I know there are a few fans out there. What'd you think?

I was surprised it was such a slow burn episode. Some interesting character development but the episode was a bit slow in developing. It may just be my preconceived notions of what these final episodes were going to be.

However, knowing this is the last season, I admit I felt some tension as I watched thinking something nasty was going to happen. So, maybe they were playing with people and messing with their expectations. If so, you got me, well played.

Seems like Tony is done with Christopher.

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You know me like that.

Doc, wait until next week as far as Christopher goes. Apparently one of Chrissy's characters in his movie was modeled on Tony, and T doesn't like his portrayal.....

I am expecting this season to be the ultimate in blue balls. Chase is going to leave it completely unfinished, just so we all talk about it for years to come. I guarantee there will be no resolution to this.

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

I found the episode too Janice-y, though I did enjoy the brawl between Tony and Bobby.

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I hope you are wrong Scholar. That have to wrap some kind of bow on this. Otherwise, that is a huge F you to the viewers.

I think there will be a final wrap-up with maybe a loose end or two out there to develop something down the road if he feels like it.

But, I think the main storylines will be concluded. I was just surprised last night because the A story was a character study and the B story was the RICO stuff that is likely to be the main thrust of the final season. So, they are just introducing it slowly I guess. I thought they'd hit the ground running.

I try to stay as spoiler free as possible so I don't know what is in store these final episodes - so you guys may know a lot more about this already than I do (as you do on most topics ).

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You know me like that.

it was decent. it seemed more like a "set up" episode, which has become the choice of chase in the last few years with this show. let's just keep building, guys--build, build, build!

if he lets this hanging at the end, i may have to find him and kill him. there's some closure for ya.

Janice bugs the crap out of me too Midget.

Thanks TM by the way. I was having trouble sleeping last night and that NAFTA discussion did the trick.

You guys even made NAFTA sound boring. NAFTA!!!

And I have a vested professional interest in the subject.

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You know me like that.

I like to think of myself as the human soporific. For only $1.99/day, I'd be happy to email you my thoughts on the subject matter of your choice, each of which is guaranteed to be so completely devoid of substance, energy and commonsense that it will immediately compel even the most restless insomniac into the deepest of slumbers. Call now before I bore myself to sleep and lose the capability to compose the inane drivel for which I've become notorious!

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Now Midget - there's plenty of substance there.

It's just the incessant rhythm of the polysyllabic discourse that does the trick.

(See now you almost have me doing it.)

Besides, I'm already paying HBO $12.99/month to have The Sopranos do the job for me so far this season - they just couldn't quite do it last night.

But, thanks for the offer.

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You know me like that.

I feel like we need a poll here, or at least a Keeping Score tally.
Was Bobby's "Canadian assignment" a punishment, a test or both?

Say what you want about the show, but it's been a while since my wife and I got into a pretty heated argument over TV show's plot rather than its quality.

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“Mmmm. Move over, eggs. Bacon just got a new best friend - fudge.”

That's an interesting question Rob.

I originally viewed it as a punishment. I expected some hesitation on his part but the way he carried it out made me rethink Tony's motivation.

Maybe Tony was trying to see if he had a little more of his father's backbone than Tony had always given him credit for.

So I'd say that Chase wanted you to think it was punishment when it actually was a test.

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You know me like that.

Chase takes entire decades off in between seasons, and you doubt for a second that he wouldn't do this? He's been telling us to F off for years now, why should the end of the series be anything but the biggest?

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

who's giving their audience the bigger middle finger? larry david with "seinfeld" or chase with "sopranos"?

Why is David in here? Because he stopped writing on it? I don't think that was a middle finger, since he was still involved in the show. David couldn't handle all the writing when the show was still finding its own path, much less when it became hugely popular. He still shows up in episodes throughout, including the last episode, and I'm sure he still had some involvement outside of his portrayals of Steinbrenner.

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

I inferred that Zack was talking about the final episode of seinfeld as being the middle finger

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Gotcha. I think that was a poor attempt at wrapping the show up. They've said before that they wanted the show's loyal fans to enjoy reoccurences of some of the smaller characters, like Babu, Teri Hatcher, and Mickey. While it didn't succeed, I don't think it was intentional.

