Possibly 5th or 6th Once McCarthy and Penix really get going

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*fifth-best. Micheal Penix Jr. already looks better than Caleb ever has.

I’m not sure the Vikings would be interested in a straight-up Caleb-for-JJ trade either. His stock is probably sixth, though obviously you cannot claim McCarthy is better than him because you have nothing to go on. But it is unlikely that McCarthy will be as bad as Williams was, not impossible but pretty unlikely.

Citation needed.

Penix best game by far was against Carolina in a loss. Williams outplayed him against Carolina and actually won. Penix had a rating of 88.9 in that game. Williams has 9 games with a higher rating than that.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

If the Bears called Atlanta asking for a Penix-for-Caleb trade straight up Atlanta would hang up the phone. It’s not even close, Penix is so much better downfield as a passer. His just more fluid, composed and talented. It’s very obvious watching him, but I guess if you still can’t see the truth after watching Caleb get outplayed by his opposing quarterback for two months straight you aren’t going to see it here either.

I think he'll be good but not great but his performance this year was not good in a small sample size.

Also, the age difference does make a difference. Penix should be more NFL ready than Williams given Penix is the third oldest first round QB taken since 2010 with only Nix and Weeden being older.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Atlanta would accept before the Bears even finished talking

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Green Bay's backup actually outplayed Caleb Williams yesterday if we're really being honest here

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Yesterday I felt like I was watching Brady or Mahomes (when he pulled a 15-yard horsecollar penalty out of a back scratch, didn't get called for intentional grounding, and set up a field goal on a 15-yard pass).

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Well he wouldn’t have had to do anything if DJ didn’t fumble like an idiot. Just think of all the calls he’ll get if he’s actually any good.

All of this criticism and discussion about him is regarding his on the field play which has been below average, below expectations and positively inflated while teams were playing modified prevent to run out the clock. Many of the concerns teams had about him going into the draft were about his character, personality and mindset. I can't wait until the entitled, self anointed chosen one sinks his bear claws into the off season. Contacting the recently drafted punter, announcing your intentions to rewrite the league record books and that ridiculous soap box locker room speech about cleaning up towels during camp are just the tip of the iceberg.

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That's my purse! I don't know you!

You're the one that insists on using QBR all the time because it's such a granular, encompassing stat, and totally not because you cherry pick it when it portrays Caleb Williams as "bad" sooo....

Caleb Williams QBR yesterday: 60.8

Malik Willis QBR yesterday: 34.1

...no, he was not outplayed by the GB backup. Even the eye test agrees.

82 punts, 2nd in the league

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The problem with you is that Most of your arguments lack "coherence" and "consistency" Hartgrove. What is used as "supporting evidence" for your drivel today will be summarily dismissed and discredited tomorrow. With your use of QBR being but the latest example of your hypocrisy.

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Couldn't agree more. Could you imagine the type of prick that he'd have been had he come anywhere close to meeting expectations this season?

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Him acting like the Bears just clinched the division and are getting the bye after beating the Packers back-ups was next-level. Never seen anything like that, somebody needs to tell him to chill the fuck out.

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Just wait until you see a wide receiver get a first down

I'm simply using the stat you choose to harp on all the time. I can make the case that Caleb Williams outplayed Malik Willis using MANY other stat markers. What I'm actually doing is highlighting your dishonesty, because you made a proclamation that flies directly in the face of the stat you always try to bash Caleb with. So which is it, did Caleb outplay Malik or not?

Yeah this stuff is getting so stupid. Anyone that lines up at QB is better than Williams at this point in their thinking.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

You're using QBR as supporting evidence for your inane argument today and you'll be dismissing and discrediting it tomorrow Hartgrove. Your hypocritical act is old hat and very predictable at this point.

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No you can't.

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Knowing what you now know about their respective QBRs in this game: Did Caleb Williams outplay Malik Willis?

Ok. How did Willis outperform Williams? How do you support that conclusion?

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

its simple. Anyone that has ever put on the uniform to play QB in the NFL has outperformed Williams. You do not need any stats or anything at all. It is just reality

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

The thing you have to keep in mind is that Williams doesn't have any touchdowns that really counted.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

For one he had a much higher completion % than the "Generational One".

Coupled with Muvh higher Yards per Attempt and Yards per completion too.

Threw for nearly as Many Yards on less than half the attempts.

Generated more than twice as MANY points offensively despite entering the game during the middle of the 2nd Quarter.


The one major stat in Caleb's favor is the TD but that TD was created by DJ Moore's running after the catch. Not because of the pass from Caleb. Which should be noted was caught behind the line of scrimmage.

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Kk thanks for clearing it up. You don't know what you're talking about. Very clear now. OK peace!

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Caleb's last two drives made him better.

And remember, I watch the rookie QBs so Bear fans don't have to, and Michael Penix is not better than Caleb. He throws like a pitcher. Two rookies, at this stage, are significantly better and one is slightly better.

If that's the case why is Caleb's QBR nearly double that of Malik? QBR says Caleb Williams outperformed Malik Willis by a pretty wide margin, why are you dismissing it now?

Willis sucks. He hurt his hand throwing the ball into the turf.