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SpiralStairs
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:09 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
Guys why is the discourse so bad here? I'm going to go cry about it with GoldenJet.


You're going to make me post the image aren't you?

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Juice's Lecture Notes
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:10 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
Brooks was within an eyeball approximation of the X2 taser's effective range. The website says almost 5 meters, shakes says he was 18 feet away.

Now let's set the stage for you arguing that the officer knew or should have known that his partner's taser was fired twice during the adrenaline-fueled struggle.


Oh. That's an interesting answer to the question I posed.

Is being within the effective range of the weapon that one just fired at a police officer somehow NOT make them a threat?
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Franky T
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:10 pm 
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shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

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SpiralStairs
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:10 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
Brooks was within an eyeball approximation of the X2 taser's effective range. The website says almost 5 meters, shakes says he was 18 feet away.

Now let's set the stage for you arguing that the officer knew or should have known that his partner's taser was fired twice during the adrenaline-fueled struggle.


Oh. That's an interesting answer to the question I posed.

Is being within the effective range of the weapon that one just fired at a police officer somehow NOT make them a threat?


Keep it up!

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Caller Bob
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:10 pm 
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Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.
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Juice's Lecture Notes
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:12 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
Guys why is the discourse so bad here? I'm going to go cry about it with GoldenJet.


You're going to make me post the image aren't you?
Image
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Franky T
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:13 pm 
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Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.

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good dolphin
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:13 pm 
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Were chicago citizens SAFER when cops could play them a tune with their baton and send them on their way rather than pulling a gun today

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billypootons
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:13 pm 
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Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.


this is JLN's dream to debate law with a real lawyer. let him enjoy it.
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badrogue17
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:17 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Were chicago citizens SAFER when cops could play them a tune with their baton and send them on their way rather than pulling a gun today

I asked that last week. Few whacks to the knees effectively disables fleeing / resisting suspects but then along came fleeing from the police Rodney King and there went that .

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Last edited by badrogue17 on Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Terry's Peeps
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Franky T wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.


So did Julie DiCaro.

Would you trust her legal thoughts?

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Bagels
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Franky T wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.


So did Julie DiCaro.

Would you trust her legal thoughts?

:lol:
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Jaw Breaker
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.


I don't know...this might be good legal advice, but it sounds like terrible policy:

shakes wrote:
If the cops were better cops they would've shot the guy while they were struggling in hand to hand combat. Would've been a lot easier to meet the required standard stated above.


Shoot as soon as you have the chance!

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Seacrest
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:20 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Franky T wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.


So did Julie DiCaro.

Would you trust her legal thoughts?


TKO

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denisdman
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:22 pm 
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If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.

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Nas
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:23 pm 
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The DA argued the cop knew the taser was useless because it had already been discharged twice and Brooks was too far away. Not sure how you prove that.

There were other charges beyond murder. The officer kicked Brooks after killing him and stood on his body. That says a lot about his state of mind.

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Bagels
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:25 pm 
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Nas wrote:
The officer kicked Brooks after killing him and stood on his body. That says a lot about his state of mind.


yea thats.....real bad
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conns7901
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:26 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Franky T wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.


So did Julie DiCaro.

Would you trust her legal thoughts?


I think Shakes has said he actually went to law school with DiCaro.

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Franky T
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:27 pm 
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Terry's Peeps wrote:
Franky T wrote:
Caller Bob wrote:
Franky T wrote:
shakes is right here. Imagine that, a real lawyer having the proper analysis over internet lawyers.

He's an ambulance chaser, if I recall.

That doesn't mean he didn't go to law school.


So did Julie DiCaro.

Would you trust her legal thoughts?

Shots fired at shakes!

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We lose a lot of rights when we look the other way when it doesn't affect our lives or it isn't a cause we agree with.
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SpiralStairs
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:27 pm 
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Bagels wrote:
Nas wrote:
The officer kicked Brooks after killing him and stood on his body. That says a lot about his state of mind.


yea thats.....real bad


He was standing on him so he wouldn't be standing in a pool of blood. You can never be sure what kind of blood-borne illnesses these types have.

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Jaw Breaker
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:28 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.

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denisdman
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:32 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


My concern is chasing after a man that took an officer’s weapon. This is going to end up with someone dead most of the time. And started as a guy sleeping in his car. That should never end in a dead suspect.

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SpiralStairs
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:33 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


If you have identified a person (name, address, etc) and they run away, were are they going to hide?

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badrogue17
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:35 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


My concern is chasing after a man that took an officer’s weapon. This is going to end up with someone dead most of the time. And started as a guy sleeping in his car. That should never end in a dead suspect.

And it wouldn’t have if a) someone didn’t call police for them to come in the first place and b) if he allows himself to be handcuffed.

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denisdman
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:37 pm 
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The police have to be the adults in the room and deescalate. They are going to encounter people with mental illness, on drugs, or drunk. These suspects are not going to act rationally in many cases. I don’t want them shot dead.

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FrankDrebin
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:39 pm 
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Lengthen police academy training and include MMA classes. Replace bullets with tranquilizer darts.

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Juice's Lecture Notes
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:40 pm 
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SpiralStairs wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


If you have identified a person (name, address, etc) and they run away, were are they going to hide?
Yes! Officers should just let people take their weapons and assault them with it, then let them run off into the night with those weapons!
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Nas
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:41 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


My concern is chasing after a man that took an officer’s weapon. This is going to end up with someone dead most of the time. And started as a guy sleeping in his car. That should never end in a dead suspect.


You can make the case that he didn’t follow department policy, but I'm not sure how that becomes murder.

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SpiralStairs
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:42 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


If you have identified a person (name, address, etc) and they run away, were are they going to hide?
Yes! Officers should just let people take their weapons and assault them with it, then let them run off into the night with those weapons!


Yes! That's what I've been advocating for this entire time! Way to figure it out!

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Franky T
 Post subject: Re: I Can't Breathe II
PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:44 pm 
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Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
SpiralStairs wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
denisdman wrote:
If this type of deadly force is taught in academies or allowed, I think we need to reevaluate that. But I suspect the cop will be found not guilty. This is a real close one. What should have happened is that the cops should not have chased as I have said before much like a high speed chase that is discontinued.

We need to raise the standard for deadly force and work towards deescalation. This probably could have been defused at an earlier point.


The situation seemed pretty de-escalated just prior to Brooks deciding to bolt. Now if you're saying they should have let him run at that point, understand that police would no longer be able to arrest anyone short of a violent crime, since they will all run knowing the police can't or won't chase.


If you have identified a person (name, address, etc) and they run away, were are they going to hide?
Yes! Officers should just let people take their weapons and assault them with it, then let them run off into the night with those weapons!

How is a weapon if it had already been fired twice and couldn't be fired again?

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