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 Post subject: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:00 pm 
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There were 11k fewer balls put in play this year than there were a decade ago, more strikeouts than hits for the first time ever and the fewest hits in 50 years. This sounds like a MAJOR issue.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:29 pm 
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More guys gotta lay bunts down against the shift, that's what will stop Defenses from loading up the right side. And choke up when ya get 2 strikes..wtf

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:35 pm 
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Small, fast players are a thing of the past. Tall, muscular dudes are how shit rolls now. Grip it and rip it.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:42 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:43 pm 
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The league is lost in space. They are obsessed with shortening the games and the solution is right in front of them.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:53 pm 
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For those who have followed the debate over switching to an electronic strike zone, I have a question: do the errors predominantly favor the hitter (i.e., human umps are calling too many actual strikes as balls) or vice versa?

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:58 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:59 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
For those who have followed the debate over switching to an electronic strike zone, I have a question: do the errors predominantly favor the hitter (i.e., human umps are calling too many actual strikes as balls) or vice versa?


I think far more balls are being called strikes.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:06 pm 
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It's hard to tell how it would play out.

The issue really is that the meaning of balls and strikes has been lost. The reason the count exists is so pitchers don't throw pitches that are utterly unhittable. I'm not talking about a nasty slider or fastball, I'm talking a ball launched over a batter's head. Balls and strikes are there to keep the fight a fair one for batters.

Now it's becoming such a mundane but overwhelmingly important battleground where an easily hittable pitch delivered 1cm to the outside of what is really an arbitrary and imaginary box is declared unhittable and the pitcher in penalized for it. It won't be hard to get batters to start swinging again if you change the terms of the pitches they are expected to swing at.

A good eye is a skill. I am not saying those who can discern what is a ball or strike are untalented, but it's so boring to watch and so slow...it just doesn't belong in the game.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:10 pm 
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It's wild how 5 years ago I would have told you baseball was humming along nicely while the NFL was in existential crisis. Now the script feels flipped.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:10 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
For those who have followed the debate over switching to an electronic strike zone, I have a question: do the errors predominantly favor the hitter (i.e., human umps are calling too many actual strikes as balls) or vice versa?


I think far more balls are being called strikes.


That surprises me as it seems batters are taking borderline pitches at a record clip, even on 0-2 counts. I'd think that wouldn't happen so much if they were consistently getting burned by umps.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:21 pm 
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Small, fast players are a thing of the past.

Team speed? For Christ's sake....

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 8:59 am 
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America wrote:
It's hard to tell how it would play out.

The issue really is that the meaning of balls and strikes has been lost. The reason the count exists is so pitchers don't throw pitches that are utterly unhittable. I'm not talking about a nasty slider or fastball, I'm talking a ball launched over a batter's head. Balls and strikes are there to keep the fight a fair one for batters.

Now it's becoming such a mundane but overwhelmingly important battleground where an easily hittable pitch delivered 1cm to the outside of what is really an arbitrary and imaginary box is declared unhittable and the pitcher in penalized for it. It won't be hard to get batters to start swinging again if you change the terms of the pitches they are expected to swing at.

A good eye is a skill. I am not saying those who can discern what is a ball or strike are untalented, but it's so boring to watch and so slow...it just doesn't belong in the game.


Contrearas wildly celebrated a walk the other day

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:08 am 
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Make the zone bigger. Make them pay the price for sitting on home run pitches.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:08 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
America wrote:
It's hard to tell how it would play out.

The issue really is that the meaning of balls and strikes has been lost. The reason the count exists is so pitchers don't throw pitches that are utterly unhittable. I'm not talking about a nasty slider or fastball, I'm talking a ball launched over a batter's head. Balls and strikes are there to keep the fight a fair one for batters.

