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 Post subject: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:23 am 
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I was sitting on the phone with the "good" folks from E-Trade yesterday, and I ended up just hanging up the phone. After getting the merry go round from one rep to the next, George clearly could not help me. They play this little game where they put you on hold and pretend like they are figuring out the answer to your question. What they are really doing is running around like chickens with their heads cut off to find someone who actually knows what they are doing. I've been through this dance with them no less than a dozen times.

Now I understand I am with a low cost, self service broker. And frankly, I don't want to interact with anyone. But there are certain types of transactions that they require you to talk with a rep. For the first time in 15 years, I am considering moving my accounts from them.

I went home from work pretty pissed off based on my latest interaction with these guys.

Yeah, big fucking deal. First World Problems.

Do you have any to share?

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:32 am 
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denisdman wrote:
Do you have any to share?


Every time the internet craps out or I lose my satellite signal during a storm.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:35 am 
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denisdman wrote:
I was sitting on the phone ?


It works better if you put it up to your ear.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:37 am 
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I'm male, white but my entitlement/privilege is slowly being eroded.

WTF man.


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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:41 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
denisdman wrote:
I was sitting on the phone ?


It works better if you put it up to your ear.


:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:42 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
denisdman wrote:
I was sitting on the phone ?


It works better if you put it up to your ear.


But didn't you tell me my brain was in my ass? Or was that Sini?

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:23 am 
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denisdman wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
denisdman wrote:
I was sitting on the phone ?


It works better if you put it up to your ear.


But didn't you tell me my brain was in my ass? Or was that Sini?


That is correct. We would have also accepted "not when you are constantly talking out of your ass." The board is yours.


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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:17 am 
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Afraid to play high limit craps. Does his own stock trading. Lots of evidence of 5 percenter showing up. It may be time to question if he has a room with three televisions.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:24 am 
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IKR. Soon my kids will be going to public schools, playing on in house teams, and driving used cars. :)

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:27 am 
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I'll pray for your bank account.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:37 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
I'll pray for your bank accounts.


Corrected.

Thank you Rick. We all know that God will listen because he doesn't have the time or stamina to argue with you.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:40 am 
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Multiple bank accounts! Things are looking up.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:43 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Multiple bank accounts! Things are looking up.


Well there are limits to FDIC insurance per institution, you know. :)

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:45 am 
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You should get a financial adviser if that is true.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:46 am 
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denisdman wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Multiple bank accounts! Things are looking up.


Well there are limits to FDIC insurance per institution, you know. :)


$250,000.

Not so humble brag.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:56 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
You should get a financial adviser if that is true.


On a serious note, sound investing has some simple principles. First, you're biggest source of long term costs comes from taxes and transaction fees. Those need to be minimized to extract return. And research shows that about 85% of your long term return comes from asset allocation not individual asset selection (i.e. stocks vs bonds rather than Microsoft vs. IBM). Dollar cost averaging and diversification are the final key points.

Since very few investment houses/advisers have shown an ability to beat the market (so-called alpha) over any material time horizon, I'll take my chances with low cost mutual funds. My trading portfolio is just educated gambling mostly for fun.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:04 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
You should get a financial adviser if that is true.


On a serious note, sound investing has some simple principles. First, you're biggest source of long term costs comes from taxes and transaction fees. Those need to be minimized to extract return. And research shows that about 85% of your long term return comes from asset allocation not individual asset selection (i.e. stocks vs bonds rather than Microsoft vs. IBM). Dollar cost averaging and diversification are the final key points.

Since very few investment houses/advisers have shown an ability to beat the market (so-called alpha) over any material time horizon, I'll take my chances with low cost mutual funds. My trading portfolio is just educated gambling mostly for fun.

If you have more than $250k sitting in FDIC insured accounts you are doing it wrong unless you are near retirement.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:16 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If you have more than $250k sitting in FDIC insured accounts you are doing it wrong unless you are near retirement.


Agree in full. A six month liquid reserve is prudent. Anything more than that is the an opportunity cost. I've always stayed fully invested even in the depths of the dot com bust and subprime crisis.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:59 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
They play this little game where they put you on hold and pretend like they are figuring out the answer to your question. What they are really doing is running around like chickens with their heads cut off to find someone who actually knows what they are doing.


Agent: Let me, uh, speak with my supervisor.

