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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 9:46 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I read CH's post as making fun of the buzz term-laden and often meaningless deflections and rationalizations from leftists of what they know full well is a hypocritical stance on Israel, one they know they would call racist/Islamaphobic if it were made about the Palestinians? What's the beef with a dead on lampooning of leftist hypocrisy?

I was making fun of the gish-galloping that academic leftists do to explain that they don't want Jews exterminated en masse when they chant "from the river to the sea, Palestine shall be free."

The part about liberals and apps was also tongue-in-cheek but there's a kernel of truth that all mainstream political beliefs in America allow for support of Israel and it's the fringes that don't.

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Last edited by Curious Hair on Mon May 14, 2018 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 9:48 pm 
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Curious Hair wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I read CH's post as making fun of the buzz term-laden and often meaningless deflections and rationalizations from leftists of what they know full well is a hypocritical stance on Israel, one they know they would call racist/Islamaphobic if it were made about the Palestinians? What's the beef with a dead on lampooning of leftist hypocrisy?

I was making fun of the gish-galloping that academic leftists do to explain that they don't want Jews exterminated en masse when they chant "from the river to the sea, Palestine shall be free."

Palestine won't ever be free. It's over for them. Whether tomorrow, or in 50 years. They just don't have the resources.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 9:48 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I read CH's post as making fun of the buzz term-laden and often meaningless deflections and rationalizations from leftists of what they know full well is a hypocritical stance on Israel, one they know they would call racist/Islamaphobic if it were made about the Palestinians? What's the beef with a dead on lampooning of leftist hypocrisy?


Because that’s not what it is. It’s not political, which is actually commendable.
CH could entertainingly explain the difference between the mindset of suburban housewives from Los Angeles and working husbands from Knoxville, TN, based on the evolution of Hollywood and how it affected those respective places during specific decades... and it would be hilarious. But it probably wouldn’t be accurate.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 9:49 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
Lot of halal shitposting from Terry's Peeps.


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Lol. Schitt's Creek really into that watermark. I'd say its fair to argue that's the first gif of that show that's been posted in any medium.

This is all I am qualified to say on this topic.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 10:37 pm 
leashyourkids wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I read CH's post as making fun of the buzz term-laden and often meaningless deflections and rationalizations from leftists of what they know full well is a hypocritical stance on Israel, one they know they would call racist/Islamaphobic if it were made about the Palestinians? What's the beef with a dead on lampooning of leftist hypocrisy?


Because that’s not what it is. It’s not political, which is actually commendable.
CH could entertainingly explain the difference between the mindset of suburban housewives from Los Angeles and working husbands from Knoxville, TN, based on the evolution of Hollywood and how it affected those respective places during specific decades... and it would be hilarious. But it probably wouldn’t be accurate.

You've achieved the smugness level of Dick Durbin. Congrats.


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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 10:39 pm 
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Baby McNown wrote:
leashyourkids wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I read CH's post as making fun of the buzz term-laden and often meaningless deflections and rationalizations from leftists of what they know full well is a hypocritical stance on Israel, one they know they would call racist/Islamaphobic if it were made about the Palestinians? What's the beef with a dead on lampooning of leftist hypocrisy?


Because that’s not what it is. It’s not political, which is actually commendable.
CH could entertainingly explain the difference between the mindset of suburban housewives from Los Angeles and working husbands from Knoxville, TN, based on the evolution of Hollywood and how it affected those respective places during specific decades... and it would be hilarious. But it probably wouldn’t be accurate.

You've achieved the smugness level of Dick Durbin. Congrats.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:00 pm 
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Jbi11s wrote:

Uh... There's a paywall.



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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:33 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
Ogie, are you trying to tell me Israel, who has killed and captured hamas members left and right for 3 decades, is hurt by the $3 billion annually and w/e the real $30 or $40 billion dollars amount in military aid more than they've been helped? I hope you realize how silly that sounds.

You sound like every propagandandist in this country. Maybe worse.

I am literally telling you that as it has prevented Israel from taking out the political leadership of Hamas, which has prevented overall victory vs. Hamas. Not to mention what it has done for preventing Israel from being self sufficient in arms manufacturing



Hamas is a rather impotent terrorist organization that poses no real threat to the existence of Israel. If you think that Israeli leadership would turn down 4 billion annually simply for the purpose of taking out the leadership of Hamas you are insane.

