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Should non-citizens be cops?
https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=105878
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Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Should non-citizens be cops?

A friend of mine who is a local politician is fighting with the powers that be in Mt. Prospect, i.e. chief of police, town council, who want to hire non-citizens for the police force. Do you think that's a good idea?

Author:  FavreFan [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Sure, why not? Not like they would be a downgrade from US citizens.

Author:  denisdman [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.

Author:  Brick [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

No. Why would this be a debate?

Author:  KDdidit [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

No :lol: Is the applicant pool so small they have to outsource? Maybe they can line up some refugees for the force.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

FavreFan wrote:
Sure, why not? Not like they would be a downgrade from US citizens.



So as a U.S. citizen, you have no issue with a non-citizen being placed in a position of almost unlimited authority over you?

By the way, one of the arguments in favor is that non-citizens can serve in the military. I see that as an entirely different thing. In fact, I think non-citizens should be welcomed into the military as a path to citizenship and exemplary service in the U.S. military should immediately make them eligible for citizenship. But having a bunch of resident aliens firing at ISIS in a foreign land is a lot different than granting them authority to pull me over in my car.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

KDdidit wrote:
No :lol: Is the applicant pool so small they have to outsource? Maybe they can line up some refugees for the force.



That's actually one of the arguments.

Author:  Ugueth Will Shiv You [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

No. They should all apply to be garbage collectors like well-behaved aliens.

Author:  badrogue17 [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
No :lol: Is the applicant pool so small they have to outsource? Maybe they can line up some refugees for the force.



That's actually one of the arguments.

Weren't there like 20,000 applicants at McCormick Place for the CPD test last week ?

Author:  FavreFan [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Sure, why not? Not like they would be a downgrade from US citizens.



So as a U.S. citizen, you have no issue with a non-citizen being placed in a position of almost unlimited authority over you?

By the way, one of the arguments in favor is that non-citizens can serve in the military. I see that as an entirely different thing. In fact, I think non-citizens should be welcomed into the military as a path to citizenship and exemplary service in the U.S. military should immediately make them eligible for citizenship. But having a bunch of resident aliens firing at ISIS in a foreign land is a lot different than granting them authority to pull me over in my car.

My experience with US citizen cops is they are assholes. Like I said, I doubt it would be a downgrade.

What's the difference between a US citizen and a non-citizen having unlimited authority over you?

Author:  Don Tiny [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Boilermaker Rick wrote:
No. Why would this be a debate?

Put me down for that as well.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

denisdman wrote:
We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.



One of his arguments was actually pretty much that, that within the next 10-15 years with self-driving cars the need for police man power in Mt. Prospect would be greatly reduced. The people on the council- most of whom are 60+ years old- scoffed at that and acted as if he was talking about some crazy shit out of The Jetsons.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

badrogue17 wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
No :lol: Is the applicant pool so small they have to outsource? Maybe they can line up some refugees for the force.



That's actually one of the arguments.

Weren't there like 20,000 applicants at McCormick Place for the CPD test last week ?



19,000 of them were ineligible due to prior felony convictions. :lol:

Author:  conns7901 [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
No :lol: Is the applicant pool so small they have to outsource? Maybe they can line up some refugees for the force.



That's actually one of the arguments.


I don't think that is true. Particularly in the suburbs. Orland had over 130 apply for one spot a few years ago.

Author:  Juan Bad Hombre Sanchez [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
No. They should all apply to be garbage collectors like well-behaved aliens.


¿Donde puedo submitar mi aplicacion?

Author:  denisdman [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.



One of his arguments was actually pretty much that, that within the next 10-15 years with self-driving cars the need for police man power in Mt. Prospect would be greatly reduced. The people on the council- most of whom are 60+ years old- scoffed at that and acted as if he was talking about some crazy shit out of The Jetsons.


I believe your friend brought this up at the club. He looked at me strange when I said I had no problem with non-citizens as police officers. If the person is authorized to work in this country and goes through all the required training, I really don't care. Police forces are dealing with issues such as community trust and being able to communicate language wise, and I suspect having non-citizens would address some of that. In an ideal world, you want the police force to reflect the community.

Author:  ToxicMasculinity [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Juan Bad Hombre Sanchez wrote:
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
No. They should all apply to be garbage collectors like well-behaved aliens.


¿Donde puedo submitar mi aplicacion?


Llamadas 866-347-2423. Ellos requieren tu direccion de casa.

Author:  Nas [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

I wouldn't care. If they're legally allowed to work here then I don't see the issue. It's not like they are making the laws.

Author:  Bagels [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Juan Bad Hombre Sanchez wrote:
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
No. They should all apply to be garbage collectors like well-behaved aliens.


¿Donde puedo submitar mi aplicacion?



i'm slowly coming around on this mult

Author:  denisdman [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Bagels wrote:
Juan Bad Hombre Sanchez wrote:
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
No. They should all apply to be garbage collectors like well-behaved aliens.


