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| Bill James on Roids https://mail.chicagofanatics.com/viewtopic.php?f=92&t=35207 |
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| Author: | Mustang Rob [ Fri Jul 24, 2009 2:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Bill James on Roids |
Interesting take, I guess in 40-50 years we'll know if it's the correct one. http://www.actapublications.com/images/ ... ids_F2.pdf |
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| Author: | rogers park bryan [ Fri Jul 24, 2009 2:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
I knew Bill James was on roids. |
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| Author: | suckers playground [ Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
Thanks for the link, MR. Hard to argue these points, and as soon as I can figure out a way to articulate it, I'd add a sixth - something along the lines of (I mean this, no sarcasm) "it's just a game." No matter how important baseball is to future generations, what's really going to matter for the majority of fans is the present, not what's happened in the past. |
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| Author: | 24_Guy [ Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
Good article and the guy knows what he's talking about. But, it seems like his whole premise is based on the idea that steroids simply extend a player's career. That's ignoring a big part of the equation. Guys like Palmeiro never hit for power until the roids. Guys like Sosa didn't hit at all until the roids. Guys like Brady Anderson, well you get the point. And some guys like McGwire and Pudge seem to have been on the juice from the beginning of their careers, which goes against James' theory. Who knows how much lower their numbers would be? So, saying that guys just use PED to add a few years to their careers, like how we all apparently will be extending our lives soon, is missing the target a bit IMHO. |
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| Author: | suckers playground [ Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
That's all PEDs do, though - keep you absurdly "young." The power came from the extra strength training and conditioning these guys were able to do thanks to the PEDs, not directly from the drugs. In other words, the drugs alone don't grow the muscles. |
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| Author: | 24_Guy [ Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
That's true, but still, in a case like Sosa, the PED's made his career, they didn't just extend it. When Sosa was young, he was striking out 200 times a year and hitting .220. He didn't need a fountain of youth, he needed 50 pounds of muscle. I don't know if I'm splitting hairs or just misunderstanding James' argument, but it seems to me he is minimizing how much the PED's impacted these guys. I'm not sure I have a problem in general with PED's, I'm just not in the camp that says that guys that used them were HOF players even without them. James to me seems to be somewhat indirectly leaning that way in that article. |
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| Author: | Jalapenos and More [ Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bill James on Roids |
Depending on how you feel about Selena Roberts' credibility, A-Rod may have been juicing as a teen, which makes all of his accomplishments suspect. |
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