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| Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=79481 |
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| Author: | conns7901 [ Wed May 29, 2013 11:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
SO what percentage of these people could actually work? 50, 70 Percent? Or I am I completely off and few people are abusing the system? Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability; ‘Disability’ Would Be 8th Most Populous State May 29, 2013 - 9:52 AM By Terence P. Jeffrey (CNSNews.com) - The total number of people in the United States now receiving federal disability benefits hit a record 10,978,040 in May, up from 10,962,532 million in April, according to newly released data from the Social Security Administration. The 10,978,040 disability beneficiaries in the United States now exceed the population of all but seven states. For example, there are more Americans collecting disability today than there are people living in Georgia, Michigan, North Carolina, New Jersey or Virginia. The record 10,978,040 total disability beneficiaries in May, included a record 8,877,921 disabled workers (up from 8,865,586 in April), a record 1,939,687 children of disabled workers (up from 1,936,236 in April), and 160,432 spouses of disabled workers. May was the 196th straight month that the number of American workers collecting federal disability payments increased. The last time the number of Americans collecting disability decreased was in January 1997. That month the number of workers taking disability dropped by 249 people—from 4,385,623 in December 1996 to 4,385,374 in January 1997. As the overall number of American workers collecting disability has increased, the ratio of full-time workers to disability-collecting workers has decreased. In December 1968, 1,295,428 American workers collected disability and, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 65,630,000 worked full-time. Thus, there were about 51 full-time workers for each worker collecting disability. In May 2013, with a record 8,877,921 American workers collecting disability and 116,053,000 working full-time, there were only 13 Americans working full-time for each worker on disability. According to the latest Census Bureau population estimates, if disability were a state in the union it would rank eighth in population, coming in after Ohio but ahead of Georgia: |
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| Author: | SomeGuy [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
They don't get counted in the labor force and they aren't counted as unemployed. It's a pretty good way to hide people from U-3/U-6 numbers. |
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| Author: | Rod [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. |
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| Author: | bigfan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Add that to the "dropped out" number and give me another 1 % for the underemployed (very generous I might add) and this country could be so fucked when they stop the government ATM. Look out people! |
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| Author: | Rod [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
bigfan wrote: Add that to the "dropped out" number and give me another 1 % for the underemployed (very generous I might add) and this country could be so fucked when they stop the government ATM. Look out people! I guess if that happens we'll see true "survival of the fittest". |
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| Author: | SomeGuy [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. What are you actually trying to say here? Do you have statistics that support your claim? |
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| Author: | bigfan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. I have been here for years saying that Obama is digging such a big hole for mostly the people who voted for him! So when he is done the people who supported him will hate him and the people who already hated him will continue to hate him. Crash coming. Look out! The single best thing the economy has going for it is that every other market sucks far worse than the US! |
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| Author: | bigfan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: bigfan wrote: Add that to the "dropped out" number and give me another 1 % for the underemployed (very generous I might add) and this country could be so fucked when they stop the government ATM. Look out people! I guess if that happens we'll see true "survival of the fittest". 30 year mortgages creeping up! just a sign. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. -As unemployment benefits run out, people gravitate towards disability. This recession has resulted in an unusually high number of long term unemployed. -The labor force has shifted from lots of manual tasks to desk jobs. This would seem to suggest that the average worker faces less hazardous risk. That makes it even harder to reconcile the ongoing increase as a percentage of the labor force. -Once on disability, people rarely leave. The WSJ has had several good articles on the system. This includes a lot of lawyers who fight the government's determination that an individual does not qualify. The courts that handle these matters often overturn the government's decision. I was reading an article today on the expansion of Medicaid in IL. I was shocked to read in the article that 25% of people in IL are on Medicaid. I went to the Medicaid for IL website and read the last annual report. That report said 20% are on Medicaid. They just expanded it, so that number will only go up. There are a lot of benefits that people earn- Social Security, unemployment, workers comp, etc. But these items are still a drain on the system. When you start adding all the people draining vs all the people contributing, one has to think the system is due for a collapse. |
