp wrote:
Well, now I'm reading at RealGM that some Argentinian paper is reporting Memphis has offered a 5X46M to Noc. If that's accurate, I smell a S&T brewing.


If they won't move Gasol, who would the " &T " portion involve?
Swift? Future picks?
Do the Bulls really need another 6'9" 230lb guy?
Author:  Hawkeye Vince [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:52 am ]
Post subject: 
Swift's contract is pretty bad being 6M a year until 2010.

I said it before - I'd want Warrick, younger player who showed flashes at the end of last year (I believe he was around 14 ppg and 7 boards a game when he started at the end of the season). He also gets 1.5 M a year and could be signed through 09.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:54 am ]
Post subject: 
If Memphis does this with their available cap space, then matching salaries is not an issue. If they want to sign somebody else, then add Noce on top of that, then salaries have to match.

You’re not getting Gasol for that package, obviously, nor are they sending you Conley or Rudy. Hakim Warrick and/or Kyle Lowry don’t exactly get my juices flowing, but they’d be better than losing him for nothing. I doubt Pax is interested in Mike Miller. I’m certainly not. Getting a (protected) pick from the Grizz is a possibility as well.

But, if Pax finds a decent deal for Duhon this offseason (ie: Duhon plus future pick(s) for Scola plus an expiring - to match salaries), bringing Lowry back from Memphis wouldn’t be a bad idea, since we wouldn’t have a single true PG on the roster (Hinrich, Gordon, JamesOn – all combo guards).

We’ll see. I’m still waiting on official confirmations – for both of these rumors.
Author:  mr_gimp [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:56 am ]
Post subject: 
maybe a three-way? a player or two to ship to Orlando for Darko? Don't they still own his BYC?
Author:  Mustang Rob [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
How do the Grizz benefit from a S&T?
If the S&T is for Noce's 5yr/$46mil, wouldn't they have to match that contract with something that adds up to $9/per?

Edit:
Never mind, Bucket's on top of that.
Thanks.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Swift's contract is pretty bad being 6M a year until 2010.


Swift expires after the '08 season.

Quote:
a player or two to ship to Orlando for Darko?


Orlando renounced Darko, had to in order to make space to sign Rashard.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
wouldn't they have to match that contract with something that adds up to $9/per?


They're under the cap. The Bulls are not. We can take back 125% + $100K of what we send out. Anything less than that would be fine.
Author:  Hawkeye Vince [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
Spinnin' Bucket wrote:
Quote:
Swift's contract is pretty bad being 6M a year until 2010.


Swift expires after the '08 season.


According to this site, he's signed through 2010
http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/contracts
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
SI's database claims he has a player option in '08, then that's it. So, either one of them is wrong, or the player option extends rights for 3 more years, not 1. Bender is a good source, though, so now I'm not sure what to believe.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
In any case, I don’t want Stromile, and I hope Pax doesn’t either.
Author:  Hawkeye Vince [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
Spinnin' Bucket wrote:
In any case, I don’t want Stromile, and I hope Pax doesn’t either.

Amen to that brother.

If Gasol isn't moving and you have to do a S&T, there are few desireable assets. Out of the rest of the roster, you don't need a Mike Miller. Warrick and Gay are probably not moveable.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lowry would be worth picking up. He has some potential and his salary is peanuts. With Tyrus around, I don’t have all that much use for Warrick. I’d take him back, just for the sake of acquiring an asset, but I don’t know that I’d keep him around long term.
Author:  Hawkeye Vince [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
The plus side to Warrick is that he has gone through the development that Tyrus has not yet. Until he proves he can be a night in and night out contributor, the word potential will continue to be tossed around. I think he will take the next step with increased playing time, but who knows?
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Also, HV, for what it's worth, ESPN's records match SI's. Both claim he's off the books following '08. Hoopshype's database is a bit sketchy overall, but they also have '08 as the final year.
Author:  Hawkeye Vince [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
Then the contract makes sense for the Bulls in a S&T as long as you get a good draft pick with it. That frees up some cap room for the extensions and you can still get a MLE (correct?). Swift is serviceable and at least will be useable off the bench unlike Sweetney.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 2:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
You can still use the MLE, but with Swift on the books for $6+ mil next year, an MLE signing might have you flirting with the luxury tax in '08 (the year extensions kick in for Luol & Gordon).

If it happens, my preference is Lowry plus the right to swap 1st rounders. Memphis would probably want top 10 protection, minimally, but if you could move Nocioni for a promising young PG while improving your pick by about 15 slots, I could live with that. My first choice is to keep him, but you can't give a blank check to a bench player.
Author:  Crash Davis [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Apparently the Bulls made an offer of 5 years, $37M to Nocioni. I can't imagine him being worth any more than 7.5M/year to any team, especially with his injury history.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Side note on the Darko situation. Interesting comment today by Hollinger, basically reiterating what was discussed here the other day (re: who’s going to pay Darko what he expects to get)

Quote:
“By the way, have you ever seen an agent more upset that his client gained unrestricted status than Marc Cornstein with Milicic this week? Am I the only one who found that a little weird?”


Translation: if they were that confident in him getting $10 mil on the open market, they should be rejoicing the fact that he was renounced and made a UFA. The fact that they’re angry likely means that they were counting on a S&T for him to get his money, and that nobody with cap space is going to fork over a 5 for $50 deal to reel in Milicic.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Nas, those are all MLE signings, though, unrelated to the supposed “buyer’s market” for teams with cap space. So far, only Orlando has done anything with their cap space. Though I guess you could lump Charlotte in the mix, since they took back J Rich for the rights to Brandan Wright.

But yes, some awful contracts getting shelled out by teams with MLE money burning a hole in their pocket. Really, really, sloppy spending.
Author:  Mustang Rob [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
Spinnin' Bucket wrote:
Nas, those are all MLE signings, though, unrelated to the supposed “buyer’s market” for teams with cap space. So far, only Orlando has done anything with their cap space. Though I guess you could lump Charlotte in the mix, since they took back J Rich for the rights to Brandan Wright.

But yes, some awful contracts getting shelled out by teams with MLE money burning a hole in their pocket. Really, really, sloppy spending.


Just read that Grant Hill is signing with the Suns.
Whose minutes will he take, Rose? :wink:
Author:  mr_gimp [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
I think Golden State is now in great shape. They shipped out JR and his bad contract, then got back a talented prospect in Wright. More importantly, they also got charlottes $10 million trade exception. Another brilliant move by MJ as GM.
Author:  Bulldog Scott [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
He's still got some gas left in the tank. If he can stay healthy (a big if), he can be a very productive player in that system. 15 and 6 or so. Plus, they got him very cheap, so there isn't a whole lot of risk there.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hill agreed to a dirt cheap contract. Thought I read $1.2, but maybe it was $1.8. In any case, whatever it is, it will cost the Suns twice that amount (lux tax), but still a bargain. 1 year deal, so if his ankle falls off again, it won’t affect them in the big picture.
Author:  Bulldog Scott [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
I read on ESPN.com that it was a two year deal. Either way, still very cheap.
Author:  Spinnin' Bucket [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
hmmm, pretty sure I saw 1 year this morning, but maybe somebody jumped the gun.
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