You also overestimate the ability of the U.S. with respect to keeping Israel in line also. Israel will act independently when it feels it is threatened.

Hamas poses a threat as their rockets can literally shut down much of the country economically and are able to close down the only international airport.

It also isn't just Hamas that is a threat, but also Hezbollah, IRGC, etc. All of these groups have leadership that at one point or another have ended up in Israel's sights only for them to be told not to pull the trigger.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:34 pm 
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long time guy wrote:
The U.S. Can't prevent Israel from whacking Iranian Scientists but they can prevent them from whacking the senior leadership of Hamas.

They also can't prevent Israel from spying on them but they can prevent Israel from whacking Senior leadership of Hamas

Did you ever consider the fact that the US wanted those scientists dead too?

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:42 pm 
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Jbi11s wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
Ogie, are you trying to tell me Israel, who has killed and captured hamas members left and right for 3 decades, is hurt by the $3 billion annually and w/e the real $30 or $40 billion dollars amount in military aid more than they've been helped? I hope you realize how silly that sounds.

You sound like every propagandandist in this country. Maybe worse.

I am literally telling you that as it has prevented Israel from taking out the political leadership of Hamas, which has prevented overall victory vs. Hamas. Not to mention what it has done for preventing Israel from being self sufficient in arms manufacturing


What do you think would happen if the US cut off all funding to Israel? Within hours?

I never realized just how much of a propagandist you are.

I brushed aside your extremist views on the police, but man, you seem to just get out over your skis a lot.

Because Israel hasn't been able to kill leadership at will you consider hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars in military and foreign aid a detriment more than a help.

Silly.
You really are out of your league on this topic and it shows. It wouldn't be a matter of hours, but over a period of time, Israel would once again have the opportunity to track down and target specific terror leaders who pose a threat to them.

In 1997 they had Mashaal poisoned and on his deathbed. Bill Clinton forced Israel to give him the antidote.

In the mid 2000s, Israel had Nasrallah in their sights. Bush told them not to kill him as he didn't want to upset Shiites in Iraq who he was trying to nationbuild for.

In 2008, they had Soleimani literally in their sights with a joint-CIA op. CIA wouldn't let them kill Soleimani, this was apparently done for the same reason Nasrallah was placed off-limits.

That's just 1 small part of why the aid harms Israel. It also harms their ability to build their own systems as they are required to use the money on US systems and the US defense industrial complex then applies pressure to make sure Israel doesn't develop competing systems. I brought up the case of the Lavi, which would've given Israel an indigenous Gen 4 fighter.

Other ways the aid harms Israel is that it has been used to push Israel to make decisions which time proved to be tactically and strategically unwise. I can cite the 2000 Lebanon withdrawal, which just allowed Hezbollah to fortify the area south of the Litani River with 140,000 rockets. I can cite the 2012 cease fire with Hamas, which was pushed on Israel just as they had widdled down Hamas's then smaller stockpile of rockets. Israel was denied the chance to delivery the knockout blow.

I can continue if you really want me to cite examples. I don't know if they will mean much to you as your ignorance on this topic is "wikipedia deep" whereas I actually lived there and served after being drafted into the IDF. I have seen first hand how the aid is used as a way to control Israel's actions, and often not for the best. I was there in 2012 and saw 1st hand where this went. It was the chance to knockout Hamas as the leading power in Gaza and we lost it because we were pushed into an untimely cease-fire.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:45 pm 
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Ogie is a couple whiskeys away from admitting he enjoys rooting for state sponsored terrorism and genocide over peaceful coexistence.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:48 pm 
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IMU wrote:
Ogie is a couple whiskeys away from admitting he enjoys rooting for state sponsored terrorism and genocide over peaceful coexistence.

All it takes for peaceful coexistence is for Gaza to throw out Hamas. They were left in 2005 with the chance to turn it into the Singapore of the Middle East. Israel withdrew voluntarily, left them a solid infrastructure, and started construction of a port for Gaza. That all fell through of course when they chose to install Hamas as their leadership instead of the PA a year later. I guess the Palestinians just prove time and time again that they can't have nice things.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:52 pm 
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Actually, the blockade probably prevents Palestinians from having nice things. Or...things at all, really. I'm sure basic human needs matter a little more than nice things at the moment.

But now it is your time to shine! Let others suffer as you did! Because why not.

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:56 pm 
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IMU wrote:
Actually, the blockade probably prevents Palestinians from having nice things. Or...things at all, really. I'm sure basic human needs matter a little more than nice things at the moment.

The blockade didn't exist until the Hamas takeover, kidnapping of Gilad Shalit, and the barrage of rockets that came with it. Before that, there was no blockade. Plus, it's worth noting, Israel doesn't have complete control of the border with Gaza. There is also Rafah, which is a crossing controlled by Egypt. It's funny how the Egyptians are tougher on Rafah than the Israelis are on any of the borders they control. I guess the Egyptians just know the true nature of Hamas.

The Palestinians could have peace tomorrow if Hamas gave up their fight, but alas that won't happen so they can lay in the bed they have made for themselves.

Oh yeah, about those crossings. There is another border crossing, it is Kerem Shalom. It's where most aid travels through and where pipelines carry gas for fuel, heating, and cooking into Gaza. It was fully operational up until a week and a half ago until Hamas decided to unleash their own people to literally burn it down. Funny Palestinians, they really do know how to shoot themselves in the face. :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:56 pm 
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"The Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity." - Abba Eban after the failed Geneva Peace Talks

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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:58 pm 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
Ogie, are you trying to tell me Israel, who has killed and captured hamas members left and right for 3 decades, is hurt by the $3 billion annually and w/e the real $30 or $40 billion dollars amount in military aid more than they've been helped? I hope you realize how silly that sounds.

You sound like every propagandandist in this country. Maybe worse.

I am literally telling you that as it has prevented Israel from taking out the political leadership of Hamas, which has prevented overall victory vs. Hamas. Not to mention what it has done for preventing Israel from being self sufficient in arms manufacturing



Hamas is a rather impotent terrorist organization that poses no real threat to the existence of Israel. If you think that Israeli leadership would turn down 4 billion annually simply for the purpose of taking out the leadership of Hamas you are insane.

You also overestimate the ability of the U.S. with respect to keeping Israel in line also. Israel will act independently when it feels it is threatened.

Hamas poses a threat as their rockets can literally shut down much of the country economically and are able to close down the only international airport.

It also isn't just Hamas that is a threat, but also Hezbollah, IRGC, etc. All of these groups have leadership that at one point or another have ended up in Israel's sights only for them to be told not to pull the trigger.



Hezbollah yes and for obvious (Iranian) reasons. Hamas different story.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:05 am 
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Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
long time guy wrote:
The U.S. Can't prevent Israel from whacking Iranian Scientists but they can prevent them from whacking the senior leadership of Hamas.

They also can't prevent Israel from spying on them but they can prevent Israel from whacking Senior leadership of Hamas

Did you ever consider the fact that the US wanted those scientists dead too?



Which U.S. though? Obama did condemn Israel for the killings but i'm sure you're going to tell us that he didn't really mean it.

Israel has spied against the U.S. on numerous occasions throughout its brief history and has defied the U.S. on numerous occasions as well.

You make it seem as though they are puppets of the U S. and that is simply not true.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:58 am 
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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 2:58 am 
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ZephMarshack wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Baby McNown wrote:
Saying that murdering Arabs is...ya know... murder is anti-Semitic. You should be ashamed of yourselves.



You know what's anti-Semitic? Looking at all the bad actors in the world and never saying shit about them but seizing upon Israel like a rabid dog at every turn. Or maybe it's something else. Who knows?

It's because the all the bad actors in the world don't have a readymade legion of English-speaking apologists ready to justify absolutely everything they do. As Daniel Davies put it:
Quote:
Consider, reader, a person who is a bit of a nut. His very favourite thing in the world is to have arguments on the internet about the politics and government systems countries he will never visit. There are two issues in the world which he regards as massive injustices which cry out to heaven for redress – the Russian occupation of Chechnya, and the military junta in Burma/Myanmar. He also, broadly, supports the cause of the Palestinians, but this really isn’t much of an issue for him; he’s much better informed and much more concerned about Chechnya and Burma.

