In theory, I would give a damn. But I've seen his play & his grit and all like that. I don't have questions about his ability.

As opposed to, say, Cade McNown who we should have spotted sooner, or what became good/bad Rex.

Or on a positive note, NeckBeard.

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Middle Aged Crazy, like Uncle Terry

Agreed. Is he the #1 backup? I liked what I saw, so I'd say yes.

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Middle Aged Crazy, like Uncle Terry

The most popular athlete in Chicago is always the backup QB for the Bears.

They could have Peyton Manning and ME as their backup and people would call the Score and say I should start. I am pretty grindy.

And yes there have been Score callers wanting Hanie. I dont even want him as backup. I'd prefer an experienced backup.

Ironically the top backup option out there is Orton.

I do agree with those that say Orton doesn't lose that Super Bowl. We don't make it with him as the starter esp. in the Seattle game. Can't lose a game you don't play in (although I'm sure the Cubs would find a way)

Ironically Orton has played better than Cutler for much of the two years since the trade. Actually, that's not ironic at all. It does depress the fuck out of me though, especially as someone who 1.) wanted the trade, and 2.) did not go to Purdue.

The Orton bashers can't just rest on "Orton is better." See all the holes on the roster? Remember all those draft picks you gave up? And no, you can't look at the picks Denver made, for the same reason that if I buy a bag of horse crap from you for $1,000 and you burn the money I didn't get the better of the deal.

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Fire Phil Emery

Too many people hovering ..... too many eyes looking .....

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

Either you are a liar or the product they are putting out is vastly over-rated.

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She's got $$

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You never miss your wealth, till your well went dry
Seem like only yesterday, you were here smiling
Now you gone away, but I know you in a better place
No traces of you, what can I do?
Alone and confused

Whose?

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

No

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Daddy's

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You never miss your wealth, till your well went dry
Seem like only yesterday, you were here smiling
Now you gone away, but I know you in a better place
No traces of you, what can I do?
Alone and confused

It's completely irrelevant to me; I gave up that ghost a long time ago for the most part - that is to say, to give a damn about the person/entertainer ... the end product is what matters.

Also, hypothetical personae aside, at this point there's no way someone's going to convince me that the fate of this team rests solely or even mostly on the play - in a vacuum, mind you - of Jay Cutler. At most he's #3 on the question chart (behind the OLine and their overall defensive play).

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

You would be wrong. Jay is #1 with a bullet. If he is as inconsistent as he has been for 2 years the Bears will suck. This defense isn't getting younger and no one can expect this team to be as healthy as they were last season. Cutler is the most important player.

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B-Rick, what would you say if I told you I like Cutler because of his snarky personality? What does that do to your theory?

Irish, are you seriously postulating that Orton has outplayed Cutler the last two years, all things being equal? Are you saying that if Cutler remained in Denver, and if Orton stayed here, that would still be the case?

I wonder if the situations were reversed, where Cutler "outplayed" Orton last year, to a 4-12 record with the Bears, while Orton played in the AFC title game... you and B-Rick would be equally as insufferable about this, but for the exact opposite reason.

I don't think it's completely crazy that someone with more yards, a (slightly) better completion percentage, more yards, more yards per pass, and half as many interceptions (in more pass attemps) has outperformed the other player. The records are a nonsense argument because Denver's defense absolutely sucks.

Are there extenuating circumstances for Cutler? Yes, but not that many. Denver's running game has sucked pretty hard. Orton had a pro bowl receiver last year, but when that pro bowler is Brandon Lloyd, there's quite a bit of chicken-and-egg involved. And while Orton won't have as many flashy performances, he also won't throw four interceptions to D'Angelo Hall in a single game.

Even if you are as charitable as possible to Cutler, there isn't two first round picks worth of difference between the two. If the case would have been different, I'd be on here saying "I told you so" because I was fully in support of the trade. But Cutler simply hasn't been good enough. To make this trade worthwhile, he'd have to perform at a Top 5 QB level, and he has been--*at the very best*--borderline Top 10. He still has the tools to perform at that level, I guess, but the clock is ticking.

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Fire Phil Emery

I don't know if you can overlook the extenuating circumstances quite this much. McDaniels was running a ball control offense (the very reason he wanted an Orton type), which padded his numbers. The Denver defense was actually one of the best in the league for a good part of 2009.

And Cutler's O-line was not just bad.. and it wasn't just the worst in football... don't forget, they allowed the most sacks in the league, while Cutler is among the top QB's in the league as far as mobility. If he had average to below average mobility, you could theoretically have seen 100+ sacks. This isn't just your average "bad" o-line. It's historically bad. I think you have to greatly discount Cutler's lack of stats based on this. And, it's not just the o-line that couldn't block for him - neither could his TE's, his WR's, or his RB's. And the receiving corps may well have been the worst in football last year - name another duo on any other team, that you would rather have Hester and Knox over them. Name them.

Cutler had the 2nd highest rated offense in football in 2008 before the trade. Denver has regressed considerably since then, while the Bears offense at least has treaded water, while the o-line and WR corps degraded around Cutler.

I think the stats as well as the W/L in this case are highly misleading, and I would make this trade again, and again, and again. I wouldn't be a dumbass in surrounding my franchise QB with piss-poor talent, however.

I don't think Cutler is a dick, so he is not. I do wish he would be a better leader, take the team on his shoulders, and win.

Cutler's INT's in his 1st season with the Bears are inexcusable. I don't give a shit if he is tossing the ball to 12 year olds. He was a nightmare in season 1 & combine that with his "jerkface",not a good combo.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

Not so fast, my friend .... you're trying to tell me that, for your entertainment dollar, you wouldn't enjoy seeing that substitution?

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

Helps prove it. After all, you are admitting you do care about his personality.
Let me point out that while Cutler played in the NFC title game, he was brutal in it and was outplayed by the Bears third string QB who spent the whole week pretending to be Aaron Rodgers and probably got about 1% of the actual snaps in practice.

If Cutler were lighting it up I'd have no problem admitting it unlike most people on here who are unwilling to admit that all the Orton bashing is stupid carryovers from his rookie year when he was thrown in well before he was ready. "He can't throw it over 10 yards!", "He is only good because of Brandon Marshall!", "Grossman is better!". All of those things have been proven false, and now people have to find new excuses like you have.

I think Cutler was good last year. He was as expected against a Seahawks team that didn't even deserve to be there, and he was terrible against Green Bay before he got injured. Orton was good last year on a bad team and was benched in favor of a first round draft pick that he's supposedly dominating in camp right now to the point that Denver was weary of trading him and instead Miami had to settle for Matt Moore and Chad Henne. I think Orton could have done as well in the playoffs, and he would have likely had Jeremy Maclin to throw to who is better than Llyod and the Bears would have another first round pick to upgrade a position.

I think it's time to face it that two years in that Cutler and Orton are roughly the same. Cutler may have more "raw talent" but he's performed about the same. Keep in mind that Orton's dominant receiver last year was cut by the Bears in favor of keeping Rashied Davis and the other guys are all roughly similar to what the Bears have. Yes, the line may have been better in Denver but Cutler is supposed to be "mobile" and the defense was significantly worse.

At this point, Orton and Cutler are both in the 10 to 15 range in terms of QB rankings. Maybe the supposed superior talent of Cutler will distance him this year and you can bump this post but right now the difference between them isn't that big.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Does anyone really give a poop about Kristin Cavallari's personality?

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

You can stop saying this. It's not true.
In 2010, Orton's stats in November:
286 yards a game, 8 touchdowns, 1 interception in 3 games. That doesn't include for obvious reasons a game on the last day of October where he went for 370 yards, 1 td, 1 int by the way.

Now, December was terrible for two games but your bad joke included November.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

if orton had cutler's arm...

Only sometimes.....

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This. No one should give a poop about Cutler's personality because it's just a way to distract ourselves while he continues to be mediocre on the field.

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The Bulls haven't done anything wrong, and they're not going to do anything wrong.

That's a trick question .... she doesn't have one.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

But she's got boobs.

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I don't find Cutler unlikable, yeah he is going to give short answers to the media and his body language sometimes gives off the impression like he doesn't care, but to me its a lot of nothing. I save my dislike for players like Roethesliberger, now that guy is a turd.

When Cutler first came to the Bears, the narrative was that Cutler wasn't a winner, never won in college or the NFL. Of course this leaves out the fact that 1) when has Vanderbilt ever won anything and 2) one of his Broncos teams was 8-8, even though the defense gave up around 440 points that year, the most ever by a team that finished .500 or better.

Cutler had a terrible year the first year, no doubt about that. I think he made some serious strides last year, and hopefully with the same coordinator for the second year in a row, and maybe an improved OL and receivers, he can continue to grow.

Cutler also has not had the same advantages of guys like Rodgers or Manning, who have had the same offensive coaches for their entire career and better offensive talent around him (especially compared to the Bears).

Not one bit.

Did you ever read Paper Lion?

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So, short answers are okay for Urlacher but not Jay .... got it.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George