Jerry: Uh, here we go. The supervisor. You know what she's saying over there?

Elaine: What?

Jerry: Hey Marge, you see those two people over there? They think I'm talking to you, so you pretend like you're talking to me, okay now you start talking.

Elaine: Oh, you mean like this? So it looks like I'm saying something but I'm not really saying anything at all?

Jerry: Now you say something else and they won't yell at me 'cause they thought I was checking with you.

Elaine: Okay, that's it. I think that's enough, see you later.

Agent: I'm sorry, my supervisor says there's nothing we can do.

Jerry: Yeah, it looked as if you were in a real conversation over there.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 6:27 am 
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Autocorrect messing up my damn emails.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 7:02 am 
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denisdman wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If you have more than $250k sitting in FDIC insured accounts you are doing it wrong unless you are near retirement.


Agree in full. A six month liquid reserve is prudent. Anything more than that is the an opportunity cost. I've always stayed fully invested even in the depths of the dot com bust and subprime crisis.


Of course I agree with just about everything you say about finances. So forgive me if I quibble a bit with the 6-month thing. I do believe depending on one's age and situation, for people whose jobs unexpectedly end it can still take quite some time to find an equivalent replacement. So as I grow older I go a year on the liquid reserve.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 8:24 am 
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Everyone has his own risk tolerance. So nothing wrong with holding back more. A good way to do it without sacrificing return is to get an unused home equity line of credit. That way you have extra liquidity without having to hold back so much cash.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 9:56 am 
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denisdman wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
You should get a financial adviser if that is true.


On a serious note, sound investing has some simple principles. First, you're biggest source of long term costs comes from taxes and transaction fees. Those need to be minimized to extract return. And research shows that about 85% of your long term return comes from asset allocation not individual asset selection (i.e. stocks vs bonds rather than Microsoft vs. IBM). Dollar cost averaging and diversification are the final key points.

Since very few investment houses/advisers have shown an ability to beat the market (so-called alpha) over any material time horizon, I'll take my chances with low cost mutual funds. My trading portfolio is just educated gambling mostly for fun.


Some sound advice. Much that I have read shows most advisers actually net you a negative* return after fees. The reason for you to have a complex portfolio is to make it complex to make you believe it shouldn't be done on your own. Simple is better. A great resource if you want to take a stab at DIY https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/index.php

Also insurance is not investment. Don't mix.

*negative return compared to stock market index fund


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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 10:05 am 
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TurdFerguson wrote:
Some sound advice. Much that I have read shows most advisers actually net you a negative return after fees. The reason for you to have a complex portfolio is to make it complex to make you believe it shouldn't be done on your own. Simple is better. A great resource if you want to take a stab at DIY https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/index.php
Investment management should be viewed as a service. If you have the time you can learn how to do everything yourself well but sometimes it's good to just pay someone else in a smart way.

Most of the big time firms are designed to slowly extract money from you in many ways you don't even know. They'll offer comparable options in their own company and have fees built in to what you pay and also with your investments.

We found a fee only adviser that isn't associated with one of the big time firms who simply gets a fairly low percentage of our total investments. Obviously I have to make up the difference with that to make it totally worthwhile but I also don't have to spend hours a month managing it and instead I can monitor what they are doing in real time.

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 Post subject: Re: First World Problems
PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 10:15 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
TurdFerguson wrote:
Some sound advice. Much that I have read shows most advisers actually net you a negative return after fees. The reason for you to have a complex portfolio is to make it complex to make you believe it shouldn't be done on your own. Simple is better. A great resource if you want to take a stab at DIY https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/index.php
Investment management should be viewed as a service. If you have the time you can learn how to do everything yourself well but sometimes it's good to just pay someone else in a smart way.

Most of the big time firms are designed to slowly extract money from you in many ways you don't even know. They'll offer comparable options in their own company and have fees built in to what you pay and also with your investments.

We found a fee only adviser that isn't associated with one of the big time firms who simply gets a fairly low percentage of our total investments. Obviously I have to make up the difference with that to make it totally worthwhile but I also don't have to spend hours a month managing it and instead I can monitor what they are doing in real time.


It should be viewed at a service. And if .5 AUM is provides value to you, there is nothing to make up.

Also fee only is the way to go. Also look for someone who can act with a fiduciary duty. That basically means they don't make money off of the choices they provide you with.


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