So why, when the NSA takes a snoop over this fellow’s online output, does he seem to spend all of his time arguing about Israel and Palestine?

Basically it is for the same reason that this guy plays a lot of poker even though his favourite card game is bezique – because you can always get a game. If you don’t speak Russian or Burmese, then you can condemn the actions of the government of both countries, but it is going to be a short conversation, because very few people are going to argue the other side. If you have an opinion about the government of Yemen, you can excoriate them in the strongest possible terms and still be at the betting shop by the time it opens, but if you get into an argument about Israel/Palestine, you can say goodbye to the morning.

Furthermore, not only can you always “get a game” in the Israel/Palestine conflict, it’s a team sport. There any many injustices and abuses in this horrible old world, but not many of them will provide you with a social life. The political argument over the Middle East, however, will give you an entire set of friends, activities, topics of conversation – nearly all the services which an American college fraternity provides for its members. So you can see why this issue is particularly salient with college students. In my hazy memory of how things went in the 90s, the Israeli side had the better food while the BDS side had the better bands, and both sides were pretty welcoming to freeloaders. Things might have changed but I doubt they have.

So this is my answer to the vexed question of why it is that the State of Israel finds itself singled out for disproportionate criticism compared to all the other unjust governments in the world. The online supporters of the State of Israel don’t understand why their conflict attracts so much attention because they can’t understand, because the reason is, basically, them. There are loads and loads of governments which carry out human rights abuses in the world, but there are really rather few governments who make apologetics for crimes against humanity clearly, in English and conveniently online. Neither are there many organisations in the world who fire rockets at nurseries, but who have a large, well-educated and English-speaking community across the world who are prepared to repeat their propaganda material. The Israel-Palestine conflict is the English Premier League of human rights debates – it might not be the best one, it might be legitimately criticised as predictable and dominated by big money, but it’s the one which has captured the imagination of the world, and if you want to see the best players in action, week in and week out, nowhere else comes close.
I'd add to that the amount of money we send their way in the US probably has a good deal to do with the attention they get as well. This should apply to the Saudis as well, which never really had nearly as many kneejerk apologists in the first place. It seems the prince's PR tour and totally empty symbolic "progressive" gestures have won over a fair amount of the gullible, foreign policy consensus loving media recently so that may be changing.


One of the better posts in this thread overlooked by the lot of us.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 4:08 am 
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No one anywhere can argue that it is necessary to use live ammo on unarmed protesters on the other side of a wide perimeter lined with a series of barbwire fences.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 4:56 am 
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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 5:38 am 
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Jbi11s wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Baby McNown wrote:
Saying that murdering Arabs is...ya know... murder is anti-Semitic. You should be ashamed of yourselves.



You know what's anti-Semitic? Looking at all the bad actors in the world and never saying shit about them but seizing upon Israel like a rabid dog at every turn. Or maybe it's something else. Who knows?

It's because the all the bad actors in the world don't have a readymade legion of English-speaking apologists ready to justify absolutely everything they do. As Daniel Davies put it:
Quote:
Consider, reader, a person who is a bit of a nut. His very favourite thing in the world is to have arguments on the internet about the politics and government systems countries he will never visit. There are two issues in the world which he regards as massive injustices which cry out to heaven for redress – the Russian occupation of Chechnya, and the military junta in Burma/Myanmar. He also, broadly, supports the cause of the Palestinians, but this really isn’t much of an issue for him; he’s much better informed and much more concerned about Chechnya and Burma.

So why, when the NSA takes a snoop over this fellow’s online output, does he seem to spend all of his time arguing about Israel and Palestine?

Basically it is for the same reason that this guy plays a lot of poker even though his favourite card game is bezique – because you can always get a game. If you don’t speak Russian or Burmese, then you can condemn the actions of the government of both countries, but it is going to be a short conversation, because very few people are going to argue the other side. If you have an opinion about the government of Yemen, you can excoriate them in the strongest possible terms and still be at the betting shop by the time it opens, but if you get into an argument about Israel/Palestine, you can say goodbye to the morning.

Furthermore, not only can you always “get a game” in the Israel/Palestine conflict, it’s a team sport. There any many injustices and abuses in this horrible old world, but not many of them will provide you with a social life. The political argument over the Middle East, however, will give you an entire set of friends, activities, topics of conversation – nearly all the services which an American college fraternity provides for its members. So you can see why this issue is particularly salient with college students. In my hazy memory of how things went in the 90s, the Israeli side had the better food while the BDS side had the better bands, and both sides were pretty welcoming to freeloaders. Things might have changed but I doubt they have.

So this is my answer to the vexed question of why it is that the State of Israel finds itself singled out for disproportionate criticism compared to all the other unjust governments in the world. The online supporters of the State of Israel don’t understand why their conflict attracts so much attention because they can’t understand, because the reason is, basically, them. There are loads and loads of governments which carry out human rights abuses in the world, but there are really rather few governments who make apologetics for crimes against humanity clearly, in English and conveniently online. Neither are there many organisations in the world who fire rockets at nurseries, but who have a large, well-educated and English-speaking community across the world who are prepared to repeat their propaganda material. The Israel-Palestine conflict is the English Premier League of human rights debates – it might not be the best one, it might be legitimately criticised as predictable and dominated by big money, but it’s the one which has captured the imagination of the world, and if you want to see the best players in action, week in and week out, nowhere else comes close.
I'd add to that the amount of money we send their way in the US probably has a good deal to do with the attention they get as well. This should apply to the Saudis as well, which never really had nearly as many kneejerk apologists in the first place. It seems the prince's PR tour and totally empty symbolic "progressive" gestures have won over a fair amount of the gullible, foreign policy consensus loving media recently so that may be changing.


One of the better posts in this thread overlooked by the lot of us.


Nah, just a tortured explanation for why people who supposedly have no animus toward Jews constantly twist themselves in knots to rebuke them when Jews defend themselves against those whose core mission statement demands their elimination from earth.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 5:45 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Baby McNown wrote:
Saying that murdering Arabs is...ya know... murder is anti-Semitic. You should be ashamed of yourselves.



You know what's anti-Semitic? Looking at all the bad actors in the world and never saying shit about them but seizing upon Israel like a rabid dog at every turn. Or maybe it's something else. Who knows?

It's because the all the bad actors in the world don't have a readymade legion of English-speaking apologists ready to justify absolutely everything they do. As Daniel Davies put it:
Quote:
Consider, reader, a person who is a bit of a nut. His very favourite thing in the world is to have arguments on the internet about the politics and government systems countries he will never visit. There are two issues in the world which he regards as massive injustices which cry out to heaven for redress – the Russian occupation of Chechnya, and the military junta in Burma/Myanmar. He also, broadly, supports the cause of the Palestinians, but this really isn’t much of an issue for him; he’s much better informed and much more concerned about Chechnya and Burma.

So why, when the NSA takes a snoop over this fellow’s online output, does he seem to spend all of his time arguing about Israel and Palestine?

Basically it is for the same reason that this guy plays a lot of poker even though his favourite card game is bezique – because you can always get a game. If you don’t speak Russian or Burmese, then you can condemn the actions of the government of both countries, but it is going to be a short conversation, because very few people are going to argue the other side. If you have an opinion about the government of Yemen, you can excoriate them in the strongest possible terms and still be at the betting shop by the time it opens, but if you get into an argument about Israel/Palestine, you can say goodbye to the morning.

Furthermore, not only can you always “get a game” in the Israel/Palestine conflict, it’s a team sport. There any many injustices and abuses in this horrible old world, but not many of them will provide you with a social life. The political argument over the Middle East, however, will give you an entire set of friends, activities, topics of conversation – nearly all the services which an American college fraternity provides for its members. So you can see why this issue is particularly salient with college students. In my hazy memory of how things went in the 90s, the Israeli side had the better food while the BDS side had the better bands, and both sides were pretty welcoming to freeloaders. Things might have changed but I doubt they have.

