since this thread is negative vibes, maybe worst case is ben johnson figures out in August that Caleb cant be rehabbed and tells management to ship him away while they can. did i do negative right?

Once again, you seem to not be understanding what I'm saying. I pointed out Ben's lack of resume as it pertains to Campbell elevating him beyond what his resume would usually warrant. Campbell deserves credit for that. If you want to point out Campbell's lack of resume as part of a larger point giving credit to Brad Holmes for the job he's done, by all means do that.

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Listen to the river sing sweet songs
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Dan Campbell is a meathead who's value is in being able to persuade other meatheads to run through a brick wall for him. That has a lot of value in the game of football.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

He's the first coach in the league to embrace the edge that making the correct 4th down decisions gives a team. An edge that many of the "smart" coaches like McVay, Reid, Shanahan, Lafleur still don't understand. I think it's likely that will be a thing Ben Johnson learned from Campbell and takes with him to Chicago. You will probably be here next year giving credit to Ben Johnson for it.

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I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Johnson is the one who statistically verified it for Campbell's gut feeling, and Campbell still overuses it

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

What if Campbell is good and Johnson was the best coaching candidate available for the Bears?

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It was statistically verified long before Campbell or Johnson started using it, and there's no indication Campbell got it from Johnson.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

This is the correct take, but it's not enough for Rick and dolphin. We also have to discredit any work Campbell has done so Johnson can have all the credit for Detroit's recent success.

_________________
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I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

While you are correct in theory, three of those guys have played in or won a Super Bowl while Campbell has lost in part by being overly aggressive at the wrong times in both those playoff losses.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Brandon Staley was also going for it on 4th a ton wasn't he?

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I completely agree, but I find Dr. Style's man-crush on Fields funny. He's dug in and not relenting. I would actually love nothing more than to see Fields start for the Steelers next year. That makes the Steelers a mediocre (at best) football team.


This would be very Bears-like. I would love to see this happen. Given the McCaskeys are still majority owners of the Bears, Johnson would be denied this request.

Dolphin said it....the Bears hired what most of us feel was the best option. Caleb was not good in his rookie season, but he is just that....a rookie. I'm not sold on Caleb, but I'm not giving up on him yet. I hope he develops and improves and I hope he gets a better surrounding cast.

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Detroit lost this year because their defense was decimated by injuries and they couldn't stop Jayden Daniels or even slow him down. 4th down decision making wasn't a factor. To the extent coaching did affect the loss, Johnson calling for a WR to throw a 30 yard pass that was intercepted while down 10 in the 4th quarter contributed more than any other decision.

4th down results did contribute to last year's playoff loss, but going for it was the correct decision in each instance. Criticizing it is just hindsight analysis driven by results, not process.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

From where I'm sitting, Dan Campbell is a meathead who has proven to be very good at getting the best / most out of a team of meatball players. Dan Campbell has also proved to be a complete moron in making in-game decisions.

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At times. Like Ron Rivera, he was inconsistent in when he went for it and started turtling up towards the end when it didn't work out. Staley was also in over his head in multiple ways.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Campbell's an excellent in-game coach. He's obviously a great culture builder. He's built an excellent staff that's currently getting raided all over by other front offices. We'll see how he rebuilds that staff going forward, but there just simply isn't much to criticize him for as a head coach. The few things you can point to are 4th down decisions that didn't work out that like Rick said, are still correct in theory.

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I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

The trick play interception in effect ended that game when neither team was really stopping the other. I'd also argue there is no way the Lions should have thrown 43 times in a game the Lions were getting 8.7 yards a carry.

No. They turned down a field that would have put them up 3 scores in the second half. Later, they turned down a field goal to tie the game. Both of those in real time were the wrong decisions. He's overly reliant on being "technically correct" when sports require higher level thinking than reading a spreadsheet and sticking to it no matter what.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Both of those were the correct decisions that you wouldn't be criticizing if they worked. Being consistent in his approach to these situations is a positive attribute, not a negative one.

I agree the Lions shouldn't have thrown 43 times in that game and should have ran the ball more. I guess you could argue Campbell should have overruled Johnson's gameplan but that seems like an unrealistic critique. That criticism falls more on Johnson than Campbell.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I wouldn't be criticizing them because they would have resulted in the same result. I wouldn't criticize someone for playing the lottery if they won $100 million either. Going up 3 scores in the second half in a playoff game is more important than what a simulation of 1,000 games would end up giving you a slight edge in total games won. The same is true for tying the game in the fourth quarter.

Isn't your point though that the aggressive nature of the offense comes from Dan Campbell and not Ben Johnson?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

If Johnson turns out to be a bad coach (And I hope that he isn't isn't) there is one thing that you can book from those that are "all in" on the hire. It won't be because it is a bad coach. It will because of the usual array of built in excuses. Bears Ownership, Poles and Warren will be the scapegoats no matter what. It won't be Johnon and it won't be Caleb. That much "we" know.

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.

Yeah, Bear fans have been overly deferential to guys like Nagy and Flus.

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Optimal 4th down decision making, which is aggressive, comes from Campbell. It's wholly unrelated to pass vs run. The Lions averaged 31 pass attempts per game this year, which was 10th in the league. They were the highest scoring offense. Do you think Campbell told Johnson to throw the ball 43 times? If Johnson has no blame in that, what exactly was his job?

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

All the Bears coaches since Lovie have been considered bad coaches upon being fired and then pretty much every coach since Ditka. All the Bears quarterbacks since Jim McMahon have been considered bad quarterbacks. Your post sets a new standard for being wrong.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Flus was never the overwhelming choice for Bears fans and neither was Nagy. Johnson is however. Which means that if he sucks (as we have seen this year with Caleb) it won't be because he sucks as much as it will be because of external factors outside of his control

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So to be clear, outside of the 4th down decision making, Ben Johnson gets all credit and blame for the offense?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Mine doesn't. But yours does.

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Give me a list of coaches and quarterbacks since Ditka that haven't been considered bad at their job and instead others were blamed.

But, the cherry on the top, is the one who has made the most excuses for a failed Bears quarterback is you with Fields.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I think that’s your argument vis-à-vis Fields.

Everybody else - across all teams and sports - typically will acknowledge when a guy has failed and it’s time to move on, irrespective of that person’s hiring situation.

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The last overwhelming positive hire was Wannstedt.

I wouldn't say all. Brad Holmes built a very talented offense, he deserves a lot of credit as well. I believe Campbell should get some credit for helping create the identity of offense with Holmes and Johnson. But yes Johnson gets a lot of the credit and blame. He comes up with the gameplans and literally calls the plays. It's why I said previously I think it's a good hire for the Bears and think Johnson earned his reputation as a great play caller. It's funny that you criticized their gameplan against Washington and are trying to pin the blame on Campbell and not Johnson.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Lovie was a good coach that maybe needed to go, but imagine the Bears firing a coach who went 10-6 today.