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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:11 am 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
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I agree. I feel the same when people criticize QBs drafted from schools with poor track records. The player in question matters, not the school he comes from.

There is a lot of truth to not drafting the guy who plays every game with offensive talent that far exceeds their opponent.

No there's not. It's called evaluation. The surrounding talent factors in of course, but it should be only one of many considerations. A 5-star QB recruit is very likely to go to a program where he is surrounded by other stars. He doesn't become less talented because of that.
I would argue that he does get less talented playing on easy mode for 90% of the season until he faces similar talent on defense as he is throwing to on offense.

Of course you can't say "Never draft a QB from OSU, Notre Dame, or Alabama" but it's something you have to question when the results among so many quarterbacks is so poor. Even Fields, who was an absolute stud at OSU, was clueless in the NFL for much of this season.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:33 am 
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Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
I agree. I feel the same when people criticize QBs drafted from schools with poor track records. The player in question matters, not the school he comes from.

There is a lot of truth to not drafting the guy who plays every game with offensive talent that far exceeds their opponent.

Joe Burrow looks pretty good

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:39 am 
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Nas wrote:
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Add Omar Khan from the Steelers to the list of GM candidates. Sounds like one to consider strongly.


Curious why the Steelers didn't want to give him the job after 20 years of service.


Yeah that's strange.

He's VP of Football and Business I think.

Sounds like he could make Phillips obsolete as well.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:43 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
I agree. I feel the same when people criticize QBs drafted from schools with poor track records. The player in question matters, not the school he comes from.

There is a lot of truth to not drafting the guy who plays every game with offensive talent that far exceeds their opponent.

Joe Burrow looks pretty good
I can make an exception for a quarterback that had the greatest passing season in college football history.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:44 am 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Add Omar Khan from the Steelers to the list of GM candidates. Sounds like one to consider strongly.


Curious why the Steelers didn't want to give him the job after 20 years of service.


Yeah that's strange.

He's VP of Football and Business I think.

Sounds like he could make Phillips obsolete as well.

I’m sure he’ll fare well in front of the panel that includes Phillips.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:50 am 
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Mac Jones reminds me of the Michigan quarterbacks that were popular with NFL GMs in the 90's: Todd Collins, Elvis Grbac, Brian Griese, Bills even drafted backup QB Jay Riemersma but to play TE. Game manager QB's who aren't going to win you the game on their own but aren't going to take bad sacks and turn the ball over and cost you the game. Although Grbac became a turnover machine in the NFL. None of them ended up having much success in the NFL. Chad Henne's another in that mold, but he was a decade later. Jones going to NE gives him a better shot at succeeding, but I don't think he's ever gonna be great.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:01 am 
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Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
I agree. I feel the same when people criticize QBs drafted from schools with poor track records. The player in question matters, not the school he comes from.

There is a lot of truth to not drafting the guy who plays every game with offensive talent that far exceeds their opponent.

No there's not. It's called evaluation. The surrounding talent factors in of course, but it should be only one of many considerations. A 5-star QB recruit is very likely to go to a program where he is surrounded by other stars. He doesn't become less talented because of that.
I would argue that he does get less talented playing on easy mode for 90% of the season until he faces similar talent on defense as he is throwing to on offense.

Of course you can't say "Never draft a QB from OSU, Notre Dame, or Alabama" but it's something you have to question when the results among so many quarterbacks is so poor. Even Fields, who was an absolute stud at OSU, was clueless in the NFL for much of this season.


Interesting, but have often thought only drafting defensive players from SEC schools would likely give you a better chance at success than picking small school guys that put up great combine numbers.

The QB numbers are frequently skewed because most power conference teams play at least half of their games against teams with significantly inferior talent, especially on defense.

Mitch looked great on paper, good size, good athlete, but limited success in college against less than stellar competition, remember watching him play in a bowl game and he completely relied on his athleticism to escape the pocket and make plays, Fields was similar in that during the rare occasions where his superiorly talented offensive teammates were not able to beat the opponent, he was able to outrun the defense, that don't happen in the NFL which he found out quickly in the Cleveland game.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:20 am 
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Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:23 am 
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RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:41 am 
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Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.


