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| Torre, fired? https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=92&t=15346 |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Torre, fired? |
You might think that Steinbrenner has been hoping for a reason to fire Torre. I think this is it. If you vote yes, you also should mention who the next manager will be. Also, is Girardi an upgrade to Torre? I seriously doubt it. |
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| Author: | Stinkfinger The Crow [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:13 am ] |
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The corpse of Billy Martin will manage again. |
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| Author: | Bulldog Scott [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:13 am ] |
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I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. |
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| Author: | hootmon [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:20 am ] |
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I agree, George has been waiting for his chance to axe Torre. I think it is unjustified, but it is not my team. I don't think a different manager is the answer to getting back to the World Series. I don't know if Girardi gets the job, that seems too cut-and-dried for me. Maybe he can pry Buck Showalter loose for another try. |
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| Author: | stoneroses86 [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:35 am ] |
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Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be.
Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? |
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| Author: | stoneroses86 [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:36 am ] |
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Stinkfinger The Crow wrote: The corpse of Billy Martin will manage again.
It is too soon for these types of remarks. |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:38 am ] |
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stoneroses86 wrote: Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? The failures of this team are the fault of the field manager? I think it's more Steinbrenners fault. You don't succeed in this league by just buying the highest priced parts and pray they fit together. |
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| Author: | The Original Kid Cairo [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:43 am ] |
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Agreed. Money can't buy a title. You'd think George would've learned that by now. We saw it with the 2004 LA Lakers and we've seen it with the Yankees since 2000. Torre will be the scapegoat but I don't agree with it. |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:45 am ] |
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I said Steinbrenner even though I know he is not the GM. OK? But I know he's the one making the decisions here. Just didn't want anyone to think I thought he was the GM. |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:46 am ] |
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You know, one could give Torre lots of credit for taking a team full of superstars and making it work as well as it ddid. |
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| Author: | Bagels [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:59 am ] |
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Despite what Cub fans might think right now, I think actually making the playoffs is a big accomplishment. Baseball is a long season, and to overcome their poor start and still make the playoffs is a credit to Torre. Over the course of 162 games, the better team(s) are likely to advance. However once in the playoffs, anything goes. It's too easy to run into a hot team like the Rockies or play poor yourself, all it takes is one or two bad performances to sink you. Wang was a great pitcher throughout the year and a likely Cy Young candidate, but stunk up the ALDS. Is that Torre's fault? All I'm saying is that we've seen teams make great playoff runs, we've seen a team that won 83 games win the WS, so anything can happen. I'm not saying the Yankees or any other team should accept not winning the WS, but only 1 team can win it. You can't fire every other manager or claim that they weren't successful. In a short 5 game series anything can happen. |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:00 am ] |
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Maybe that Divisional Series should go 7, instead of putting in more time during the WS? |
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| Author: | Bagels [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:02 am ] |
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Darkside wrote: Maybe that Divisional Series should go 7, instead of putting in more time during the WS?
Well, basketball made the 1st round best of 7, and they even have an additional round |
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| Author: | Bulldog Scott [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:03 am ] |
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stoneroses86 wrote: Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? I don't think he's done a bad job. It's not his fault that the Yankee starters have an ERA over 6 in the last 17 post season game (where the Yankees are 4-13). There isn't a whole lot of managing that goes into being the Yankee manager. It's more about managing egos. Anything can happen in a short series. |
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| Author: | Bulldog Scott [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:04 am ] |
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Darkside wrote: Maybe that Divisional Series should go 7, instead of putting in more time during the WS?
Good idea. |
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| Author: | good dolphin [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:04 am ] |
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stoneroses86 wrote: Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? I assume you think Cashman should be fired as well. |
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| Author: | Darkside [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:06 am ] |
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good dolphin wrote: stoneroses86 wrote: Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? I assume you think Cashman should be fired as well. He's just taking orders. Cashman is only a rubber stamp. |
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| Author: | stoneroses86 [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:24 am ] |
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good dolphin wrote: I assume you think Cashman should be fired as well. Somewhere in the memory banks of this board, I entered a post in October, 2006 suggesting just that. |
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| Author: | Frank Coztansa [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:31 am ] |
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yanks are done. no pitching, guys leaving. the wont make the playoffs next year. i couldnt be happier. now if we can just get those silly redsox off the map and return the O's to glory in the east |
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| Author: | Bagels [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:36 am ] |
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Frank Coztansa wrote: yanks are done. no pitching, guys leaving. the wont make the playoffs next year. i couldnt be happier. now if we can just get those silly redsox off the map and return the O's to glory in the east
What about them getting Santana? It's possible |
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| Author: | W_Z [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:51 am ] |
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Darkside wrote: Maybe that Divisional Series should go 7, instead of putting in more time during the WS?
