If you really care about income inequality, you would support collective bargaining, including the strike.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/ ... 338281001/

No.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Reading the link I am not gleaning the demands very clearly. I see general conditions, sanitation (custodians?) want more than their 15 an hour and generally no raise for years. Is that about it other than they want a piece of the 8-10 billion profit GM made? I am not against that per se just wondered as I haven't see a strike like this in a long time.

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Elections have consequences.

UAW's top demands
UAW members seek job security, protecting their benefits and a base wage boost.

According to the Center for Automotive Research, average hourly wages in the U.S. auto industry peaked in September 2010 and since then have slid 2.1% and plummeted 16% in inflation-adjusted terms. Even senior UAW workers have seen just two 3% wage hikes in that time frame.
In November 2018, GM angered workers when it "unallocated" product to four U.S. plants, indefinitely idling them and affecting thousands of union jobs — though one of them, Detroit-Hamtramck, continues to operate. Most of the workers at the other factories have had to transfer to GM jobs, sometimes in other parts of the country, if they want to stay with the automaker.
The UAW has vowed to fight to get GM to assign new vehicles to the four plants: Lordstown Assembly in Ohio, Detroit-Hamtramck and transmission plants in Warren and Baltimore.
The union also wants the automaker to create a path for temporary employees to become permanent.
The union has long loathed the tiered wage scale. It wants to create an equitable pay scale for all workers by shortening the gap it takes for a worker hired after 2007 to catch up with the wages of those hired before 2007.

The UAW as an organization is a corrupt pile of shit. They exist to perform dog and pony shows for the US CoC and force bad deals down their members throats.

Want to support the worker? Have them vote to decertify and replace it with something pro-worker

A private sector union, any private sector union, needs a win. The middle class needs a win. The government coming in, filling the void with minimum wage, the government coming in, claiming overtaxing the upper class will compensate for income inequality, will be a complete and utter failure.

^ Bootlicker

The UAW, as an organization, serves the corporate interests (CoC, piece of shit Paul Ryan when he was a rep... etc) and not the worker. That should be obvious.

Instead of "awww shucks! Better take the deal! It's the best we could do!" why wasn't the UAW working towards ending the industrial partnerships that China demands in exchange for market access? Anyone with a brain could see the endgame and where it leads...but here we are. How about closed markets like S. Korea? Why did GM have to purchase Daewoo and rebadge Chevy's for years for access there?

Yet, here we are.

That's pie in the sky thinking at the present. Get this in your pocket FIRST. Because first things first.

legitimate good workers unknowingly take huge income hits being a part of a union. hard pass.

SOOOO shortsighted.

There was no middle class before unions and there won't be after unions.

If I were in the UAW I would want a raise after only getting two over the last 10 years, but no matter how this comes out for them, I fear they're playing a losing game for several reasons:

1. The more they make, the more attractive it's going to become to move these jobs elsewhere;
2. Most people I know under the age of 40 would never even consider buying a car from the Big 3;
3. Automation, robots, and AI are going to decrease auto worker jobs over time; and
4. I'm assuming that they make more than workers building the Camry in Kentucky, the Accord in Ohio, or the Sonata in Alabama, but is
their finished product any better? If they want a premium in pay they should add value over what other automakers get from their
workers, and I'm not sure that they do.

These workers have to know that this career path is dwindling quickly for reasons that are larger than this contract negotiation, and that these forces are not going to stop anytime soon.

Some hard truths in there. Still....gotta fight for it and then make plans to get out. Easier said than done, since changing careers for the average person is about as easy as MJ taking on baseball.

My prediction is that the white-collar professional jobs are next. They'll fire you and hire two replacements at half the cost.

The UAW was a large reason the federal government had to save the Big 3 from going away. I won't root for them now.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Yeah but the fight is like going at a windmill. As was pointed out the factories of other makers prove for the most part Michigan is unnecessary. I am not saying it is right but as long as states underwrite new factories with welfare and workers will work for 2/3 the pay/benefits of Michigan well that is what will happen.

And there is a part of the previous post that is sad and unfair really. Big 3 vehicles are so much better and changed that there is no reason people under 40 shouldn't consider them. Beside GM is obviously profitable.

As for raises I do not have time to get the facts o feel free to fill me in... When a union worker complains of no raise for 5 years sometimes that is misleading. They may have gotten a 8% raise or equal benefits adds in the last contract and that would average out to CPI for ten years. Many average Americans do better than 2% a year without changing jobs.

Lastly, the union needs to let go of the "sanitation" situation altogether. That was a joke since I was a kid about how Detroit is fucked because a guy pushing a broom makes 60K with a pension. Contract that shit out like everyone else and treat the people that actually make carts, parts etc fairly.

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Elections have consequences.

Amen

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That or a massive recession where nobody was buying vehicles for 8 years..Those loans all paid pack, how bout those bank bailouts?

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It probably already happens unless you have very special industry specific experience.

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Elections have consequences.

Even them guys is next, I think....when possible.

Except the guys 'making' the cars and parts aren't doing that much more than the guy cleaning the bathrooms.

The engine lines are completely automated with FMS cells. The gears are all handled with multi-tasking CNC and gear machines. The press lines handle all the body stampings. The assembly lines are almost all automated, with workers performing some quick basic welds or applying some small fixtures.

The engineers have designed the plant automation to be somewhat fool proof. The line workers aren't a bunch of skilled tradesmen. They are monitoring machines waiting for the moment once a week where they have to hit an e-stop.

GM vehicles are just fine right now. Ford crossovers and trucks are just fine right now.

But we've been in a golden age for vehicles for almost a decade now. Every manufacturer is 'just fine' or better.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

The unions need to get away from the Dems, we need to pool our money and support legit candidates and form a third party..A labor party.

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Are you aware those loans were paid back in full, with interest, and early?

Why is it hard to "root" for collective bargaining?

Unless you're easily replaced, an individual should have no problem negotiating his own raises and benefits.

Why should someone get automatic raises? Why should 50 people with the same title all get paid the same if their performances are different? Why should tenure dictate who gets paid more?

This is the era of Glassdoor. Social media. Company exposes. Unions are archaic. They are rackets.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

The easily replaced did get easily replaced. Thanks to right to work laws, trade agreements, and massive immigration. Now people have multiple jobs and government has to step in to double the minimum wage. Going from archaic to insane doesn't seem viable.

I have no problem with the loans. I have a problem with the fact that the UAW caused them to be needed based on not accepting that the economics had changed in the auto industry.

The Big 3 had no chance having to provide compensation like it was the 1950s with no real foreign competition and having to beg to be able to automate things in their factories.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Plenty of blame to go around here....this is a mess where BRICK, Nardi, IMU, and 312Player are all correct.

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Let it go. These are your fellow Americans. Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater

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Elections have consequences.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Many non-union workers were almost brought down by them literally demanding more for decades in an economic situation that was obviously completely unsustainable. If the Big 3 had folded there would have been devastating impacts to millions of people who weren't members of the UAW. The UAW knew and didn't care that the Big 3 could not compete with the foreign automakers with their demands but they also knew that a prolonged strike would have accelerated the collapse even more.

I mean, I get it if your counter is "Unions should get as much as they can whenever they can and they shouldn't be willing to accept a sustainable deal" but they aren't going to get sympathy when we see the end result and then are engaged in further negotiations.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!