They don’t need to be great, just better than they were at the end. Hutchinson was leading the league in sacks when he went down, so I think it’s safe to assume their D will be better with him back

As for the loss of the OCs, it depends on who they replace them with. Frankly I doubt they will suddenly stop scoring points. The offense is loaded where it counts.

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Mr. Trump is unfit for our nation’s highest office.- JD Vance
When a clown moves into a palace, he doesn't become a king. The palace turns into a circus. - Turkish Proverb

I’d imagine the Lions will just promote internally for OC. The system is in place, all you have to do is be a good steward. The bigger question is whether they get an heir apparent quarterback in the draft.

They'll take a flyer on Miller Moss in '26, and he'll be their Tom Brady.

Nah I'm a Bears fan first and foremost. But "Meatball" Bear fandom is for the birds. You are free to remain in that lane however

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Ben Johnson apparently is the only person capable of coaching that level of talent. You've dealt with Bears fans that are quite comfortable with "winning the offseason" only to get beat down year after year by YOUR GREEN BAY PACKERS and every other team in the division.
At some point it's time to win and then start chirping.

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I am happy to wager with you a reasonable sum that, assuming Caleb and Justin are each the starting QBs of their respective teams, that the Bears will beat the Steelers in 2025.

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"I honestly don't see a good bet on the board here."

I'd never bet against the Bears. Caleb Williams is a different story however. I'd have to find something that works however

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You could have gotten there quicker by just typing two letters: N and O.

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"I honestly don't see a good bet on the board here."

Nah if I take the action your bread is good as gone Who knows. In 9 months I might change my mind and take the action being that it's just one game.

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such an odd little subgroup of fans we have here viewing every bears' move in the least charitable light and other team's moves in the most charitable

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

I'll mark you down in the "Campbell was the real genius behind it all" group

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

It's a coping mechanism and given how often the Bears have failed us it is understandable.

But this one is different. They went out and got the consensus #1 QB in the draft. The next year they got the consensus #1 coach on the market who also happens to have just lead the best offense in the league. It was such a strong plan that Ben Johnson didn't even do an in-person interview. He was all in from the moment the Lions lost and likely for months prior to that moment.

Good plans don't always work but this is by far the best attempt the Bears have done in decades.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I think this is closer to the truth than you're acknowledging. He's the one who retained and elevated Ben Johnson, who was a nobody before Campbell did that. The Lions will probably regress next year because every team that wins 15 games in the regular season regresses, but Zippy is right in that Detroit is loaded talent wise. They have the best track record in the draft by far of any team in the last 5 years. Ben Johnson wasn't running their draft.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Campbell also had to fire the OC he hired when he showed up in Detroit. Johnson was obviously a massive upgrade over the guy who didn't even make a full calendar year as OC.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'm optimistic provided Johnson and his guys have input in getting the talent he needs. Caleb gets a new start. It's essential though that he grows a set of balls and takes the risks that enables him to grow. It wasn't a waste of a rookie year, but it was close.

He was. I think this is a credit to Campbell for acknowledging and correcting a mistake quickly, and then promoting the correct internal candidate over hiring a more qualified outside option. It's tough to paint Campbell as a meathead who was the product of his coordinators given that he was ahead of every other head coach in the NFL in realizing the advantage that comes with being aggressive on 4th and short situations. Everything about his tenure in Detroit so far suggests he knows what he's doing.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

That tone sounds far different than saying that Johnson was a "nobody before Campbell did that".

I'll also point out that Campbell also had a weak resume before he got the job in Detroit.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It's the same tone. And I wasn't saying that to discredit Johnson, it's just a fact that he was an unknown guy before Campbell got there. Campbell got rid of a lot of the staff, he retained Ben, then elevated Ben from TE coach to pass game coordinator to OC all within a year. I think this is obviously a good hire for the Bears and Johnson's reputation as a great play caller has been earned, but I'm going to push back on any narrative that suggests Campbell was just a product of him.

I also don't think Campbell's resume before Detroit matters all that much given the job we have seen him do since being hired there. McVay's resume before being hired by the Rams wasn't very good, who cares?

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Yep. The guy who made OC at 33-34 was a nobody. There is a genius as a leader in picking great subordinates. No doubt about that. Does Campbell have a history in doing that beyond Johnson?

Johnson's offenses were top ten before Gibbs, Montgomery, La Porta, Williams, etc.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

It may have been unintentional but you were discrediting Johnson by calling him a nobody before Dan Campbell. The most likely situation is that Ben Johnson elevated Campbell up after Campbell made a terrible OC hire and Johnson almost immediately improved the offense.

Because the argument you seem to be making is that Ben Johnson's resume before Campbell is important.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Yes. He was a TE coach a year before that. How many TE coaches could you name right now without the help of a search engine?

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

don't worry, little bro. The tables turned on the rivalry even before Johnson arrived and you are feeling anxious. I get that, but a future of Bear's dominance doesn't mean the Pack can't continue to finish third and make the playoffs.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Nobody was calling Lynn a terrible OC hire when he got the job. He was just coming off a stint as a head coach and seemed obviously qualified for the job. Their plan was to build through the lines and running game which fits with Lynn's background. When it went poorly, even as a team with no expectations in Year 1, Campbell made the change. A lot of coaches don't make changes that quickly, especially in a season with no expectations.

And you seem to be misunderstanding what I'm saying about Ben Johnson. I don't think his resume before he was elevated to OC is important. I'm stating it's a fact that he wasn't a highly regarded talented play caller before Campbell elevated him into the OC postition. Given that his resume was lacking when that move happened, Campbell deserves credit for identifying him as the correct choice there.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I like the renewed optimism from Bears fans. Just booked $100 bets with Nas and GoldenJet yesterday on who has a better record between the Packers and Bears next year.

One thing to keep in mind, LTG isn't wrong when he points out all this "it's a new era" "it's different now" is the same shit we heard last offseason with the Bears. And they are still doing the same dumb misaligned timelines where Poles will have to be fired next year when they finish last in the division again and a new GM will come in when they could have just done the smart thing and started fresh with a new GM and HC this offseason. They don't learn from their mistakes, which isn't a great sign for the future.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

It doesn't matter if I can name them. It matters it the league can name them.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

This seems factual but doesn't really seem to address the point that the Lions saw a massive and almost immediate major leap in terms of their offense when Ben Johnson was given control.

So to be clear, your point is that the guy who wasn't calling plays wasn't regarded as a highly regarded play caller before he started calling plays?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

You seem to be trying to get me to say Ben Johnson doesn't deserve credit for anything, when I've already said the opposite. I'm just pointing out that Campbell also deserves a lot of credit for the Detroit turnaround, which is why this all goes back to my initial reply to dolphin implying Campbell was just a passenger on Ben Johnson's bus.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I'll just have to trust that saying Ben Johnson was a nobody before Dan Campbell wasn't an attempt to minimize his contributions to what happened in Detroit.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It's literally just a fact

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

So is that Dan Campbell was a nobody before getting the job in Detroit.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!