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| Author: | Rod [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
SomeGuy wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. What are you actually trying to say here? Do you have statistics that support your claim? What I'm trying to say is that worrying about people "gaming" the system for a couple hundred bucks a week is a canard used by the ultra-rich to keep the middle class that they are fucking in the ass in their corner instead of with the down and out where they belong. Look at it this way. If there was a kindergarten with 30 kids and the teacher gave out candy and the biggest strongest fattest kid took 90% of the candy, most people would say that kid was wrong, think he was a jerk-off, and hate his guts. But when we grow up, most of us cheerlead the fat kid and wish we could be like him even though he's never gonna let that happen. And he's just a fucking parasite grabbing most of our candy. |
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| Author: | Douchebag [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
bigfan wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. I have been here for years saying that Obama is digging such a big hole for mostly the people who voted for him! So when he is done the people who supported him will hate him and the people who already hated him will continue to hate him. Crash coming. Look out! The single best thing the economy has going for it is that every other market sucks far worse than the US! This has little to do with Obama. Disability numbers have been increasing for 196 straight months since 1997. You're acting as if Chas' free ride started when Obama was sworn in. This has been a problem for decades, and it's only going to get worse. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. Im not sure about that JORR. Most of them have jobs (via nepotism and they probably do nothing, but still) How should we change things? I think the rich probably pay enough in taxes (before loopholes are exploited) |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. Dennis, you say some wacky shit sometimes. You really put off a "I work hard and pretty much no one else does" vibe. |
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| Author: | SomeGuy [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Douchebag wrote: bigfan wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. I have been here for years saying that Obama is digging such a big hole for mostly the people who voted for him! So when he is done the people who supported him will hate him and the people who already hated him will continue to hate him. Crash coming. Look out! The single best thing the economy has going for it is that every other market sucks far worse than the US! This has nothing to do with Obama. Disability numbers have been increasing for 196 straight months since 1997. You're acting as if Chas' free ride started when Obama was sworn in. This has been a problem for decades, and it's only going to get worse. This is a partial result of welfare reform from the 90's, those roles went down and disability went up. This is where people get hidden that either don't have the skills to find other work, got cut at a later stage of life, are gaming the system and of course those that actually have disability. It makes unemployment numbers look better (that's relative) as well. There is a whole industry dedicated to winning disability claims, no matter how dubious. Plus, I think the government doesn't actually get its own lawyer to speak on its behalf, I believe that falls to the S.S. judge. And JORR, no need for the analogies, I get what your saying and agree somewhat. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
He's got a point. Anyone can get on disability. All you need is a doctor to verify so ailment. Uncle Sam won't contest the issue before a judge. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. All systems of government have rich and poor. There are people in North Korea and Cuba who do very well. I long ago realized you can't make the poor better off by dragging down the wealthy. The reason I support free markets and limited government is because that is the best way to ensure the total pie is large. The wealthy are always going to have the a disproportionate share of the pie, that's why they're wealthy. Europe and Japan probably had the best examples of countries that balanced free markets and social spending to help the poor. But those bills are coming due now, and you see the mess in those countries. Japan has been slowly dying for over 20 years. Europe is just entering a prolonged period of slow growth and austerity to try to pay for their promises. Europe's economies outside of Germany are largely uncompetitive because of government policies on taxation, regulation, and labor laws. These models only work in the short term. The U.S. is facing significant structural problems. I have read many books and articles are why the rich keep getting a bigger piece of the pie. It comes down to the sheer size of our multinational companies and the money to be made in running those companies or in running financial vehicles like hedge funds. Stephen Cohen of SAC Capital is earning wealthy people 30% a year, and thus they are willing to pay him a 2% fee and 50% of the profits. Thus he is a billionaire several times over. People who are very skilled or very smart have the ability to make lots of money for other people, and those other people are willing to pay that person lots of money. |