His application was denied because they feared he wouldn't be as congenial as Pace and Nagy were.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:44 am 
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Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.


maybe we can steal jack easterby from the texans to take over for phillips?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:49 am 
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Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:57 am 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:58 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?


gute was better at dealing with difficult personalities


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:01 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:10 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.


I remember hearing Wolf's name mentioned in the media as the likely successor to TT. I'm curious to know why he didn't get the job.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:30 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

Let me start by saying I have no opinion on Wolf's capabilities as a GM, but it wasn't just the Packers that passed on him as GM. He left the Packers to join Cleveland as assistant GM in January 2018, was apparently not a candidate when the GM was replaced in 2020 and parted ways with the Browns shortly thereafter. He also claims to have recommended they draft Baker Mayfield FWIW.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:33 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
Add Omar Khan from the Steelers to the list of GM candidates.

Image

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:03 pm 
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Glad GB got the right guy

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:19 pm 
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This is my list of preference, but I don't feel very strong about it.
Yes...Eliot Wolf is Ron Wolf's son. He's been passed over twice...not sure why, but agree that I'd think of him more as a Packers guy than a Belichik guy. Honestly....I'm going to get ahead and bet this is who the Bears select. I'm Not crazy about him, but there are worse options

Omar Khan (despite his title) is #2 on the Steelers front office depth chart. That's why the Bears can possibly get him.....it would be totally his show. He's been with the Steelers for 20 years or so, so that has to count for something.

Ed Dodds (IMO) has the strongest resume. Lots of Giants fans seem to really want Dodds to get that job.

1. Ed Dodds
2. Omar Khan
3. Joe Schoen
4. Morocco Brown
5. Eliot Wolf
6. Jeff Ireland
7. Glenn Cook
8. Kwesi Adofo-Mensah
9. Rick Smith
10. Ran Carthon

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:55 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Eliot Wolf of the Patriots front office to interview for GM

They are definitely connected to a lot of people on this deal.


I don't want anyone from the Patriots except Belichick.

I would say Wolf is way more of Packers guy than a Patriots/Belichick guy.


Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

Let me start by saying I have no opinion on Wolf's capabilities as a GM, but it wasn't just the Packers that passed on him as GM. He left the Packers to join Cleveland as assistant GM in January 2018, was apparently not a candidate when the GM was replaced in 2020 and parted ways with the Browns shortly thereafter. He also claims to have recommended they draft Baker Mayfield FWIW.

Cleveland was tough because he went there for 1 year before the owner blew the whole damn thing up and got rid of everybody. He clearly was passed over for the Green Bay job, I am with Midge, I wonder why. There seemed to be from the outside looking in a lot of reasons why he would have been given a chance.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:02 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

Let me start by saying I have no opinion on Wolf's capabilities as a GM, but it wasn't just the Packers that passed on him as GM. He left the Packers to join Cleveland as assistant GM in January 2018, was apparently not a candidate when the GM was replaced in 2020 and parted ways with the Browns shortly thereafter. He also claims to have recommended they draft Baker Mayfield FWIW.

Cleveland was tough because he went there for 1 year before the owner blew the whole damn thing up and got rid of everybody. He clearly was passed over for the Green Bay job, I am with Midge, I wonder why. There seemed to be from the outside looking in a lot of reasons why he would have been given a chance.
Not sure if this would have been a reason but he may have been perceived as too much of a Thompson disciple since they appeared to be very close.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:05 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

Let me start by saying I have no opinion on Wolf's capabilities as a GM, but it wasn't just the Packers that passed on him as GM. He left the Packers to join Cleveland as assistant GM in January 2018, was apparently not a candidate when the GM was replaced in 2020 and parted ways with the Browns shortly thereafter. He also claims to have recommended they draft Baker Mayfield FWIW.

Cleveland was tough because he went there for 1 year before the owner blew the whole damn thing up and got rid of everybody. He clearly was passed over for the Green Bay job, I am with Midge, I wonder why. There seemed to be from the outside looking in a lot of reasons why he would have been given a chance.
Not sure if this would have been a reason but he may have been perceived as too much of a Thompson disciple since they appeared to be very close.

That is exactly what it was because the previous guy there was a Thompson guy and they weren't going down that path again.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:24 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Didn't the Pack choose Gutekunst over Wolf for the GM position? Any info on why they liked him better than Wolf?