So this is my answer to the vexed question of why it is that the State of Israel finds itself singled out for disproportionate criticism compared to all the other unjust governments in the world. The online supporters of the State of Israel don’t understand why their conflict attracts so much attention because they can’t understand, because the reason is, basically, them. There are loads and loads of governments which carry out human rights abuses in the world, but there are really rather few governments who make apologetics for crimes against humanity clearly, in English and conveniently online. Neither are there many organisations in the world who fire rockets at nurseries, but who have a large, well-educated and English-speaking community across the world who are prepared to repeat their propaganda material. The Israel-Palestine conflict is the English Premier League of human rights debates – it might not be the best one, it might be legitimately criticised as predictable and dominated by big money, but it’s the one which has captured the imagination of the world, and if you want to see the best players in action, week in and week out, nowhere else comes close.
I'd add to that the amount of money we send their way in the US probably has a good deal to do with the attention they get as well. This should apply to the Saudis as well, which never really had nearly as many kneejerk apologists in the first place. It seems the prince's PR tour and totally empty symbolic "progressive" gestures have won over a fair amount of the gullible, foreign policy consensus loving media recently so that may be changing.


One of the better posts in this thread overlooked by the lot of us.


Nah, just a tortured explanation for why people who supposedly have no animus toward Jews constantly twist themselves in knots to rebuke them when Jews defend themselves against those whose core mission statement demands their elimination from earth.



Can you state unequivocally whether the actions taken yesterday were taken in an effort to prevent this or are you simply repeating talking points?

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 5:54 am 
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long time guy wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Baby McNown wrote:
Saying that murdering Arabs is...ya know... murder is anti-Semitic. You should be ashamed of yourselves.



You know what's anti-Semitic? Looking at all the bad actors in the world and never saying shit about them but seizing upon Israel like a rabid dog at every turn. Or maybe it's something else. Who knows?

It's because the all the bad actors in the world don't have a readymade legion of English-speaking apologists ready to justify absolutely everything they do. As Daniel Davies put it:
Quote:
Consider, reader, a person who is a bit of a nut. His very favourite thing in the world is to have arguments on the internet about the politics and government systems countries he will never visit. There are two issues in the world which he regards as massive injustices which cry out to heaven for redress – the Russian occupation of Chechnya, and the military junta in Burma/Myanmar. He also, broadly, supports the cause of the Palestinians, but this really isn’t much of an issue for him; he’s much better informed and much more concerned about Chechnya and Burma.

So why, when the NSA takes a snoop over this fellow’s online output, does he seem to spend all of his time arguing about Israel and Palestine?

Basically it is for the same reason that this guy plays a lot of poker even though his favourite card game is bezique – because you can always get a game. If you don’t speak Russian or Burmese, then you can condemn the actions of the government of both countries, but it is going to be a short conversation, because very few people are going to argue the other side. If you have an opinion about the government of Yemen, you can excoriate them in the strongest possible terms and still be at the betting shop by the time it opens, but if you get into an argument about Israel/Palestine, you can say goodbye to the morning.

Furthermore, not only can you always “get a game” in the Israel/Palestine conflict, it’s a team sport. There any many injustices and abuses in this horrible old world, but not many of them will provide you with a social life. The political argument over the Middle East, however, will give you an entire set of friends, activities, topics of conversation – nearly all the services which an American college fraternity provides for its members. So you can see why this issue is particularly salient with college students. In my hazy memory of how things went in the 90s, the Israeli side had the better food while the BDS side had the better bands, and both sides were pretty welcoming to freeloaders. Things might have changed but I doubt they have.

So this is my answer to the vexed question of why it is that the State of Israel finds itself singled out for disproportionate criticism compared to all the other unjust governments in the world. The online supporters of the State of Israel don’t understand why their conflict attracts so much attention because they can’t understand, because the reason is, basically, them. There are loads and loads of governments which carry out human rights abuses in the world, but there are really rather few governments who make apologetics for crimes against humanity clearly, in English and conveniently online. Neither are there many organisations in the world who fire rockets at nurseries, but who have a large, well-educated and English-speaking community across the world who are prepared to repeat their propaganda material. The Israel-Palestine conflict is the English Premier League of human rights debates – it might not be the best one, it might be legitimately criticised as predictable and dominated by big money, but it’s the one which has captured the imagination of the world, and if you want to see the best players in action, week in and week out, nowhere else comes close.
I'd add to that the amount of money we send their way in the US probably has a good deal to do with the attention they get as well. This should apply to the Saudis as well, which never really had nearly as many kneejerk apologists in the first place. It seems the prince's PR tour and totally empty symbolic "progressive" gestures have won over a fair amount of the gullible, foreign policy consensus loving media recently so that may be changing.