¿Donde puedo submitar mi aplicacion?



i'm slowly coming around on this mult


Most of the mults are more interesting than their owners.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

denisdman wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.



One of his arguments was actually pretty much that, that within the next 10-15 years with self-driving cars the need for police man power in Mt. Prospect would be greatly reduced. The people on the council- most of whom are 60+ years old- scoffed at that and acted as if he was talking about some crazy shit out of The Jetsons.


I believe your friend brought this up at the club. He looked at me strange when I said I had no problem with non-citizens as police officers. If the person is authorized to work in this country and goes through all the required training, I really don't care. Police forces are dealing with issues such as community trust and being able to communicate language wise, and I suspect having non-citizens would address some of that. In an ideal world, you want the police force to reflect the community.


A police force shouldn't "reflect" the community. That's just dumb identity politics. It should actually be the community. If LaQuan McDonald is a neighbor who you watched grow up, it's probably going to be a lot harder to shoot him in the back than if you're some kind of pseudo jailer sent in from Edgebrook to run roughshod over people you don't know and don't want to know.

But I think citizenship should be a requirement if you're going to police citizens.

Author:  FavreFan [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

But I think citizenship should be a requirement if you're going to police citizens.

FavreFan wrote:
What's the difference between a US citizen and a non-citizen having unlimited authority over you?

Author:  denisdman [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Hey don't play semantics with me you closet Cubs fan. I'll slip Caller Bob a $20 and have him troll your a$$ so hard that you are begging for Scot to take control back.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

FavreFan wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:

But I think citizenship should be a requirement if you're going to police citizens.

FavreFan wrote:
What's the difference between a US citizen and a non-citizen having unlimited authority over you?


Let me answer that with a question: What does citizenship mean?

Author:  good dolphin [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

I'd take it a step further and say non citizens should hold no government employment.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

good dolphin wrote:
I'd take it a step further and say non citizens should hold no government employment.



I agree.

Author:  good dolphin [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.



One of his arguments was actually pretty much that, that within the next 10-15 years with self-driving cars the need for police man power in Mt. Prospect would be greatly reduced. The people on the council- most of whom are 60+ years old- scoffed at that and acted as if he was talking about some crazy shit out of The Jetsons.


I believe your friend brought this up at the club. He looked at me strange when I said I had no problem with non-citizens as police officers. If the person is authorized to work in this country and goes through all the required training, I really don't care. Police forces are dealing with issues such as community trust and being able to communicate language wise, and I suspect having non-citizens would address some of that. In an ideal world, you want the police force to reflect the community.


A police force shouldn't "reflect" the community. That's just dumb identity politics. It should actually be the community. If LaQuan McDonald is a neighbor who you watched grow up, it's probably going to be a lot harder to shoot him in the back than if you're some kind of pseudo jailer sent in from Edgebrook to run roughshod over people you don't know and don't want to know.

But I think citizenship should be a requirement if you're going to police citizens.


You know perfectly well the cop didn't come from Edgebrook, just his attorney.

But here is the counter to your statement, that same officer who wouldn't shoot Mc Donald if he knew him would be similarly reluctant to police his bad acts if he knew him.

Author:  JORR [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

good dolphin wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
denisdman wrote:
We don't need cops in towns like Mt Prospect and Sleepy Hollow. I am sure you told your friend that.



One of his arguments was actually pretty much that, that within the next 10-15 years with self-driving cars the need for police man power in Mt. Prospect would be greatly reduced. The people on the council- most of whom are 60+ years old- scoffed at that and acted as if he was talking about some crazy shit out of The Jetsons.


I believe your friend brought this up at the club. He looked at me strange when I said I had no problem with non-citizens as police officers. If the person is authorized to work in this country and goes through all the required training, I really don't care. Police forces are dealing with issues such as community trust and being able to communicate language wise, and I suspect having non-citizens would address some of that. In an ideal world, you want the police force to reflect the community.


A police force shouldn't "reflect" the community. That's just dumb identity politics. It should actually be the community. If LaQuan McDonald is a neighbor who you watched grow up, it's probably going to be a lot harder to shoot him in the back than if you're some kind of pseudo jailer sent in from Edgebrook to run roughshod over people you don't know and don't want to know.

But I think citizenship should be a requirement if you're going to police citizens.


You know perfectly well the cop didn't come from Edgebrook, just his attorney.

But here is the counter to your statement, that same officer who wouldn't shoot Mc Donald if he knew him would be similarly reluctant to police his bad acts if he knew him.


I disagree. I bet you yell at kids to get off your lawn all the time. I don't think that would stop if they had guns and you had a badge. Everyone wants to live in a nice neighborhood.

Author:  Nas [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

I agrer with JORR. The community would also respect them more. Revenue is the primary reason why more officers aren't policing their neighborhoods.

Author:  Regular Reader [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Should non-citizens be cops?

Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
I'd take it a step further and say non citizens should hold no government employment.



I agree.


Same here.

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