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SCOTUS https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=94670 |
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Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 9:47 am ] |
Post subject: | SCOTUS |
Damn. Scalia's dissenting opinion on this is something to read. I tend to think he is correct. Scalia wrote: This is a naked judicial claim to legislative—indeed, super-legislative—power; a claim fundamentally at odds with our system of government. Except as limited by a constitutional prohibition agreed to by the People, the States are free to adopt whatever laws they like, even those that offend the esteemed Justices’ “reasoned judg- ment.” A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.
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Author: | Hatchetman [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 9:54 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
SCOTUS blowing this thing up would be a more radical intrusion into the legislative process IMO. |
Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:00 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
He's really BRick-ing the opinion. Scalia wrote: The opinion is couched in a style that is as pretentious as its content is egotistic. It is one thing for separate con- curring or dissenting opinions to contain extravagances, even silly extravagances, of thought and expression; it is something else for the official opinion of the Court to do so.22 Of course the opinion’s showy profundities are often profoundly incoherent. “The nature of marriage is that, through its enduring bond, two persons together can find other freedoms, such as expression, intimacy, and spiritu- ality.”23 (Really? Who ever thought that intimacy and spirituality [whatever that means] were freedoms? And if intimacy is, one would think Freedom of Intimacy is abridged rather than expanded by marriage. Ask the nearest hippie. Expression, sure enough, is a freedom, but anyone in a long-lasting marriage will attest that that happy state constricts, rather than expands, what one can prudently say.) Rights, we are told, can “rise . . . from a better informed understanding of how constitutional imperatives define a liberty that remains urgent in our own era.”24 (Huh? How can a better informed under- standing of how constitutional imperatives [whatever that means] define [whatever that means] an urgent liberty [never mind], give birth to a right?) And we are told that, “[i]n any particular case,” either the Equal Protection or Due Process Clause “may be thought to capture the es- sence of [a] right in a more accurate and comprehensive way,” than the other, “even as the two Clauses may con- verge in the identification and definition of the right.”25 (What say? What possible “essence” does substantive due process “capture” in an “accurate and comprehensive way”? It stands for nothing whatever, except those free- doms and entitlements that this Court really likes. And the Equal Protection Clause, as employed today, identifies nothing except a difference in treatment that this Court really dislikes. Hardly a distillation of essence. If the opinion is correct that the two clauses “converge in the identification and definition of [a] right,” that is only because the majority’s likes and dislikes are predictably compatible.) I could go on. The world does not expect logic and precision in poetry or inspirational pop- philosophy; it demands them in the law. The stuff con- tained in today’s opinion has to diminish this Court’s reputation for clear thinking and sober analysis. Scalia wrote: If, even as the price to be paid for a fifth vote, I ever joined an opin- ion for the Court that began: “The Constitution promises liberty to all within its reach, a liberty that includes certain specific rights thatallow persons, within a lawful realm, to define and express their identity,” I would hide my head in a bag. The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie. ![]() ![]() |
Author: | Curious Hair [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:01 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
All the Catholic males opposed gay marriage. |
Author: | Don Tiny [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:03 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Thanks to "A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers", black people don't have to deal with lawfully segregated schools and drinking fountains, for example. Scalia's a prick and simply wrote a political screed, which isn't his job at all. All the court did was rule - as they have several times in the past in other various cases - in favor of the 'spirit of the law' ... nothing new was done, no precedent set. |
Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:06 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
I'm all for gay marriage. I hope everyone gets the gay and gets married to each other. But, this just feels like an end around to get it done. It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. |
Author: | Hatchetman [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:07 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. which decision are you talking about here? |
Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:11 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Hatchetman wrote: Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. which decision are you talking about here? The Opinion of the Court on gay marriage. Quote: The nature of injustice is that we may not always see it in our own times. The generations that wrote and ratified the Bill of Rights and the Fourteenth Amendment did not presume to know the extent of freedom in all of its dimen- sions, and so they entrusted to future generations a char- ter protecting the right of all persons to enjoy liberty as we learn its meaning. When new insight reveals discord between the Constitution’s central protections and a re- ceived legal stricture, a claim to liberty must be addressed.