One of the better posts in this thread overlooked by the lot of us.


Nah, just a tortured explanation for why people who supposedly have no animus toward Jews constantly twist themselves in knots to rebuke them when Jews defend themselves against those whose core mission statement demands their elimination from earth.



Can you state unequivocally whether the actions taken yesterday were taken in an effort to prevent this or are you simply repeating talking points?



I think Jews have the same right to defend their borders as anyone else. If Russians stormed the border of Ukraine and Ukrainians killed them all, we wouldn't be having a conversation about how awful Ukraine is.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 6:10 am 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
long time guy wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Jbi11s wrote:
ZephMarshack wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:


You know what's anti-Semitic? Looking at all the bad actors in the world and never saying shit about them but seizing upon Israel like a rabid dog at every turn. Or maybe it's something else. Who knows?

It's because the all the bad actors in the world don't have a readymade legion of English-speaking apologists ready to justify absolutely everything they do. As Daniel Davies put it:
Quote:
Consider, reader, a person who is a bit of a nut. His very favourite thing in the world is to have arguments on the internet about the politics and government systems countries he will never visit. There are two issues in the world which he regards as massive injustices which cry out to heaven for redress – the Russian occupation of Chechnya, and the military junta in Burma/Myanmar. He also, broadly, supports the cause of the Palestinians, but this really isn’t much of an issue for him; he’s much better informed and much more concerned about Chechnya and Burma.

So why, when the NSA takes a snoop over this fellow’s online output, does he seem to spend all of his time arguing about Israel and Palestine?

Basically it is for the same reason that this guy plays a lot of poker even though his favourite card game is bezique – because you can always get a game. If you don’t speak Russian or Burmese, then you can condemn the actions of the government of both countries, but it is going to be a short conversation, because very few people are going to argue the other side. If you have an opinion about the government of Yemen, you can excoriate them in the strongest possible terms and still be at the betting shop by the time it opens, but if you get into an argument about Israel/Palestine, you can say goodbye to the morning.

Furthermore, not only can you always “get a game” in the Israel/Palestine conflict, it’s a team sport. There any many injustices and abuses in this horrible old world, but not many of them will provide you with a social life. The political argument over the Middle East, however, will give you an entire set of friends, activities, topics of conversation – nearly all the services which an American college fraternity provides for its members. So you can see why this issue is particularly salient with college students. In my hazy memory of how things went in the 90s, the Israeli side had the better food while the BDS side had the better bands, and both sides were pretty welcoming to freeloaders. Things might have changed but I doubt they have.

So this is my answer to the vexed question of why it is that the State of Israel finds itself singled out for disproportionate criticism compared to all the other unjust governments in the world. The online supporters of the State of Israel don’t understand why their conflict attracts so much attention because they can’t understand, because the reason is, basically, them. There are loads and loads of governments which carry out human rights abuses in the world, but there are really rather few governments who make apologetics for crimes against humanity clearly, in English and conveniently online. Neither are there many organisations in the world who fire rockets at nurseries, but who have a large, well-educated and English-speaking community across the world who are prepared to repeat their propaganda material. The Israel-Palestine conflict is the English Premier League of human rights debates – it might not be the best one, it might be legitimately criticised as predictable and dominated by big money, but it’s the one which has captured the imagination of the world, and if you want to see the best players in action, week in and week out, nowhere else comes close.
I'd add to that the amount of money we send their way in the US probably has a good deal to do with the attention they get as well. This should apply to the Saudis as well, which never really had nearly as many kneejerk apologists in the first place. It seems the prince's PR tour and totally empty symbolic "progressive" gestures have won over a fair amount of the gullible, foreign policy consensus loving media recently so that may be changing.


One of the better posts in this thread overlooked by the lot of us.


