Seems to my amateur eye that he has.

He's only 27. No major injuries to his knees or anything else, right?

I know he's played a lot of games the last 7 years. But so has Kane.

What's the reason?

His big wallet slows him down.

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CSFMB: Home of the small minded

Concussions and nagging injuries. Toews has taken much more physical abuse in his shutdown role than Kane has. It's understandable that his skills would be dulled the way they have been.

Another thing to look at is penalty minutes. One of Toews's biggest strengths for years was going virtually unpenalized: in the last five seasons he has PIM/gm of 0.33 (!), 0.47, 0.57, 0.45, and 0.44. This year he's at 0.79, 62 in 78, with some of those minutes being needless fighting majors but many more being the kind of minors that would come from a guy who's lost a step. Toews is undeniably in decline, it's just a matter of hoping it's a relatively gentle one from here on out.

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Hossa is the one who has dropped off.

They both did, Hossa more steeply, but Hossa has been in the NHL since Toews was 10 years old, so it's a little harder to hold against him.

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Yeah. But Hossa is old. So his regression makes sense.

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You're pretty good with the hockey stuff, CH. You should be the SCORE expert. You actually know stuff unlike some of their experts.

Goff:

I think Hossa has slowed that line down for 2 years.

I forget what year it was. Toews seemed injured for a good part of it and hasn't seemed the same.

Don't get me wrong, I commend Toews for playing through pain and sacrificing himself en route to three championships. But we need to be in the market for a #1 center now, because he can't be one anymore.

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statistically he's pretty close to kopitar.

Looking at Toews production, though, there hasn't been as steep a drop-off as you would think.

Career (Regular Season):

Season Age Tm Lg GP G A PTS +/- PIM
2007-08 19 CHI NHL 64 24 30 54 11 44
2008-09 20 CHI NHL 82 34 35 69 12 51
2009-10 21 CHI NHL 76 25 43 68 22 47 Stanley Cup
2010-11 22 CHI NHL 80 32 44 76 25 26
2011-12 23 CHI NHL 59 29 28 57 17 28 Injured
2012-13 24 CHI NHL 47 23 25 48 28 27 Stanley Cup/Lockout season
2013-14 25 CHI NHL 76 28 40 68 26 34
2014-15 26 CHI NHL 81 28 38 66 30 36 Stanley Cup
2015-16 27 CHI NHL 77 25 28 53 16 60 Prior to today's game

So, looking at career seasonal point production, he's right there in goals (26 so far this season including today), just down in assists, and it's pretty understandable when you have a sharply-declining and/or injured Hossa, and no stable line this season. He'll end up with a point total that is a career low, but not by much, and with constantly getting the most defensive attention.

Penalty minutes? Yeah, I suppose, but a couple of fighting majors thrown in this season...eh, whatever.

What I would like to see is IF they are a first-round exit in the upcoming playoffs, will the "extended" offseason give him some extra time to recharge and bounce back a bit next season?

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Not a mult.

Fixed that for you.

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Thank you.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Given the playoff brackets/pairings, hard to see either St Louis or Blackhawks making it to the Conference Finals. Dallas will have a relatively easy 1st round series while St Louis and Chicago no doubt go 7 games and multiple OTs.

And then a rested Stars team, with a combination of young speedsters and vets with Stanley Cup experience, hosts whichever team survives Blues-Hawks?

If Blues or Hawks snagged the 1 seed and Stars had to contend with either Blues or Hawks first round and then the other top team 2nd round, they'd be in the same shite position.

Given the top team in the East has a history of crapping out early in the playoffs, and the Panthers age has to catch up with them at some point, anybody could come out of the East.

Stamkos out 1-3 months for the Lightning now.

Interesting to see what odds Vegas throws up once the field is settled in the East.

Minnesota could bounce 'allas and their weak-ass blue line/goaltending. It'd be a redux of their Avs series two years ago.

East is probably down to Pittsburgh and New York. I don't like anyone out of the Atlantic, the Isles are injured beyond recognition, and Crapitals gonna Crapital.

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Toews is in the middle of a HOF career...not at the end of one.

People, cough CH cough, need to chill the fuck out.

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How much different would Toews season look if he ended up paired with Panarin, and Kane ended up with Hossa?

Toews is to CH what Penn St is to Bernstein.

A dead horse CH will beat to death in an inane attempt to defend his constant yet senseless cheap shots against Toews.

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Toews inevitable decline will be more mental, than physical. He's probably into double digit concussions already.

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We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they who need public cures for their private ails.- Eric Hoffer

Yeah, Toews was like one concussion from being out of the league 3 years ago, he should be lucky to play long enough to really decline.

He doesn't even remember all the underage girls he screwed in college...so very sad.

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We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they who need public cures for their private ails.- Eric Hoffer

He does look to be a bit one step behind lately.

However, even if Toews retired today, his and Kane's statue will be right next to Mikita and Hull's someday.

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"This is Chicago, my friend. Anything can happen."

In honor of this thread I'll change back to an old avatar.

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"This is Chicago, my friend. Anything can happen."

Kane and Toews have done something that no 2 temmates have ever done in the history of the NHL...both have scored 20 or more goals in each of their first 9 years in the league.

Too bad one of them won't remember it.

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We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they who need public cures for their private ails.- Eric Hoffer

Let's look at points per game:

2007-08: 0.844
2008-09: 0.841
2009-10: 0.895
2010-11: 0.950
2011-12: 0.966
2012-13: 1.021
2013-14: 0.895
2014-15: 0.815
2015-16: 0.692

Now does it look more like a steep drop? Even when he was being dogged for coasting on "intangibles" and "the little things," he was still averaging 73 points a season. A 25% reduction in points from that level is significant whether you like it or not.

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Can you fault a guy for not even remembering what he accomplished in 2010? He's doing the best he can with the limited faculties he has.

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We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they who need public cures for their private ails.- Eric Hoffer

Took you a while to respond with this...hmmmm...

So, you don't think that the Toews & (sometimes) Hossa & ______ Line this season may have something to do with it? Oh, and there's still 3 games left...

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Not a mult.

He has been busy trying to figure out a way to spin that he is right

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."