Documentary on Scientology that's making waves, simply because Scientologists cannot stomach any criticism about their "religion" and go after everyone that has anything bad to say. It's no coincidence that every defector from the church rails about what goes on behind closed doors. I've watched a few documentaries and read various things on the background (from l. ron's bio to the stories about lisa mcpherson and jeremy perkins) and it doesn't take much to be convinced that this is a dangerous group of people. what it does take a lot of, to me, is convincing that this is something *good* for you. i've watched their propaganda film "psychiatry: an industry of death" and it is hilarious how they accuse the industry of psychiatry for practically the same thing they do (brainwashing, intensely defensive and combatant from criticism, think they're above everything)...and completely shameless that they bring in things like eugenics and the holocaust to prove their point that psychiatry is evil.

air date on HBO is 3/29. definitely going to check it out.

I have never learned enough about this and have only seen the sensational stuff. Might check this out.

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Elections have consequences.

It's kinda scary.

And they are dangerous people, poke around for stories on ex-members who spoke out or tried to speak out. Scientology will come after you.

I read the book about a year ago by this guy, and it had a lot of interesting stuff in it. Wright also did a book and HBO documentary on Al-Qaeda and the rise of Islamic fundamentalists over the past 30-40 years. Another good recommendation if you like this film.

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A friend of mine got into this goofy shit about 5 years ago. Made him a different person and not for the better.

hubbard reminds me a bit of joseph smith (the founder of mormonism) but quite a lot more sadistic...and probably a lot more talented and imaginative. hubbard was extremely possessive about his past, his achievements and rewrote much of his own history.

scooter, i'm not surprised. everyone's story is the same. scientology becomes a way of life, and you pretty much leave your own behind, especially if you join sea org. there just doesn't seem to be anything to gain from joining, and so many people who join are former convicts or addicts of some kind...when you're audited you give away all of your secrets, and the church uses that against you--especially if you leave. they will harass you until, in some cases, you take your own life.

i've never seen such a litigious bunch either.

One thing that seems odd to me about this is how it stays alive. In today's society there is I am ok you are ok and views opposed to doing what you want get pretty hammered. So if a "religion" had odd shit going on like the Catholic Church you would think the media especially enquirer types would be all over this shit.

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Elections have consequences.

I think it's odd how it attracts so much money to support it.

It seems to be a weird cult. Speaking of the Mormons,wife and I were out for a stroll couple weeks ago. Saw a couple young guys walking toward us. Religious cooks I told her. Sure enough as they approached us one said Hello can I give you a card? Not interested I said. Well you need to check out Mormon.org the guy said. I told him I was already blessed enough for one day and asked him if he had a peddlers liscence to be trolling the town soliciting people. Later saw him getting into a police car a couple blocks away. Wonder if the Lord paid his fine.

I think it's somewhat amusing that we're going to have a thread bashing Scientology without the slightest dissent, but if someone posts criticism of a different religion that controls wide swaths of territory and practices genocide, he'll quickly be called a bigot. The only difference between a cult and a religion is the number of subscribers.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

Pretty fair point by you.

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Elections have consequences.

all religions begin as cults...including jesus and his band of fanboys. but there's usually a positive connotation with religion--like it's not going to come after you if you leave it. you won't get sued, or attacked, just because you're no longer with a church. i don't think any religion's history has done that besides scientology.

pitt, i'm sure they're able to make it sound attractive to those who really have nowhere to go. scientology has a pretty good rate of getting addicts off drugs/alcohol and they do go around bragging about their charities. that's why they have so much on people...the followers typically have a really sordid past. probably have money troubles...so the church will use that as leverage against the person. plus...i mean...why do people do heroin when they know it's so bad for you? some people will be curious about anything and try something just to do it. the problem is that once you're in, it's hard to get out.

Looking forward to checking this out. I still need to check out CitizenFour on HBO Demand. I started the first 10 minutes but never finished it.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

You're not paying attention.

Anyway, I want to make sure all Scientologists aren't painted with a broad brush. Scientology is a religion of peace (and thetans). Sure, there are a few radicals like Miscavige who have hijacked the religion of L. Ron Hubbard, but they are a small minority. The vast majority of Scientologists just want to make movies, fly airplanes, and have gay sex.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

Radical? Don't you mean activist?

The funny thing is that Scientology, while a lot more extreme, uses the same types of brainwashing techniques as pretty much any other religion. They just don't track you and they let you quit. In fact, I'm pretty sure there are early quotes from the founder that basically indicates that is the model he is following.

