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Severance Negotiation via FMLA
https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=115494		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Ugueth Will Shiv You [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Severance Negotiation via FMLA
We've got this poor performer on our team who has been talked to numerous times over the years to ship up or ship the fuck out. It finally came to a head this quarter when we sat him down and basically said "We need to see a 180-degree improvement or we are putting you on a performance plan as of Jan 2nd."

Dude's response is to initially request that week off, stating he needs more time. We decline the request. Next, he goes to HR and submits a formal FMLA request ("I know this will give me at least a year") AND begins negotiations for a severance package as a means to separate from the company.

Research and discussions with leadership confirm this shit happens all the time... but how the hell can this be legal?
Author:  denisdman [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
FMLA is a tricky thing. We insure employment practices, so we see lots of claims from all sorts of violations. We have even had it happen internally. There are criteria where you can decline FMLA requests, and your company should follow its policies closely and document the situation. You may also want to consult an employment lawyer.

Just pay a fair severance and save yourself the headache. Hand the person a $10,000 check and save yourself the time and legal expenses. Just be sure to get a release.
Author:  Ugueth Will Shiv You [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
denisdman wrote:
FMLA is a tricky thing. We insure employment practices, so we see lots of claims from all sorts of violations. We have even had it happen internally. There are criteria where you can decline FMLA requests, and your company should follow its policies closely and document the situation. You may also want to consult an employment lawyer.

Just pay a fair severance and save yourself the headache. Hand the person a $10,000 check and save yourself the time and legal expenses. Just be sure to get a release.


End of the day I'm thinking this is how things end up. It's dirty, it's cowardice, but it's apparently not illegal.
Author:  Brick [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
It's dirty, it's cowardice, but it's apparently not illegal.
In the era of "maximizing shareholder value" I don't see a problem with an employee treating their company like garbage when they literally will do the same thing if it can raise the stock price a fraction of a penny.
Author:  Nas [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
denisdman wrote:
FMLA is a tricky thing. We insure employment practices, so we see lots of claims from all sorts of violations. We have even had it happen internally. There are criteria where you can decline FMLA requests, and your company should follow its policies closely and document the situation. You may also want to consult an employment lawyer.

Just pay a fair severance and save yourself the headache. Hand the person a $10,000 check and save yourself the time and legal expenses. Just be sure to get a release.


End of the day I'm thinking this is how things end up. It's dirty, it's cowardice, but it's apparently not illegal.


It's shrewd and the right play by that employee.
Author:  Seacrest [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
denisdman wrote:
FMLA is a tricky thing. We insure employment practices, so we see lots of claims from all sorts of violations. We have even had it happen internally. There are criteria where you can decline FMLA requests, and your company should follow its policies closely and document the situation. You may also want to consult an employment lawyer.

Just pay a fair severance and save yourself the headache. Hand the person a $10,000 check and save yourself the time and legal expenses. Just be sure to get a release.


End of the day I'm thinking this is how things end up. It's dirty, it's cowardice, but it's apparently not illegal.


Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
We've got this poor performer on our team who has been talked to numerous times over the years to ship up or ship the fuck out.


By your own admission your employer kept an under performing employee around for years and somehow he is the coward? :lol:
Author:  badrogue17 [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
I always love when the papers print the story about how short staffed Cook county jail is on holidays, big sporting event days etc because of the high % of workers using FMLA for the day off.
Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Agree with Seacrest. If you really want to and need to fire somebody, it generally is not very difficult to get a couple of write ups done on them and usually doesn't even take very long.

A few weeks ago, we had a warehouse guy we were having some issues with. Tuesday he was late 8 minutes. Wednesday he was late 8 minutes. Friday he was late 9 minutes.....GONE
(they get a 5 minute grace period to clock in on time)
Author:  Ogie Oglethorpe [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
I concur with what Frank said. Just start documenting this employee's poor performance and write him up for it.
Author:  Ugueth Will Shiv You [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ogie Oglethorpe wrote:
I concur with what Frank said. Just start documenting this employee's poor performance and write him up for it.


That's exactly what we've been doing. And to Seacrest's point (which I agree with), the company takes an obscenely long time to pull the trigger on anything, not just terminations. I'll never understand it.

To add context: this guy has also claimed discrimination in the past (completely unfounded). I imagine part of the leniency has been tiptoeing around that element.

Update: I come to learn that he told our director "it's not about the money. I've done really well with Bitcoin, so I'm set for life. I just want to wait this out."
Author:  pittmike [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
There are always going to be funny stories and abuse cases but from what I read you really can't use FMLA to avoid termination if "you were likely to be fired anyway".

My other thought was why would many want this anyway as it usually is not paid leave after exhausted sick time other than maternity is it?
Author:  Frank Coztansa [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
FMLA even for maternity leave is not paid time off.
Author:  Douchebag [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
Update: I come to learn that he told our director "it's not about the money. I've done really well with Bitcoin, so I'm set for life. I just want to wait this out."

:lol: :lol:

This guy is so full of shit. Can this scumbag.
Author:  Seacrest [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
Update: I come to learn that he told our director "it's not about the money. I've done really well with Bitcoin, so I'm set for life. I just want to wait this out."


JORR never mentioned that the two of you worked together.

I'd fire his ass.
Author:  Peoria Matt [ Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Severance Negotiation via FMLA
Seacrest wrote:
Ugueth Will Shiv You wrote:
Update: I come to learn that he told our director "it's not about the money. I've done really well with Bitcoin, so I'm set for life. I just want to wait this out."


JORR never mentioned that the two of you worked together.

I'd fire his ass.


:lol:
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