North has been ripped on here for a long time,but how long can you as a listener keep being sold the same bill of goods? Hub Arkush,B&B keep giggling and preaching how it's "No Contest" in that comparison. All I can tell you is Statistics talk and Bullshit walks. Right now the trade looks like shit (considering 2 1st round picks also went with Orton!!!)

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

Boilermaker Rick approves.

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I still would make the trade again without hesitation.

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Team Cutler.

Don't be silly dude.
Cutler being injured and not getting gaudy numbers has very little to do with Cutler.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

The Bears probably don't beat the Lions or Cowboys with Orton at the helm.


The Broncos also started last year 6-0 and failed to make the playoffs. So to Kyle Orton, I must say: Prove It.

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What are you doing...posting from the future? Right now,Cutler has played every game for the Bears since the trade.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

Over the length of the careers of each Cutler will likely be the better quarterback.

However Orton + draft picks for Cutler + one far less valuable draft pick is looking to have been a steal for the Broncos.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

In your opinion.
Do you really want to use "failed to make the playoffs" as a measuring stick?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

What?
Dude.
I'm saying that this lack of production from Cutler that you're using to say the trade wasn't worth it is not due to lack of talent on the part of the Starting QB. Thusly, any QB on this team would have less than stellar numbers and/or suffer massive brain injury.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

DS,
All those INT's last year are not ALL due to the OL.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

None of them ever are.
And that's not really what I'm getting at.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Well, one of the major things about the trade is that they gave up 3 incredibly valuable draft picks for it. If you are judging the trade then the excuse that he doesn't have talent around him isn't as valid because one of the major reasons why is the trade for him.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Half of them were due to the recievers running the wrong routes.

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If you start 6-0, yes you can.

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DS,
It just gets to me that great QB's are judged by statistics UNLESS your name is Kyle Orton.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

Take this comment for what it's worth but...
I don't hold any value to Bears draft picks.
I think they fuck them all up. might as well give them away on trades and deals because they're fucking basically useless until Angelo goes.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

DS,
Even a blindman can find his nuts once in a while.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

What if he had started 9-3?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Ya lost me Jimmy.
I still think the trade was just fine. Probably over the next 4-5 years it's a great trade.
I'm taking a bit of a long term approach to this.

I'd probably say the same about the Peavy trade assuming he's not finished with his career too.


Even if they were linemen, what fuckin difference would it make?
Our last 1st round OL sucks and is hurt and bad.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Draft picks are only as good as the people making them. Jerry Angelo is bad at making them. That is all.

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PiP,
You are right. I thought when the deal was made,the Bears gave away one 1st round pick too many.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

I would say that I think that is what Cutler did his last year in Denver.
I would also say I still think you would much rather Cutler do bad and Orton do good so that you can be right. Deny it all you want, but thats exactly the way you have acted since this trade was made.

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North can take his jelly beans and his predictions and shove em straight up his ass.

Kyle is a solid quarterback in a system that maximizes his abilities as a system quarterback. Jay is an elite talent who has not been able to harness his full potential and he is on a team with a very dysfunctional offense full of either bad players or players who do not fit the every changing scheme.

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That's my purse! I don't know you!

That is what Orton did his rookie year, and that team made the playoffs, even with him playing practice squad quality. It kind of kills your whole argument though since his worst season was playoff worthy while his best season to date did not.
Does this make you feel better or something? You constantly say this. I'm sorry that I didn't immediately start proclaiming that the next 10 years of Bears football is going to be amazing because of Jay Cutler. It turns out, that didn't pan out for most of the people who thought I was crazy. I want Orton and Cutler to do well. I'd like nothing more than to have a Cutler vs. Orton Super Bowl or even pro bowl.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Patrick Kane's cousin is a dick


But...Draft picks have a certain value. That value is not changed by the person potentially making the pick.

If he's that bad (he's not) youre organization is terrible.

If the scouting department is shit and give poor reccomondations to the person with the ultimate decision on the pick, I believe that the value is diminished.

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OK, so using 'make the playoffs' kills the argument, but using performances as a rookie is ok?

I think its fairly safe to say that 95% of the QBs in the NFL would have made the playoffs with that defense. Keep in mind that the one game the Bears loosened the leash on Orton (against Cincy), he performed terribly.

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If your teams GM cant be trusted with draft picks, youre already fucked so dont worry about who the QB is.

It just goes to show that "making the playoffs" is a very poor methodology for judging him. His play significantly improved but it didn't show in playoff appearances.
Once again, that 95% figure you cite shows why judging a QB on "making the playoffs" is a very poor metric. Thanks for the help Frank.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

How is it that the Bears WR's have all regressed & they all look worse than last year?

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan