Bonds should definitely get in and Roger probably should too. Sosa should never get it. He would have just been good without roids. Bonds was a HoF player before taking them. He may have hit 100 HR's in his prime if he had taken them.

This is the correct answer.

This is the correct answer.

I would say Rose is different. He broke a rule that is posted in every clubhouse. He knew exactly what he was doing and I truly believe he stiffed his own team at least on some occasions.

The drug thing was cultural. It wasn't even explicitly against the rules of baseball (although it was illegal). It was all wink-wink, nod-nod when Mark and Sammy were "saving" baseball. Then suddenly MLB dumped them in the grease as if Selig and his cronies were naive waifs in no way responsible for all of it.

So if the cheating was done to make a good player great, it's worse than cheating to make a great player one the best ever?

Either the cheating is enough to keep a player out or it's not.

It's not that simple. Bonds was already one of the greatest ever. Most probably considered him the greatest of his generation. He was already a HoF player and was at back 9 of his career. Sosa was wasn't considered a great player and was in his prime when he started taking them. He sucked when he stopped too.

It's not that simple. Bonds was already one of the greatest ever. Most probably considered him the greatest of his generation. He was already a HoF player and was at back 9 of his career. Sosa was wasn't considered a great player and was in his prime when he started taking them. He sucked when he stopped too.

If roids shouldn't keep a player out, then the only thing that should matter is the numbers.

Numbers say Sosa was one of the best hitters ever.

It's not that roids should keep you out. When looking at how a guy performed prior to roids and how he performed while he was on roids you can make a determination from there. Barry and Roger were HoFers before then. Sosa wasn't. Both were still good after they stopped but Sosa looked like Chone Figgins the last couple seasons.

What year does everyone think the "steroid era" started? 1990? 1995?

What year does everyone think the "steroid era" started? 1990? 1995?

these guys are dead to me.

Here's an interesting read:

http://steroids-and-baseball.com/

Interesting read. I might counter with one small observation. Why did Sosa and Mcgwire exhibit huge jumps in power before Bonds if steroids didn't matter? It has long been reported that Bonds was jealous of the attention they got, and so he roided up and caught up. By that article's data, roids do not increase HR's. It was the inflated baseball. Reference:

Sosa 66 HR's in 98
McGwire 70 in 98
Bonds 37 in 98 (note Bonds jumped to 1 HR in 10 at bats the 2 subsequent years and then hit 73 in 2001 or over 1 in 10 at bats)

JORR, then their power should have jumped in 1995. How about the guy from Philly that just got caught with PEDs, Ruiz, or the guys from San Fran, Melky? Funny how their great numbers coincide with getting caught with drugs.

I just don't buy that PEDs have no material impact.