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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Mon Aug 30, 2021 9:48 pm 
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Right. I play with a few clients who take themselves way too seriously and use the range finder at every opportunity to measure slope, distance, whatever else…it’s brutal.

Pros shoot double digits under par in all but a couple tournaments; I think they can handle caddies clubbing them.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 6:41 am 
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Probably like anything else I suppose. The fast players would play even faster and the slow players would probably still play slow. Peer pressure is probably the only thing that would work. Publically calling out slow players.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 9:34 am 
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That wouldn't hurt, but start giving them penalty strokes and play will get faster almost immediately.

jln is correct about guys wanting more yardages than just to the pin. Us hackers are good with "about 100-105 to the middle." The pros want an exact number to...the middle, the pin, the slope on the left, the ridge on the right, any change in elevation, and then look at what the wind is doing.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 10:46 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
That wouldn't hurt, but start giving them penalty strokes and play will get faster almost immediately.

jln is correct about guys wanting more yardages than just to the pin. Us hackers are good with "about 100-105 to the middle." The pros want an exact number to...the middle, the pin, the slope on the left, the ridge on the right, any change in elevation, and then look at what the wind is doing.

Right and they always know how far those "landmarks" are from the pin on the greens. So give them a quick way to get the yardage to the pin and then make those calculations.

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Last edited by Franky T on Tue Aug 31, 2021 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 10:55 am 
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That's also where the caddies are invaluable. Ignorant people laugh at say, "oh they just walk and carry a bag!" They're out there on Monday, Tuesday, and/or Wednesday meticulously calculating distances to and from landmarks, bunkers, ponds, etc.

And don't get me wrong. There are some wayward shots or after a drop that might need a little bit of extra math or planning. In a playoff, I think its acceptable to slow down a bit as well. But when its dead center of the fairway and its >200 to the green, it shouldn't take more than about 20-30 seconds to figure out what you're hitting.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 11:59 am 
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hear 'roids has that effect on folks

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:05 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
That's also where the caddies are invaluable. Ignorant people laugh at say, "oh they just walk and carry a bag!" They're out there on Monday, Tuesday, and/or Wednesday meticulously calculating distances to and from landmarks, bunkers, ponds, etc.

And don't get me wrong. There are some wayward shots or after a drop that might need a little bit of extra math or planning. In a playoff, I think its acceptable to slow down a bit as well. But when its dead center of the fairway and its >200 to the green, it shouldn't take more than about 20-30 seconds to figure out what you're hitting.

I’d assume most these guys know exactly what they’re going to hit once the previous shot leaves the club and they have a feel for where it landed. Add in a chat with their caddy over the hundreds of yards they’re walking between shots and I’d think/hope they’re ~95% certain what comes next barring a crazy lie.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 9:49 am 
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https://www.golfdigest.com/story/pga-tour-brooksy-chants-bryson-dechambeau

fans banned from yelling brooksy at him... it doesnt get much softer than this


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 11:53 am 
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billypootons wrote:
https://www.golfdigest.com/story/pga-tour-brooksy-chants-bryson-dechambeau

fans banned from yelling brooksy at him... it doesnt get much softer than this


Oy, they threw a banana peel on an already slippery slope and then proceeded to step right on it. Bad look.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:24 pm 
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I am sure many sports legends across the board can really relate to how hard it must be for him to be called names during a game.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:30 pm 
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man of few opinions wrote:
I am sure many sports legends across the board can really relate to how hard it must be for him to be called names during a game.

He’s being called somebody else’s name.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:44 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
man of few opinions wrote:
I am sure many sports legends across the board can really relate to how hard it must be for him to be called names during a game.

He’s being called somebody else’s name.

I know! It's horrible.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 2:04 pm 
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Again, it’s Bryson and he’s a douche but isn’t golf supposed to be a gentleman’s game ? Have galleries devolved like the rest of society ? I thought they were supposed to be “above”‘all that ? Golf claps and what not.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 2:06 pm 
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There are certain tournaments where that absolutely has become the case. Everybody is trying to be the next Phoenix Waste Management Open with the party atmosphere. That only works in small doses for golf IMO

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 5:37 pm 
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badrogue17 wrote:
Again, it’s Bryson and he’s a douche but isn’t golf supposed to be a gentleman’s game ? Have galleries devolved like the rest of society ? I thought they were supposed to be “above”‘all that ? Golf claps and what not.

It's supposed to be, but golf appears to have tried the "It's a big tent" approach to growing the sport, particularly with younger people. They appear to have largely succeeded in growing popular with people further down the economic scale and those shorter in the tooth. Top Golf is packed by bowling alleys used to be, mainly by people who have never stepped foot on an actual golf course, and media outlets like Barstool are given access to PGA events and stars at a level seen only by celebrities and the like. Those people, particular the younger guys, are the ones shouting "BROOKSIE!"


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:38 pm 
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They’re shouting brooksie, right? This is the thing that’s beyond the pale for the gentleman’s game?

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:52 pm 
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This Ends in Antioch wrote:
They’re shouting brooksie, right? This is the thing that’s beyond the pale for the gentleman’s game?


Bababooey!


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:59 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
badrogue17 wrote:
Again, it’s Bryson and he’s a douche but isn’t golf supposed to be a gentleman’s game ? Have galleries devolved like the rest of society ? I thought they were supposed to be “above”‘all that ? Golf claps and what not.

It's supposed to be, but golf appears to have tried the "It's a big tent" approach to growing the sport, particularly with younger people. They appear to have largely succeeded in growing popular with people further down the economic scale and those shorter in the tooth. Top Golf is packed by bowling alleys used to be, mainly by people who have never stepped foot on an actual golf course, and media outlets like Barstool are given access to PGA events and stars at a level seen only by celebrities and the like. Those people, particular the younger guys, are the ones shouting "BROOKSIE!"

