If you win the triple crown and your team is in contention you are the MVP. Those stats and figures are nice, but let's not get crazy with them.

There are players that have had better seasons than Cabrera who did not win the triple crown. Triple crown does not equal MVP.

There are players that have had better seasons than Cabrera who did not win the triple crown.

And there are players that have had worse seasons than Cabrera who did win the MVP.

I look at it like this. If I've got a one-run lead with two outs and the bases loaded, I know which of those two I'd prefer to face.

But if you had a 2 run lead in the 9th, I know which one would get replaced defensively.


The Triple Crown should have no bearing on it, imo. If Dunn ends up with one more homerun that wont change Cabrera's season for me.


I think Trout helped his team win more games than Cabrera

I'm not sure who helped his team win more. But you and I both know the defense of these guys is insignificant and the MVP certainly isn't hinging on that.

I remember a previous conversation we had where you insisted along with Darkside that the Tigers offense was better than that of the White Sox. That was in spite of the fact that the Sox had outscored the Tigers. They Sox have continued to outscore Detroit and will almost certainly finish the season with more runs scored. It seemed as if you and Darkside simply wanted to insist that Detroit has a better offense "because everyone thinks so" or "just because they do." A better argument would be to compare the two home parks of the teams. I might make the same argument in Cabrera's favor as his numbers have almost certainly been held down by playing half his games in a vast ballpark.

You are not remembering that correctly and attributing things DS said to me.

On paper, I expected the Tigers to be better, nothing more. I make no apologies for that.

I dont think the defense is totally insignificant here because you have one guy who is a complete butcher and another guy who is a gold glover

If you win the triple crown and your team is in contention you are the MVP. Those stats and figures are nice, but let's not get crazy with them.

Sure , now you motherfuckers say that, try telling that to the Boston media. Anyone have a heavy blanket I can borrow, Im cold.

I'm pretty sure you flat out said the Tigers had a better offense.

Correct, but I said going forward and in a one game scenario I would take the Tigers. You are painting it like I was denying math. I went to great lengths to frame my opinion.



JORR, Detroit's offense is better. They have better offensive players overall. Regardless of what has happened so far this season.

I think the Tiger offense is a little better (mainly due to Cabrera and Fielder) and I agree with DS that for a one game scenario, Most people would take the Tigers.

In regards to the Triple Crown, Trout's line (.300, 25 HR, 45 SB, 120 R) is more rare. People find the Triple Crown to be sexy, and it is, but it doesn't paint a full picture. It's only part of it, and when you look at the full picture, Trout is significantly better. Defense and base running DOES matter. A lot. If this was "Most Valuable Hitter..."


Trout would still win. His offensive WAR numbers are better too.

Trout is a better player period. I don't care who wins the MVP.

Okay, but for how long must the Sox outscore them for you to reconsider your opinion?

I think most people would take the Tigers for one game because they'd likely have Verlander or Scherzer pitching. Here comes that pesky "run support" argument again.

Stolen bases don't matter very much at all. We can't use SABRmetrics to bash the idea of the running game and then turn on a dime and use it to prop up a player when it suits us, can we?

So, game on the line, man on second, you need a run, you're taking Trout over Cabrera?

I believe you are misrepresenting the SABR take on stolen bases. SABR tells us that you need a 90% clip to make it worth running. Trout is at 92%

you can't pick and choose your situation. lots of other situations you'd rather have trout on the field.

Trout is a better player period. I don't care who wins the MVP.

I used to have a PC computer simulation game called Diamond Mind. The guy who created it was later hired by the Red Sox to run their statistical analysis. Tom Tippett. I think he still works there. Anyway, his simulation model is used in an online game

http://www.imaginesports.com/


I played about 6-7 seasons against some other hardcore baseball fans. It made me change my thoughts about a lot of things, particularly defense, which heretofore (actually thentofore) I undervalued.

Anyway, you can do all this statistical shit and construct what you believe is the best team possible and they still finish in last place.

He has 16 more Runs scored than Cabrera and Cabrera had a month long head start.

Since Trout came up: 122-91

And there are players that have had worse seasons than Cabrera who did win the MVP.

I look at it like this. If I've got a one-run lead with two outs and the bases loaded, I know which of those two I'd prefer to face.

And there are players that have had worse seasons than Cabrera who did win the MVP.

I look at it like this. If I've got a one-run lead with two outs and the bases loaded, I know which of those two I'd prefer to face.