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| Author: | Curious Hair [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. So bipolar disorder and paranoid schizophrenia are tantamount to a sore back. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: SomeGuy wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. What are you actually trying to say here? Do you have statistics that support your claim? What I'm trying to say is that worrying about people "gaming" the system for a couple hundred bucks a week is a canard used by the ultra-rich to keep the middle class that they are fucking in the ass in their corner instead of with the down and out where they belong. Look at it this way. If there was a kindergarten with 30 kids and the teacher gave out candy and the biggest strongest fattest kid took 90% of the candy, most people would say that kid was wrong, think he was a jerk-off, and hate his guts. But when we grow up, most of us cheerlead the fat kid and wish we could be like him even though he's never gonna let that happen. And he's just a fucking parasite grabbing most of our candy. Bad analogy. Bill Gates, Steve Balmer, and Paul Allen made many secretaries rich when they took Microsoft public. The company employs ten of thousands of people in high paying jobs (94,000 total employees). Their shareholders benefited from all the profits that resulted in the share price rising. Companies and individuals around the world were more productive as desktop computers were available to most people. Most of use are better off. They won the most and are rightly billionaires. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Curious Hair wrote: denisdman wrote: A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. So bipolar disorder and paranoid schizophrenia are tantamount to a sore back. Nope. Anxiety would be a good example. Stress. Insomnia. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: SomeGuy wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. What are you actually trying to say here? Do you have statistics that support your claim? What I'm trying to say is that worrying about people "gaming" the system for a couple hundred bucks a week is a canard used by the ultra-rich to keep the middle class that they are fucking in the ass in their corner instead of with the down and out where they belong. Look at it this way. If there was a kindergarten with 30 kids and the teacher gave out candy and the biggest strongest fattest kid took 90% of the candy, most people would say that kid was wrong, think he was a jerk-off, and hate his guts. But when we grow up, most of us cheerlead the fat kid and wish we could be like him even though he's never gonna let that happen. And he's just a fucking parasite grabbing most of our candy. Bad analogy. Bill Gates, Steve Balmer, and Paul Allen made many secretaries rich when they took Microsoft public. The company employs ten of thousands of people in high paying jobs (94,000 total employees). Their shareholders benefited from all the profits that resulted in the share price rising. Companies and individuals around the world were more productive as desktop computers were available to most people. Most of use are better off. They won the most and are rightly billionaires. And for every Bill Gates, there are 1000 rich guys who make their money specifically by fucking people over so save the heroic rich people tales. You understand, this country was founded on the idea that all are equal. Generational wealth is America's Royalty |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
rogers park bryan wrote: denisdman wrote: A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. Dennis, you say some wacky shit sometimes. You really put off a "I work hard and pretty much no one else does" vibe. I didn't mean for it to come off that way. I just got done reading how UIC (where I graduated from) is now going to pay for sex change operations. I thought about that for a moment, and I guess why not? Literally, everyone in our society is screwed in some way, and we all use victim hood to our own advantage. You see it everywhere. A recent examples that bother me: College students who run up six figure law school debts and then sue the law school when they can't find a job. |
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| Author: | Seacrest [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: rogers park bryan wrote: denisdman wrote: A few thoughts: -Everyone in our society is a victim and thus deserving of special treatment. We have expanded the definition of disability to include things that are hard to diagnose or dispute. Examples are back pain and mental conditions. Dennis, you say some wacky shit sometimes. You really put off a "I work hard and pretty much no one else does" vibe. I didn't mean for it to come off that way. I just got done reading how UIC (where I graduated from) is now going to pay for sex change operations. I thought about that for a moment, and I guess why not? Literally, everyone in our society is screwed in some way, and we all use victim hood to our own advantage. You see it everywhere. A recent examples that bother me: College students who run up six figure law school debts and then sue the law school when they can't find a job. I found out after I filed my taxes that celiac disease is a disability and all gluten free food I buy would have been tax deductible. Oh snap. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
rogers park bryan wrote: You understand, this country was founded on the idea that all are equal. Generational wealth is America's Royalty That's fine. But the way to correct generational wealth is to give private assets to the government. So when Joe farmer dies, give the farm back to uncle sam. His sons and daughters have no right to it. When the guy who owns the Chevy dealership down the road dies, same thing. I guess I don't agree with legally earned wealth being handed over to the government when the patriarch dies. Many people agree with you though that we should. |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
I get it when people think my ideas are crazy. I am a Libertarian. I make no secret of that. I don't believe in a large role for the Federal government. I have reasons for what I believe, and hopefully my posts show that. I also read a lot of books and publications to stay informed. I despise ill gotten wealth because I believe in the rule of law. I believe in equality of opportunities but not in equality of outcomes. Our system is punishing the poor by not giving them a good education, and thus I am saddened by the lack of equality of opportunities. How would I correct that, well vouchers to create school competition. For as bad as our system is, folks still need to understand that with only 4% of the world's population, we have 21% of economic output. That is an amazing statistic. |