considering that there was only one DS series that was not a total sweep (but nearly was), I do believe the divisional series should go 7. baseball is about marathons, not sprints. the DS series just seems to be too cardiovascular, and the pace just seems off. all 3 series should be 7 games. to me in basketball...the playoffs go on too long. first series being 5 games i had no problem with. |
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| Author: | Mustang Rob [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:20 pm ] |
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good dolphin wrote: stoneroses86 wrote: Bulldog Scott wrote: I don't think he should be, but i think he will be. Why don't you people believe he should be fired? If you failed at your job for seven straight years, would you still have it? I assume you think Cashman should be fired as well. Living in Chicago it's easy to have a skewed perspective of success in sports. Each manager & GM job comes with a different set of expectations, and for the Yankees anything short of a championship trophy is a failure. That's the price of a virtually limitless payroll. Cashman (much like Beane) has failed to build a team capable of winning in the post season. He is more at fault this season than Torre. Personally, I find it ironic that Torre will likely be fired in a season where he did some of his better managing. He pulled the plug on Musina, played Melky & Mientkiewich, developed & protected Joba, and pitched a bunch of unproven kids while blowing up the pen that Cashman stuck him with. I'd take Torre over Francona any day. |
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| Author: | W_Z [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:38 pm ] |
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Frank Drebin wrote: WZ If divisional series go 7 games we'rer taking Nov. 7th before we have a Champion. You think these ball players will fare well in Northern climates in Nov? remember how everybody was bitching at the beginning of this year about how the cold weather was killing the players and the games? You ready for that argument to be brought into the WS? Makes me sweat just thinking about it.
If they go 7 games in the DS you're looking at shortening the interval between games. no more 11 day 7 game series, you gotta bring it down to 8 or 9. or shorten the regular season and take it back to what it should be, 154 games. |
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| Author: | Stinkfinger The Crow [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:39 pm ] |
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W_Z wrote: Frank Drebin wrote: WZ If divisional series go 7 games we'rer taking Nov. 7th before we have a Champion. You think these ball players will fare well in Northern climates in Nov? remember how everybody was bitching at the beginning of this year about how the cold weather was killing the players and the games? You ready for that argument to be brought into the WS? Makes me sweat just thinking about it. If they go 7 games in the DS you're looking at shortening the interval between games. no more 11 day 7 game series, you gotta bring it down to 8 or 9. or shorten the regular season and take it back to what it should be, 154 games. Owners will never go for that, that's 8 games' $$$ they'd be giving up. |
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| Author: | hootmon [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:52 pm ] |
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Darkside wrote: You know, one could give Torre lots of credit for taking a team full of superstars and making it work as well as it ddid.
The Yanks would have won the last four World Series if Torre wasn't a racist piece of shit who doesn't respect the black players Love, Gary Sheffield |
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| Author: | Mustang Rob [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:04 pm ] |
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hootmon wrote: Darkside wrote: You know, one could give Torre lots of credit for taking a team full of superstars and making it work as well as it ddid. The Yanks would have won the last four World Series if Torre wasn't a racist piece of shit who doesn't respect the black players Love, Gary Sheffield +1 Kenny Lofton |
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| Author: | Colonel Angus [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:04 pm ] |
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Stinkfinger The Crow wrote: W_Z wrote: Frank Drebin wrote: WZ If divisional series go 7 games we'rer taking Nov. 7th before we have a Champion. You think these ball players will fare well in Northern climates in Nov? remember how everybody was bitching at the beginning of this year about how the cold weather was killing the players and the games? You ready for that argument to be brought into the WS? Makes me sweat just thinking about it. If they go 7 games in the DS you're looking at shortening the interval between games. no more 11 day 7 game series, you gotta bring it down to 8 or 9. or shorten the regular season and take it back to what it should be, 154 games. Owners will never go for that, that's 8 games' $$$ they'd be giving up. That's true. But if you added another round of playoffs they might consider. But they would think that would be too many teams in the playoffs. Quite frankly, anyone could make a good argument that half the teams in this year's playoffs didn't deserve to be in. |
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| Author: | W_Z [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 6:55 pm ] |
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Stinkfinger The Crow wrote: Owners will never go for that, that's 8 games' $$$ they'd be giving up. i know, it'll never happen. but i'm just saying, it'd be better to have the DS at 7 games, and a shorter regular season. one day i'll rule the world. |
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| Author: | FavreFan [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:22 pm ] |
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Its the owners fault more than anything. $200 million just doesnt buy what it used to. If he stopped being so damn cheap and got the payroll up around $300 million, they probably would make it at least to the ALCS, and maybe even be competitive for the WS |
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| Author: | Regular Reader [ Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:45 pm ] |
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Exactly what did Torre do??? In the mid to late 90's he had a team of 'overachievers' (who played fundamentally sound baseball and pitched well) and won (in an otherwise weak AL and era of baseball in general). Nevermind that he hadn't been previously been noted for great motivational skills or baseball acumen, he still took the lion's share of credit, as a motivator and engineer. No great baseball moves, no exhibition of acumen, but he was the old baseball sage (along with Zimmer) that had his (false) star polished since his team won. He was IMO, simply the quintessential monkey driving the team bus, nothing more, but to say so then was sacriledge. But then Paul O'Neil retired, Bernie Williams/Posada/Rivera/Pettite/Clemens got old or left and suddenly this was a team of superstars that needed a leader. Torre had no answer, as usual, but it couldn't fall on him...right? To think that his defense is that a $200MM payroll was/is the end of a brief Yankee dynasty, because the last six teams could never embrace the concept of team baseball he preached is laughable. This, the team picked to win (almost w/o argument) in all in at least 3 or 4 of the last 7 years. Oops... Yeah, it's impossible to win with a team of mercenaries...right? I seem to remember the 70's when Reggie, Catfish, Goose, Dent and other high priced free agents lived in a fishbowl, but won? (even with an occaisional manager with a Napoleonic complex, and even in NYC) And to think that I hate the Yankees... |
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