In the end they did, I don't recall if it came down to those 2 or not. I know Wolf was the "popular" choice but that was just because of his dad. Wolf has been a lifer though, he has been around football front offices his whole life.

Let me start by saying I have no opinion on Wolf's capabilities as a GM, but it wasn't just the Packers that passed on him as GM. He left the Packers to join Cleveland as assistant GM in January 2018, was apparently not a candidate when the GM was replaced in 2020 and parted ways with the Browns shortly thereafter. He also claims to have recommended they draft Baker Mayfield FWIW.

Cleveland was tough because he went there for 1 year before the owner blew the whole damn thing up and got rid of everybody. He clearly was passed over for the Green Bay job, I am with Midge, I wonder why. There seemed to be from the outside looking in a lot of reasons why he would have been given a chance.
Not sure if this would have been a reason but he may have been perceived as too much of a Thompson disciple since they appeared to be very close.

That is exactly what it was because the previous guy there was a Thompson guy and they weren't going down that path again.


Wasn't the previous guy Ted Thompson himself?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:27 pm 
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No it was the guy that came over from Kansas City, but was a long time Thompson guy. John Dorsey was his damn name.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:56 pm 
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Hussra wrote:
Mac Jones reminds me of the Michigan quarterbacks that were popular with NFL GMs in the 90's: Todd Collins, Elvis Grbac, Brian Griese, Bills even drafted backup QB Jay Riemersma but to play TE. Game manager QB's who aren't going to win you the game on their own but aren't going to take bad sacks and turn the ball over and cost you the game. Although Grbac became a turnover machine in the NFL. None of them ended up having much success in the NFL. Chad Henne's another in that mold, but he was a decade later. Jones going to NE gives him a better shot at succeeding, but I don't think he's ever gonna be great.




Noticed you conveniently left Tom Brady -the greatest QB of all time, who came from that time period- off that Michigan list


So much of success at the next level depends on where you land and who is coaching you.. there are many different things that factor into it. But those are a couple. Writing guys off simply because of where they went to school doesn’t hold a lot of water.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:58 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Brick wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
I agree. I feel the same when people criticize QBs drafted from schools with poor track records. The player in question matters, not the school he comes from.

There is a lot of truth to not drafting the guy who plays every game with offensive talent that far exceeds their opponent.

Joe Burrow looks pretty good




Mac Jones does too. So did DeShaun Watson before.. well.. you know..

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 3:36 pm 
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Due to Carr platooning Brady with Henson Brady's Michigan career fell outside the usual mold of game manager handing the ball off + short passing game. Henson would play a quarter in the first half and maybe a series in the 2nd half, Michigan would fall behind and they'd turn the game over to Brady completely to bring them back. I think he had 4 or 5 late game comebacks his final season at Michigan, including against Alabama in the Orange Bowl.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:33 pm 
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They are certainly casting a wide net, and if what I was hearing from some of the podcast today it seems they may be looking for someone to replace Ted Phillips which would be a significant upgrade to the organization.

I would want to bring in as many smart football guys in and get their thoughts on my current roster and more importantly thoughts on Fields and how to best build a team around him. The framework that George and Ted has built has consistently failed when it comes to evaluating talent at many levels, coaching, GM, and that all dovetailed into poor roster construction and even worse roster development.

You can bring in a guy from a successful organization, but he must map out his vision for building an NFL roster, no more falling for GM types that look at combine warriors or athletic college guys that never produced at the collegiate level, need someone that will give you a detailed plan on how to rebuild the roster starting with the Oline.

Some of the names on the list are encouraging, but as has become painfully obvious during the last two post-season press conferences, they drastically need someone to come in and run football operations in order to keep Ted and George far away from making football decisions.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:38 pm 
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Quote:
Phillips has insisted on attention to detail and smooth execution at every level of the Bears operation...Phillips has revitalized both the business and football operations...Phillips is involved in all critical decisions of the Bears and continues to strive to make all aspects of the Bears organization the best in the NFL.

Straight from the Bears website.
One thing about power....those who have it do not give it up willingly. Ted Phillips will not be yielding anything until he flat out retires. They've made it clear that's not happening.

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