The accounts are actual players on the dolphins saying Martin was a part of some of the same hazing that he is complaining about. Do I really need to spend the time finding the link for you?


He wasn't around him 24/7 yet they engaged each other over Twitter and what did they say 1400 texts?

Him not saying anything was more than likely his lawyers choice but him not saying anything was the worst he could do. Not the worst thing that happened in this case. Hopefully you know me enough to know I didn't mean

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You guys are all over the map.

Are you honestly saying that him trying to get along with Incognito is something he did wrong?

The only real answer we've gotten here is that Martin told someone of the abuse he was receiving. I feel sorry for you if you feel that victims of abuse don't have a right to tell people about it.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Of course he was in a position to stop his own hazing. He's 6 foot 5 ,330 pounds. All he has to do is say "no more". If that fails, he should have punched Incognito (or whomever was harassing him) in the mouth.

If he didn't think hazing was right when directed towards him, thinking it was okay when directed at someone else is hypocritical. Can't have it both ways.

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Go Cubs!!!!

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I don't remember half the time if I'm hiding or I'm lost

"No more"

...or assault him.

This is insanity.

He didn't think it was okay. He couldn't stop his own hazing. How could he stop others from being hazed?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I honestly have not seen one actual account in which a Dolphins player said something specific about Martin participating in an act of hazing. They may exist, I've never seen them. In fact, I'd be stunned if they did exist because I would assume Dolphins lawyers have everyone silenced about all of this.

Has anyone else here had work place stress or bad relationships with someone at work? I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that......100% of us have. Have we "maintained contact" with people at work that caused the stress or were just "bad co-workers"? I"m gonna go out on a limb and say that.......100% of us have. In fact, many of us have gotten to the point where we consider leaving our job due to the perceived unfair treatment by others and from others in our workplace (including me and you, Chris).

Now, has anyone ever received some sort of communication outside of work from those shitty co-workers that involved:
1. racial slurs
2. threats of violence
3. threats against your family

So explain to me again why it's bad that Martin kept communicating with his tormentors while at work?
And why it's bad/weak that he walked out?
And he is seeking therapy/counseling because of something that happened at work?

The way Martin is being portrayed (by some) is pretty pathetic, IMO. He was clearly the victim, has lots of evidence - both real and anecdotal - and he did something wrong?

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No, that's how a grown man would approach it. Stand up for yourself and if the other party shows they are unwilling to halt the behavior, you demonstrate the fact that you will not be a victim. But you don't go AWOL from teammates depending on you and get another starting lineman suspended. Putting himself before the team and showing weakness in not being able to handle his own battles means he will always be looked upon as a traitor and a coward.

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Go Cubs!!!!

Actually, children and horses respond to frustration with physical violence.

Grown men control their emotions and handle it in responsible ways.

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How many documented stories do you have. Stuff that has come out that Martin had to endure. So far I heard the voicemail and about the trip he was forced to pay for. Oh and he got into it with a teammate. You're portraying him in the same way you a victim of domestic violence. Slow it down there big fella as it's not even close. He was called a few horrible names and made to pay for a trip. Oh my god shut down the Dolphins.

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look at my guy spanky.....throw it DOWN big man !

These are NFL players......for an NFL player to expose what was going on and cry to others to solve his problems, makes that player look like a schoolyard sissy that doesn't belong. It is responsible to handle it as I suggested and it would leave the players image intact, rather than being forever stained as others look down on him as a coward.

You sound like a guy who was raised without a Father and so you learned to handle things like a woman might.

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Go Cubs!!!!

Grown men don't assault other men.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Jimmy the Greek.

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Good people drink good beer - Hunter S. Thompson

<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way

Tell me what he did wrong! He has the right to tell people of the abuse. The dolphins clearly thought it was bad enough to suspend Incognito and basically end his career in Miami.

Unless Martin is making it up there is nothing wrong with what he did.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

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Not to Panther this thread, but I feel like Cam Cleeland's take on this is extremely relevant and no one is repsonding to it.

It is relevant, but it makes it harder to blame the victim.

We are already at the stage of victim blaming where you say "He wasn't even treated that badly! He should have just taken it!".

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

That cook Paula Dean too I believe.

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Go Cubs!!!!

There was a painter once that kept his job after making racial slurs.

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Was this really worth you going back and making the edit?

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Yes, it just struck me as the kind of thing a Mother teaches her child. The Father knows that while it might be best to avoid a physical altercation if possible, sometimes you need to stand up for yourself. If that means throwing down, so be it. He comes off like a guy who was raised by a single Mom.

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Go Cubs!!!!

He did that! He avoided a physical altercation! In fact, he hurt Incognito far more than a punch to the face.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

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Well Im pretty sure you could get away most of this if you work for Chicago, Cook County or State of Illinois and are politically connected. In fact, you could probably end up with a raise in some of these circumstances afterwards.

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He hurt Incognito sure. But the rest of his teammates were hurt as well, by his actions. that's why he has gone AWOL and not returned. He can't look his teammates in the eye, knowing he put himself before the team. His actions resulted in the team losing 40% of it's offensive line, resulting in a loss to a previously winless team. With more losses likely to come that otherwise might have been wins.

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Go Cubs!!!!

It’s hard for Cam Cleeland to look at the news coming out of Miami over the last week.

Partly because of his own experience with hazing, which left him with one good eye.

The former tight end was brutalized during a ritual running of the gauntlet during his rookie training camp with the Saints. The kicks and punches were one thing, but one teammate (linebacker Andre Royal) hit him in the face with a sock full of coins, crushing his eye socket and nearly costing him his eye.

“Coach [Mike] Ditka gave me a speech as soon as it was done,” Cleeland told Sam Farmer of the Los Angeles Times. “He was like, ‘Oh, man, you should have just popped those guys in the mouth.’ I said, ‘Coach, there were 60 of them.’”

That memory piqued his interest in the Jonathan Martin-Richie Incognito situation, particularly since he was playing in St. Louis when the Rams drafted Incognito.



Steve and Chris and anyone else who is blaming Martin, how would you respond to Cleeland?

Right now I'm not sure why the Dolphins suspended him after Martin himself said Incognito did nothing wrong.

I've told you what Martin did wrong.
He hazed others like he was hazed than cried foul.
He kept contact outside of work with RI.
He walked away from his whole team rather than expressing his dislike for what was going on.

Please please please stop comparing this to domestic violence.

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Who cares? This whole "put the team before yourself" thing shows what a neanderthal you are. If you were being harassed at work, would you care about hurting the company you work for?

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I think I'm going to need to hear more about this. I doubt Martin was hazing others. My guess is he may have been involved in a group hazing but can you blame him?
What? He was trying to be a good teammate!
His coach was actively involved! What other choice did he have besides to just take it.
It's the same victim blaming that goes on there.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!