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| Author: | Hatchetman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
The great thing is we no longer need support from our families, churches, and communities. Uncle Sam provides everything we need! |
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| Author: | denisdman [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
RPB always makes me feel bad. I respect his opinions. I guess I'm just a whack job. |
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| Author: | Seacrest [ Wed May 29, 2013 12:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: I get it when people think my ideas are crazy. I am a Libertarian. I make no secret of that. I don't believe in a large role for the Federal government. I have reasons for what I believe, and hopefully my posts show that. I also read a lot of books and publications to stay informed. I despise ill gotten wealth because I believe in the rule of law. I believe in equality of opportunities but not in equality of outcomes. Our system is punishing the poor by not giving them a good education, and thus I am saddened by the lack of equality of opportunities. How would I correct that, well vouchers to create school competition. For as bad as our system is, folks still need to understand that with only 4% of the world's population, we have 21% of economic output. That is an amazing statistic. I'm not sure that anyone thinks what you posted is even remotely crazy. Our system is punishing the poor far more than any damage being done by the trust fund babies. |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Wed May 29, 2013 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
denisdman wrote: RPB always makes me feel bad. I respect his opinions. I guess I'm just a whack job. That is not my intention I just disagree with some things you say. If I didnt respect you, Id just ignore you. Im not a fan or government either, I guess where we differ is you see the Super Rich as citizens fighting the government and I see them as PART OF the government |
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| Author: | chaspoppcap [ Wed May 29, 2013 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Douchebag wrote: bigfan wrote: Joe Orr Road Rod wrote: Whatever the percentage is, I'd gather the percentage of trust fund babies that could actually work is much higher. The wealthy are parasites grabbing far more than their fair share. I have been here for years saying that Obama is digging such a big hole for mostly the people who voted for him! So when he is done the people who supported him will hate him and the people who already hated him will continue to hate him. Crash coming. Look out! The single best thing the economy has going for it is that every other market sucks far worse than the US! This has little to do with Obama. Disability numbers have been increasing for 196 straight months since 1997. You're acting as if Chas' free ride started when Obama was sworn in. This has been a problem for decades, and it's only going to get worse. I was waiting for me to be brought into this. I am not a "free ride" I am on SSDI,it means I am basically collecting my SS early. I worked until I was no longer able to. I do what I can now because I can not stand to just sit and home and do nothing. One of the reasons I do charity work as well. I paid into the system. Sorry I got fucked up and had to use it. Trust me I would rather be working like I used to. I made good money and now not so much. The bad thing is because when I worked I made good money so now my monthly payments make me ineligible for most services because I am not considered poor enough. I get food stamps ,wanna know how much? $16 a month. When I first applied the lady that was doing my interview looked me square in the eye and told me I was the wrong color and sex to expect much help from the govt. The disability problem/liability is SSi,it is for people who have never worked. They have not paid into the system. They get around $690 a mont hplus add in $260 in Food Stamps then add in the help they get with Utilities and housing and that is where the problems are. You should see the conditions they let people on for now. Asthma,all kinds of basic bullshit. I mean you can get on disability for being obese. That my friends is fucked up |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Wed May 29, 2013 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Record 10,978,040 Now on Disability |
Seacrest wrote: denisdman wrote: I get it when people think my ideas are crazy. I am a Libertarian. I make no secret of that. I don't believe in a large role for the Federal government. I have reasons for what I believe, and hopefully my posts show that. I also read a lot of books and publications to stay informed. I despise ill gotten wealth because I believe in the rule of law. I believe in equality of opportunities but not in equality of outcomes. Our system is punishing the poor by not giving them a good education, and thus I am saddened by the lack of equality of opportunities. How would I correct that, well vouchers to create school competition. For as bad as our system is, folks still need to understand that with only 4% of the world's population, we have 21% of economic output. That is an amazing statistic. I'm not sure that anyone thinks what you posted is even remotely crazy. Our system is punishing the poor far more than any damage being done by the trust fund babies. Can you elaborate on that? Dont the trust fund babies (or their parents) run the system? |
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