Now it's becoming such a mundane but overwhelmingly important battleground where an easily hittable pitch delivered 1cm to the outside of what is really an arbitrary and imaginary box is declared unhittable and the pitcher in penalized for it. It won't be hard to get batters to start swinging again if you change the terms of the pitches they are expected to swing at.

A good eye is a skill. I am not saying those who can discern what is a ball or strike are untalented, but it's so boring to watch and so slow...it just doesn't belong in the game.


Contrearas wildly celebrated a walk the other day

He actually does that (bat throw) frequently when it's an important to get on base situation.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:09 am 
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Which is fine, but then in turn Cubs players (Baez) cannot bitch about opposing teams flipping their bats or celebrating after a win.

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Last edited by Frank Coztansa on Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:09 am 
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How do you make the zone larger without totally imbalancing in favor of pitchers though? I dont have a problem with the runs being scored now, just the glacial pace and boring unwatchability of guys coming up to the plate intent on taking a walk.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:15 am 
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Pitchers are really good. Hitting is really hard.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:17 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
Pitchers are really good. Hitting is really hard.


Especially when you strategize to not swing the bat.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:19 am 
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It’s a better strategy than swinging at a pitch they can’t hit.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:24 am 
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I think part of it is the new wave of hard throwers...they throw 98+ and miss a lot of bats, but that almost always comes with more wildness and more walks.

At some point, the height of the mound and even the 60.5' distance may need to be re-examined. We may be reaching the tipping point where the reaction time of even the best batters won't be fast enough. Ironically, I think that's what helped Baez this year...I got the sense he gave up trying to react to pitches and just decided before the pitch whether he was going to swing or not.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:24 am 
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Keyser Soze wrote:
It’s a better strategy than swinging at a pitch they can’t hit.


You know what I mean with the Cub Way and other teams stressing do not swing at first pitch etc. Get the starters out of the game etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:25 am 
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Part of this is bullpens that have guys firing 97 coming in to pitch in the 5th and 6th inning.

As time goes on, the 4 complete games by the Sox in the '05 ALCS is becoming more and more of a historic feat. In twenty years, its going to seem impossible that something like that ever happened.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:26 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Part of this is bullpens that have guys firing 97 coming in to pitch in the 5th and 6th inning.

As time goes on, the 4 complete games by the Sox in the '05 ALCS is becoming more and more of a historic feat. In twenty years, its going to seem impossible that something like that ever happened.


I agree.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:27 am 
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A possible way to rebalance expanding the zone is to give teams 3 pitching changes per 9 inning game (with a new pitching change in extra's and every 3 innings after) and making 3 BB's an automatic ejection. Similar to the foul limit.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:30 am 
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America wrote:
A possible way to rebalance expanding the zone is to give teams 3 pitching changes per 9 inning game (with a new pitching change in extra's and every 3 innings after) and making 3 BB's an automatic ejection. Similar to the foul limit.
Or I could sleep in the park! You could knock these walls down, make it an eight room luxury suite.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:31 am 
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I used to be a "the game is fine the way it is!" person but shit's gotten way out of hand.


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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:32 am 
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America wrote:
I used to be a "the game is fine the way it is!" person but shit's gotten way out of hand.


It was. The launch angle crap is responsible for this.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:33 am 
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America wrote:
A possible way to rebalance expanding the zone is to give teams 3 pitching changes per 9 inning game (with a new pitching change in extra's and every 3 innings after) and making 3 BB's an automatic ejection. Similar to the foul limit.


I like your concept about an ejection after x number of BB, though I would think you would need to incorporate that with an electronic zone. The good thing about that idea is it doesn't fundamentally change the rules/stats for historical purposes the same way moving the mound or other ideas would.

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 Post subject: Re: Hitting?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:34 am 
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pittmike wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:
It’s a better strategy than swinging at a pitch they can’t hit.


You know what I mean with the Cub Way and other teams stressing do not swing at first pitch etc. Get the starters out of the game etc.

That's pretty much gone now with the rise of dominant bullpens.


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