Do you really think giving 10% of your salary to the Church, attending meetings at least once a week, and confessing your sins to a guy you know who can tell exactly who you are is not following the same general methods as Scientology?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

People are crazy. They only know the things they're taught. The same guy who thinks the idea of Xenu is absolutely ludicrous believes some guy in the sky is gonna be pissed if he eats pork. Or maybe he believes that a dude in a dress can wave his hand and turn wine into blood.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Kash, and Don

Its a very nebulous concept to be sure. Like your March Madness seedings ,inclusions and exclusions.

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Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

I don't even have a problem with the Xenu stuff...however you don't get access to the mythology until you reach OT III which is beyond being considered "clear". So while you are spending thousands of dollars and being constantly audited, you aren't even made aware of the backstory of what you are trying to believe in yet. And it really does cost about $20k to get to that level. By that time you have disconnected from all your pts and sp's...

Operation Clambake is a pretty eye opening website. Their message board is also richly compelling albeit lacking a march madness event.

i think if you don't know too much about scientology or the history of hubbard's quest from dianetics to this religion, this is a pretty informative, comprehensive documentary. it relies heavily on testimony of former members that were at the highest levels of authority (like marty rathbun) and celebrities like paul haggis.

so i'd say overall, it's a fairly solid expose.

but i've read a lot about it, and i was a bit disappointed that it left out a few really key points. first, that hubbard went after the guy who invented the e-meter and basically created his own and discredited him when the two of them had a falling out. they did do a pretty good job showing how calculating and paranoid he was, though. but he made up a ton of lies about his past--even though he was well liked by a lot of people. he had a falling out with some of his fellow sci fi writers, too, as he got deeper into his religion.

i was watching this in a somewhat noisy atmosphere so i may have missed something but it seemed like the stories of lisa mcpherson and jeremy perkins were left out. i don't know why. they are extremely damning stories of how abusive scientology is and how their way of "handling" PTS's as they're called lead to the death of elli perkins.

they also left out that tommy davis "disappeared" for 2 years between 2011 and 2013 and it was never explained why--but it was after some of his TV appearances that didn't go so well. many people think he was in the hole at gold base.

there is plenty of stuff in this that exposes what the church is and their vile practices but i'd mainly recommend this to people who are green to scientology. some of the interviews are pretty revealing though...

out of

when i get to that part of my life i'm going to hearken chester from sifl n olly and begin with "BORN ON A CRAPS TABLE IN VEGAS...."

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Found it very interesting knowing little to nothing about Scientology going into it. Very interesting how they use the auditing against their subjects
and how they turned Cruise's kids against Nicole Kidman. Also very interesting how they pressured the IRS to make them tax exempt.

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Flew too close to the sun on wings of pastrami

I wasn't shocked that Oscar winner Paul Haggis was a former Scientologist. I was more shocked that he was an executive producer of Facts of Life.

I felt bad about that woman who ascended to level 8 only to have to "disconnect" from her daughter. Then I remembered that she's the one who brought her whole family into the "church", and I suddenly didn't feel so bad anymore. That lady did have very nice eyes, though, so she has that going for her.

20 pages.

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Good people drink good beer - Hunter S. Thompson

<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way

y'know, there are plenty of people who don't give 10% of their salary and don't confess their sins to a guy who's a man just like them and are under no duress to attend every week? They're called non-catholics.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

What I described is present in many Christian religions.

If you happen to be in one that wouldn't qualify then you can ignore my statement.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

scientology is predicated on money. you cannot "level up" in the religion without paying. and if you think, "oh well then people can just stay at those lower levels", you're wrong. they will hound you for more money.

they call it regging. they will tell you you have money even when you don't. they will pressure you to go to your bank and get credit limits raised. if you can't do it yourself, they will make personal calls to your bank, and you'll suddenly have more in your account. there are documented stories of this happening, even in europe.

there is an extreme imbalance when your followers number somewhere around 50,000 and you are worth $1.5 billion dollars worldwide. and spent hundreds of millions of dollars on that eyesore in clearwater (which i saw while under its construction back in 2001 during a trip to visit a friend's family--and no we didn't go inside).

by the time you've gotten to OTIII and found out the zany Xenu story, you're so far in financially that you pretty much have to just go with it at that point. like haggis said, he thought it was just some kind of insanity test. he still stayed with the church (i think he was OTVIII when he left).

but they will, absolutely, deny everything about all of that. regging, xenu, forced donations, abuse, disconnecting, all of it. they will sue you if you continue to accuse them of it.

W_Z you have another connection to this? You seem focused.

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Elections have consequences.

no, i just get on a kick and i do a lot of research when i'm on that kick. i've been off and on reading about this since probably around 2001. i think the first thing i read that was incendiary about the religion was the lisa mcpherson story.