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Author: | Hatchetman [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:12 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
but court should make policy on ACA? |
Author: | Don Tiny [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:13 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: I'm all for gay marriage. I hope everyone gets the gay and gets married to each other. But, this just feels like an end around to get it done. It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. ??? It did come from the legislature; the judiciary verified what the legislature said albeit in a less than ideal, but still obvious, way. I fail to see what your point is. Scalia's prattle is nothing more than some asshole in a bar talking loudly to hear himself talk, not to make any salient point. |
Author: | Reared on the Score [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:14 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: I'm all for gay marriage. I hope everyone gets the gay and gets married to each other. But, this just feels like an end around to get it done. It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. isn't it in the legislature...as marriage? what also came from the legislature was the same-sex bans, which is what the courts are ruling on. |
Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:15 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Don Tiny wrote: Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: I'm all for gay marriage. I hope everyone gets the gay and gets married to each other. But, this just feels like an end around to get it done. It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. ??? It did come from the legislature; the judiciary verified what the legislature said albeit in a less than ideal, but still obvious, way. I fail to see what your point is. Scalia's prattle is nothing more than some asshole in a bar talking loudly to hear himself talk, not to make any salient point. I just thought Scalia was funny. He went off the edge in response. I see your point. |
Author: | billypootons [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:18 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
divorce lawyers are happy |
Author: | pittmike [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:18 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
The court was right in simply saying you cannot ban gay marriage. Therefore, other states must respect those. Therefore, if you cannot ban it then it is legal. Whatever, government should not be in marriage anyway other than at the state level to register it for tax or divorce reasons. |
Author: | Dr. Kenneth Noisewater [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:21 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
I'm happy with the result but the ruling felt a bit broad to me. I guess I'm in the minority. Carry on. |
Author: | pittmike [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:23 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: I'm happy with the result but the ruling felt a bit broad to me. I guess I'm in the minority. Carry on. I was more baffled yesterday actually but on this ruling I do not think many feel strongly as most thing it should be legal. But what do I know I am just a drunk, Fox/Drudge/Limbaugh/Hannity right wing whacko. ![]() |
Author: | Hatchetman [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
"Christians" will now have to find some other issue with which to alienate everybody else with. |
Author: | Tall Midget [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:26 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Don Tiny wrote: Thanks to "A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers", black people don't have to deal with lawfully segregated schools and drinking fountains, for example. Scalia's a prick and simply wrote a political screed, which isn't his job at all. All the court did was rule - as they have several times in the past in other various cases - in favor of the 'spirit of the law' ... nothing new was done, no precedent set. Scalia has previously said that he thinks that Plessy v. Ferguson should be the governing decision on segregation. |
Author: | SomeGuy [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:29 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Hatchetman wrote: "Christians" will now have to find some other issue with which to alienate everybody else with. The Catholic church will probably be changing its view on gay marriage sooner than you think. |
Author: | Hatchetman [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:35 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
SomeGuy wrote: The Catholic church will probably be changing its view on gay marriage sooner than you think. Not gonna happen and that's fine. They just need to STFU about it. |
Author: | America [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:45 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Scalia is fucking hilarious and I love him for it. He's actually technically correct here but look at the laws congress has passed since St. Ronnie sold the country. If you wanted them to tackle this it would've taken another 5 years and there'd be a trillion dollars worth of subsidies built in for Halliburton to administer the marriages. |
Author: | Nas [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:58 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Tall Midget wrote: Don Tiny wrote: Thanks to "A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers", black people don't have to deal with lawfully segregated schools and drinking fountains, for example. Scalia's a prick and simply wrote a political screed, which isn't his job at all. All the court did was rule - as they have several times in the past in other various cases - in favor of the 'spirit of the law' ... nothing new was done, no precedent set. Scalia has previously said that he thinks that Plessy v. Ferguson should be the governing decision on segregation. I'm almost positive he said he would have joined John Marshall. His views aren't surprising. He doesn't believe that the constitution is a living document. |
Author: | Curious Hair [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:00 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Much like Bill Maher, Scalia will either give you indisputable truth or wacky bullshit. These days I think we're getting more wacky bullshit from the Supreme Court justice. |
Author: | Don Tiny [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:00 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: Don Tiny wrote: Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: I'm all for gay marriage. I hope everyone gets the gay and gets married to each other. But, this just feels like an end around to get it done. It should come from the legislature, not a redefinition from the judicial branch. ??? It did come from the legislature; the judiciary verified what the legislature said albeit in a less than ideal, but still obvious, way. I fail to see what your point is. Scalia's prattle is nothing more than some asshole in a bar talking loudly to hear himself talk, not to make any salient point. I just thought Scalia was funny. He went off the edge in response. I see your point. Oh; I see. Nevermind ![]() |
Author: | Nas [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:04 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Curious Hair wrote: Much like Bill Maher, Scalia will either give you indisputable truth or wacky bullshit. These days I think we're getting more wacky bullshit from the Supreme Court justice. Scalia has been fairly consistent. Tell me what the case is and I will be able to tell you how he will rule. |
Author: | Nas [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:12 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
I was right. http://www.wsj.com/articles/BL-LB-21307 |
Author: | sjboyd0137 [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:21 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
I keep reading this as SCROTUM |
Author: | Chus [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Nas wrote: Tall Midget wrote: Don Tiny wrote: Thanks to "A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers", black people don't have to deal with lawfully segregated schools and drinking fountains, for example. Scalia's a prick and simply wrote a political screed, which isn't his job at all. All the court did was rule - as they have several times in the past in other various cases - in favor of the 'spirit of the law' ... nothing new was done, no precedent set. Scalia has previously said that he thinks that Plessy v. Ferguson should be the governing decision on segregation. I'm almost positive he said he would have joined John Marshall. His views aren't surprising. He doesn't believe that the constitution is a living document. To be fair to Scalia, it has been a long time since Jesus wrote the Constitution. |
Author: | Nas [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:25 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
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Author: | Seacrest [ Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:26 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: SCOTUS |
Curious Hair wrote: All the Catholic males opposed gay marriage. Incorrect. |
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