Chase however, will be on the front page of USA Today telling fans to F off if they would print it.

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

It was an ok episode. Next week is going to get alot better with Chris's movie premier. I think hes on his way out.

Funny thing is Larry David did basically the same thing he/Jerry did with the Seinfeld series with the last episode. Larry dreamt about or bumped into almost everybody we've seenover the years and how he's pissed them off. Tried to make up with some...middle finger to others. I thought his final show came off better than Seinfeld's though. The best thing about this is that he decided to do another season. I've read about it for a bit and heard rumors they were shooting, but finally get that HBO confirmation when they showed some clips of Curb and declaring a new season was coming up. Thank God.

i was talking about the "seinfeld" finale, probably one of the worst in all television history. the best way it was put, i think it was EW's review of the episode, something along the lines of: David obviously wanted to show how horrible his characters were, and how we should not have ever rooted for them in any situation, and now they'll have to pay for how horrible they are. The problem is, they already got theirs throughout the years, and didn't need the final exclamation point. It's not like they needed to be arrested and jailed, literally. Not only that, the episode wasn't funny. It was one of the most deflating evenings I can remember watching TV. After the "clips show" it was all downhill from there. I'm glad he waited a few years to put out "Curb" because by the time it premiered I lifted my boycott on him, and on watching "Seinfeld". Which I'm glad I did, because I adore watching the old episodes over and over...except for that "finale". I have only seen it the one time, when it premiered, and that will be the only time I'll watch it.

Now that we Seinfeldians have completely taken over this thread, I'll respond. Doug, you may leave.

EW completely missed the point. The whole point of the Seinfeld finale was to bring the show full-circle, and to reward people who had followed the show from the beginning with reappearances from characters that, in any other sitcom, would be considered ancillary at best. Minor roles for someone like Keith Hernandez and the blind guy in the gym are remembered just as well as actions of the main characters; this episode was not a middle finger, but a tip of the cap to the consistent viewers. You can fault David and Seinfeld for a poor plot, and self-indulgent writing, but you cannot say it was disrespectful to the loyal fans.

As far as the jail as comeuppance for the main characters, EW swung and missed again. The characters were BELOVED by David, which is why he turned that final 45 minutes into a parade of them. While certainly one could easily see the jailing as 12 years of karma, the sentence was merely a wink to the loyal audience who remembered the conversation about the buttons from the first time in Monk's - it hints that while the locale may change briefly, the characters have learned nothing from the years of selfish actions and that it will only continue while incarcerated.

The show always attempted to take an ammoral turn on events, to point out the foolish and self-imposed mores society has, and what we as members of a shared community feel obligated to adhere to. Very rarely did the characters who flaunted these communal obligations ever get into trouble of any significance; quite to the contrary, they often flourished because of their attitudes. Elaine was demoted, but never lost her job. George was taken to a police station, but there was no sign of trouble. Kramer is gainfully unemployed for years with no sign of hardship. Jerry loses relationship after relationship, only to find himself with another beautiful woman the next week (he even makes a comment at one point on this, hinting that none of these relationships have effected him for longer than a week).

Again, while David and Seinfeld may have missed, they at least stepped to the plate and swung. David Chase has shown little more than to be self-indulgent, with little to no regard to the consistent viewership; he won't even show up in the park.

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

i felt bringing the characters back was a wasted opportunity. puddy got to say one word...that's just a shame. there wasn't anything they brought back except the names and the appearance. they didn't contribute comically, and again, i felt like it was just beating us over the head with "see how horrible jerry and his friends are?"

two moments that i think were out of character; when susan died, and when they made fun of the fat guy in the last episode. the gang is insensitive, and completely unable to relate to society. BUT they are not cynical toward it. while they've pointed out others' misgivings, it's always ironic because they have the most flaws out of any minor character brought in.

they didn't succeed in anything. they didn't need demotions, or being fired, or anything--you knew they'd never succeed at anything because they always got in their own way.

them going to jail seemed to betray that and said, "now they have failed." but they never succeeded at anything. george got his job with the yankees because he was doing the opposite. elaine got her promotion because peterman disappeared. kramer fell "ass backwards into money", and jerry's career was always hinting at a less-than-desirable position to be in as a stand up comedian. when they got the pilot, it was cancelled after one show.

i think the "trial" was unnecessary, and if nothing else, it was unfunny to me.

i have a feeling we will not agree on this point, but at least we understand how brilliant the show was overall.