I honestly can’t think of a less threatening way to troll a guy.

The PGA seems to desire a caste system, wherein the people participating in its games are literally beyond reproach and the normies are under constant threat of eviction if the millionaire has his feelings hurt for any reason.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2021 9:55 pm 
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As I said before, it's not supposed to be like this in golf. JLN had a good description. I was yelling at my radio this morning listening to Uber-Jerko boasting about his right to yell at golfers at a tournament. Why do people think they need to insert themselves into the event? Who needs to hear "Get in the hole" or "Bababooey" ever again? Shut up and watch the pros play.

I know the NBA guys play through heavy heckling, as do college players. Maybe the MLB players hear the collective crowd or even individual fans, many seem to respond to them, as well. I doubt many NFL players hear the individuals, but the collective crowd can influence a game, for sure. Golf can and should be different.

People suck.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 7:57 am 
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I don't even like golf much, but I consider it a huge plus for them that the crowds are respectful. Makes watching it a better experience. That being said, if fans are going to say anything, then let DeChambeau have it.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:22 am 
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I kind of like that PGA puts their foot down outside of Phoenix. Otherwise, it is just loud like everything else.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:32 am 
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badrogue17 wrote:
Again, it’s Bryson and he’s a douche but isn’t golf supposed to be a gentleman’s game ? Have galleries devolved like the rest of society ? I thought they were supposed to be “above”‘all that ? Golf claps and what not.


Is Bryson a gentleman? No, he's a complete asshat and douchebag. So why should fans give him the gentlemen's game respect? you reap what you sew.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 11:31 am 
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That's the toughest part of this argument, it's not as they were picking on some good guy, He has proven to not exhibit the proper behavior, as well, and should be punished for it. But that should come from the PGA, and should have already happened. The fans don't have the job to do so. Complaints to the tournament and tv network should be their route.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 11:33 am 
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If he doesn't perform well at the Ryder Cup, he is going to be hearing it all weekend long. From Euro and American fans.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 12:56 pm 
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I like what Cantaly said about it. He also mentioned playing golf and being heckled is different than in team sports. He talked about being a Yankees player in Boston who knows he is wearing the uniform as a shield and knows in NY Red Sox players will be facing the same thing.

Quote:
"I think it's a tough situation. I think, naturally, of course there is some sympathy because you don't want to see anybody have a bunch of people be against you or even be heckled. I think anybody that watches sports and sees someone being heckled, they don't like that inherently because if you imagine yourself as that person, it wouldn't feel good.

"I think, unfortunately, it might be a symptom of a larger problem, which is social-media driven and which is potentially Player Impact Program derived. I think when you have people that go for attention-seeking maneuvers, you leave yourself potentially open to having the wrong type of attention, and I think maybe that's where we're at it, and it may be a symptom of going for too much attention.

"But it can be awesome, too, because if you succeed and you act perfect all the time and you do the perfect things all the time, and then you also go for the right attention-seeking moves, you get like double bonus points because everyone loves you and you're on the perfect side of it. I think it's just a very live-by-the-sword, die-by-the-sword type of deal. And when you leave it to a jury, you don't know what's going to happen. So it's hard to get all 12 people on a jury on your side.

"And if you're playing professional golf on the stage that you're playing on and 98 percent of the people are pulling for you and there are 10,000 people on the green, I don't know, what does that leave, 20 people that don't like you, even if 98 percent of the people like you? And if those 20 people have had enough to drink or feel emboldened enough to say something because they want to impress the girl they're standing next to, then, yeah, like, you're in trouble. Like, people are going to say bad things.

"Golf, unfortunately, doesn't and probably shouldn't tolerate that. I think there's a respect level in golf and there's intimacy that the fans can get so, so close to you, and you're also all by yourself, and you don't have the armor of putting on Yankee pinstripes, and you don't have the armor of having, knowing that if you're on the Yankees and people hate you and you're playing in Boston, you can tolerate it for three hours in right field. But you only tolerate it because you know next week or on Friday you're going to show up and you're going to be in Yankee Stadium and no matter what you do, even if you fall on your face, you're going to have the pinstripe armor on and people are going to love you.

"So golf is different in that respect, that if you only have 2 percent of the people that are very against you because you're polarizing and because you're attention-seeking, then you're kind of dead because those people are going to be loud, and they're going to want to say something to get under your skin.

"And I think golf shouldn't let that happen. I think the Masters is a great example of a place that doesn't let that happen, and it's the greatest place to watch and play professional golf because of the atmosphere they create. I think if you look at the history of the game and you look at the respect that underlies the entirety of the history of the game, we shouldn't tolerate it, and we shouldn't celebrate that. We should celebrate the fan that is respectful and pulls for their side.

"So it's a tough situation. It's a tough topic, but that would be my take on it and I'm sure it's not perfect, but after thinking about it a little bit, it's the best I can come up with."


https://www.golfdigest.com/story/patric ... ling-issue

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 1:12 pm 
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Good post, Franky. Hard to disagree with anything Cantlay said really.

McIlroy had some comments yesterday that were similar, but also added that Bryson brings some of this on himself which is also hard to disagree with.

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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 1:18 pm 
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Golf is a tradition like no other.

So keep the tradition. Call him Brooksie on his free time.


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 Post subject: Re: Bryson DeChambeau
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2021 6:54 pm 
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There’s an American tennis player on right now named Brooksby. I would love to call that out at De Chambeau.


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