Nah, just a tortured explanation for why people who supposedly have no animus toward Jews constantly twist themselves in knots to rebuke them when Jews defend themselves against those whose core mission statement demands their elimination from earth.



Can you state unequivocally whether the actions taken yesterday were taken in an effort to prevent this or are you simply repeating talking points?



I think Jews have the same right to defend their borders as anyone else. If Russians stormed the border of Ukraine and Ukrainians killed them all, we wouldn't be having a conversation about how awful Ukraine is.



If they were merely protesting we would and to the best of anyone's knowledge they weren't committing an act of war.

There is another misnomer that you continue to propagate also. The reason that most Americans are attentive to Israel has more to do with the fact that Israel is recognized as one of this country's staunchest allies and if Israel goes to war there is a likelihood that the U.S. would war as well.

If Israel were under attack from an existential threat such as Iran is there any doubt as to whether the U.S. would intervene? In addition is the fact that Israel is a staunch ally in a region of the world which holds geopolitical and economic significance for our nation.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 6:12 am 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Terry's Peeps wrote:
Curious Hair wrote:
Lot of halal shitposting from Terry's Peeps.


Image


Lol. Schitt's Creek really into that watermark. I'd say its fair to argue that's the first gif of that show that's been posted in any medium.

This is all I am qualified to say on this topic.


I mentioned it in the Netflix thread. I find it a mildly funny time killer. I was largely ignored.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 6:22 am 
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Anyone else find it odd that the prevailing feeling is the Jews were just standing around planning how to kill Palestinians yesterday? I do not know the truth or level of the incursion and protests but they did in fact come to the border looking for the fight right?

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 7:17 am 
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pittmike wrote:
Anyone else find it odd that the prevailing feeling is the Jews were just standing around planning how to kill Palestinians yesterday? I do not know the truth or level of the incursion and protests but they did in fact come to the border looking for the fight right?


I think it's fair to question live ammo versus something else.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 7:21 am 
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State sponsored terrorism. The states being Iran and Obamerica who funded Iran.

Daniel Greenfield, a Shillman Journalism Fellow at the Freedom Center, is an investigative journalist and writer focusing on the radical left and Islamic terrorism.

Hamas supporters in Gaza held the world’s first peaceful protest with hand grenades, pipe bombs, cleavers and guns. Ten explosive devices were peacefully detonated. There were outbursts of peaceful gunfire and over a dozen kites carrying firebombs were sent into Israel where they started 23 peaceful fires. And Israeli soldiers peacefully defended their country leaving multiple Hamas attackers at peace.

"We will tear down the border," Hamas Prime Minister Yahya Sinwar had peacefully vowed. "And we will tear out their hearts from their bodies."

But the only hearts his terror thugs tore out were already bleeding with sympathy for Islamic terrorists.

The Hamas mob chanted, “Allahu Akbar” and the genocidal racist threat of, “Khaybar Khaybar, ya yahud," a reference to the primal Islamic massacre of the Jews. While IDF soldiers held back the invaders, the jets of the IAF targeted the snake’s head striking Hamas compounds and outposts. By 5.30 PM, the Hamas organizers changed course and began urging the thugs away from further fence attacks.

Hamas had offered $100 to every rioter. During previous violent assaults back in April, the Muslim Brotherhood terrorist group had been offering $200 to anyone shot by Israelis, $500 for severe injuries and $3,000 to the dead.

$100 a day may not seem like a lot, but the Israeli teen soldiers they’re trying to kill, earn $13 a day.

The Hamas supporting thugs are depicted as helpless, starving victims who can barely lift the firebombs they’re throwing at Israelis, but they make ten times as much as the Israeli soldiers they are there to kill.

Hamas can write all those checks to its aspiring killers because the cash is coming from Iran.
-----------------------------

"Who is dumb enough to believe the Hamas casualty count?"-People with a Clue

"can we do that here?"-Ann Coulter

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 7:27 am 
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Cheap Charlie wrote:
Hamas can write all those checks to its aspiring killers because the cash is coming from Iran.
-----------------------------

"Who is dumb enough to believe the Hamas casualty count?"-People with a Clue

"can we do that here?"-Ann Coulter


That's what everyone says.

Guess where that cash came from...

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