This is just a tv show.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

It indeed looks like the only thing we will agree on is the greatness of the show

I disagree about Puddy needing to be a larger part of the final shows, as no one EVER tuned in to see what he was going to do next. He was in an episode as late as "The Burning," which aired only two months before the finale (only three or four original episodes before the finale, not counting the clip shows). The finale was four the main characters primarily, with respect paid to the minor characters that made the show so great. While it is only supposition, I doubt if the finale was longer that so many characters would be ignored outright - Patrick Wharburton should be glad he got a line.

Susan's death was absolutely IN character, as it showed the moral indifference that the characters excelled at showing when they decide to go get some coffee. Mocking the fat robbery victim showed that while society professed a moral terpitude in the legislation of morality via the 'Good Samaritan' laws that appeared throughout the country, the four main characters showed how stupid it was to think government could legally mandate and enforce these decisions.

In nearly episode the character's flaws are exposed, and their own recognition of these flaws. The character of George is a running dialogue on the many conflictions one person encounters in life - with family, with self, with friends, etc. George's entire life is one large neurosis ABOUT himself.

You and I seem to see things differently - you seem to think they'd never succeed, while I would argue they had continued to succeed. George started out as a struggling realtor, and became a sought-after front-office man (when the Mets wanted him). While some of these things, such as with the Yankees, were accidental, often times they were vehicles for larger shows of his ammoral attitude, such as when he bumbled through an interview at Play Now and faked a handicap for preference, all because he saw how easy his life would be if he worked there.

Jail seemed to be yet another setting for comedy, as if to let the viewer know that they will be fine. That's a matter of interpretation, but I think there is more reasoon to believe that than EW's rather short-sighted viewing of the show's characters. Again, reasonable people could disagree, but I think the show followed successful people. Elaine started out as a midlevel employee struggling in the publishing world, and found her way to J. Peterman through happenstance; you see this as being in spite of her characteristics, while I'd argue it shows you can succeed because of her moral ambiguity, despite society's supposed demands on acting "right." Many people on the show had the perception Jerry was struggling (Helen sends him $50, the leadership of Del Boca Vista saw his act and KNOW he can't afford a Cadillac, etc), but he was frequently seen as a big success. Besides the Cadillac, he was a frequent entertainer at Atlantic City, and was on The Tonight Show. Following the success of the pilot's second chance, all signs were that the show was well received at NBC - hence the trip to France.

I won't argue the plot, or the delivery of the jokes, other than I think it was a good-hearted attempt at humor gone wrong, while you seem to believe it was a middle-finger attempt to close the book. Reasonable minds disagree, and so do we

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

Darkside, I disagree. You can look at it that way, but you are missing a lot of it. That's like saying Chris Rock is only making black jokes; to do so undersells the social commentary deliberately contained within.

I won't argue that on its surface it is damn funny.

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Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. ~ Benjamin Franklin

Don't be too proud of yourself, Midge, I'm just as responsible for that sleep-inducing thread.

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Fire Phil Emery

And we will continue to, but your thoughts were very interesting and well put and I can see where you're coming from. We are just coming at this from different angles. I'm not going to say you're wrong, but we won't see eye to eye on this, so there's no point in driving home any other points on this.

I just watched a classic, "The Barber", on TBS. Not only did I love the opera/relationship stuff, but the Pensky file stuff was also hilarious.

That show had depth.

NAFTA analysis will keep me on the edge of my seat compared to the drudgery that is all this Seinfeldology.

Bobby stepped up and answered Tony's challenge/punishment. Tony is looking to replace Christopher. Bobby might be that guy.

How 'bout that stabbing scene at the clubhouse?

Solid episode. Looks like next week could be very good also.

Was that a preview for next week or the whole season though? They've done that crap for awhile now and the next episode has nothing that they showed. This one was decent, a lot better than watching them play Monopoly in the first one.

Did they show they are doing a "Making of Cleaver" special with everybody in character? Looks stupid. I'll pass.

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You know me like that.