It is currently Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:17 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 38 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 1:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 2:35 pm
Posts: 82231
Requiring the new GM to have approval from lovie.

We are on the third generation of Halas/McClaskeys. Couldn't they identify one golden child from each generation and have that guy learn something about management from outside the organization?

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 2:52 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:35 pm
Posts: 4896
Location: Division 1 Cook County Jail
pizza_Place: NEW YORK STYLE PEPPERONI FROM LOMBARDI'S IN MANHATTAN.
good dolphin wrote:
Requiring the new GM to have approval from lovie.

We are on the third generation of Halas/McClaskeys. Couldn't they identify one golden child from each generation and have that guy learn something about management from outside the organization?

There is a reason to admire Rocky Wirtz and Tom Ricketts.

_________________
There goes one over the fence..Tru Link Fence..Beauty, Privacy Security....Call Tru Link.
Murph's Union 76 Truck Stop....A great Thanksgiving Tradition!!!!

WOO LIFE!!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 6:54 pm 
Offline
1000 CLUB
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:55 pm
Posts: 29461
pizza_Place: Zaffiro's
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?

_________________
Antonio Gramsci wrote:
The crisis consists precisely in the fact that the old is dying and the new cannot be born; in this interregnum a great variety of morbid symptoms appear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 7:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 2:47 pm
Posts: 13380
Location: The far western part of south east North Dakota
pizza_Place: Boboli
Tall Midget wrote:
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?


No need for odds. It's gonna happen. Then the euphoria that Bears fans felt after the Angelo firing will effectively be cancelled out.

_________________
Juice's Lecture Notes wrote:
I smell a bit....


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 7:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 8:05 am
Posts: 16
I fear that they name Lovie GM. The man has the power in that organization.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:13 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 4:54 am
Posts: 22704
pizza_Place: A few...
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/fo ... 5292.story


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 4:11 pm
Posts: 57239
goose13 wrote:
I fear that they name Lovie GM. The man has the power in that organization.


I would rather have them name Lovie the GM than give it to Ruskell

_________________
"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."


Frank Coztansa wrote:
I have MANY years of experience in trying to appreciate steaming piles of dogshit.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm
Posts: 40983
Location: Chicago
pizza_Place: Lou Malanati's
RFDC wrote:
goose13 wrote:
I fear that they name Lovie GM. The man has the power in that organization.


I would rather have them name Lovie the GM than give it to Ruskell


Agree then after ext year you can bring in a whole new regime, who will trade Cutler for 2 first round picks and rebuild.

Anyone that defends the Bears in this fucked up power structure has no clue.

I understand the Bears never said Lovie will have approval rights, but do you think for anyway in hell Phillips will hire a guy that Lovie says he doesnt want.

Go hire some scouts to work with Ruskall for the next year. Essentially you are buying their info, if they will come here? Let Lovie make the Picks with Ruskall.

If something comes out of it, in the way of draft picks contributing or even really good signings, then he can have the job. If they suck. Good bye....everyone....Break it all down.

_________________
"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 6:46 pm
Posts: 33815
pizza_Place: Gioacchino's
Killer V wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?


No need for odds. It's gonna happen. Then the euphoria that Bears fans felt after the Angelo firing will effectively be cancelled out.


I think so too. It's going to be their only option like Martz was for OC. Too bad...Lovie is such a good coach and nobody wants to work with Cutler.

This team needs to be sold.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 3:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 9:33 pm
Posts: 16484
Location: Chicago, Illinois
pizza_Place: Salernos, Oak Park
Tall Midget wrote:
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?


I have said this numerous times here since the day Angelo was fired. Quality football guys don't want to work for the Bears, which is why they have had to settle for their 2nd or 3rd choice for head coach & coordinator positions. Also, for some reason, the Bears are afraid to go out & hire a football guy with a great resume.
I wont be surprised if the Bears call a press conference to announce Tim Ruskell as the new GM, after an "exhaustive" search. Yea, right.

_________________
CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan


Last edited by Scorehead on Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:31 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
Tall Midget wrote:
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?




i think it is almost a guarantee that ruskell gets the job

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:37 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
Aggravated Sox Fan Bob wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Requiring the new GM to have approval from lovie.

We are on the third generation of Halas/McClaskeys. Couldn't they identify one golden child from each generation and have that guy learn something about management from outside the organization?

There is a reason to admire Rocky Wirtz and Tom Ricketts.




wirtz yes..ricketts no....wirtz came in and cleaned house while ricketts let hendry and wilken continue to fuck things up.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 4:54 am
Posts: 22704
pizza_Place: A few...
Scorehead wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
I have said this numerous times here since the day Angelo was fired. Quality football guys don't want to work for the Bears, which is why they have had to settle for their 2nd or 3rd choice for head coach & coordinator positions. Also, for some reason, the Bears are afraid to go out & hire a football with a great resume.
I wont be surprised if the Bears call a press conference to announce Tim Ruskell as the new GM, after an "exhaustive" search. Yea, right.
bigfan wrote:
Agree then after ext year you can bring in a whole new regime, who will trade Cutler for 2 first round picks and rebuild.

Anyone that defends the Bears in this fucked up power structure has no clue.

I understand the Bears never said Lovie will have approval rights, but do you think for anyway in hell Phillips will hire a guy that Lovie says he doesnt want.

Go hire some scouts to work with Ruskall for the next year. Essentially you are buying their info, if they will come here? Let Lovie make the Picks with Ruskall.

If something comes out of it, in the way of draft picks contributing or even really good signings, then he can have the job. If they suck. Good bye....everyone....Break it all down.


Agree with both these postings.

I was never a big "The Bears need new owners" guy but if they give it to Ruskell then yes, the Bears need new owners. This is a chance to change the football culture and the fans attitude towards the Mcidiots and they're probably going to blow it.

If they can't see that Phillips is the wrong guy to be making football decisions, then they are in the wrong business.

Now the big question: If the Bears give the job to Ruskell and the Bears go out and shit the bed, will the fans stop going to games? That is really the only way the McCaskeys are going to wake up. I can't remember the last time the Bears had attendance problems.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:14 am 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2006 6:08 am
Posts: 7184
Location: Section 433
pizza_Place: 1. Homemade 2. Jewels
McClaskeys will never sell in our lifetimes so there is no sense debating that point.

I am ok w/ the team president not being a "football guy" as long as he had the brains and skills to build a proper football organization with the right people running it which so far Teddy has not proven he can do.

While Angelo needed to go there should have been some idea on who his replacement would be before pulling the trigger. Angelo's faults are not new so they have had plenty of time to develop a succession plan. Or as others stated perhaps Ruskell is the succession plan?

While I am not a Lovie-hater no incoming GM should be hamstrung by a requirement to keep anyone, be it the Head Coach down to the guy who checks security at the driveway to halas hall.

As for attendance worries, ain't gonna happen. Most of SF is controlled by season tickets these days and the wait list is 20 years long with each person on the list having already plunked down $100 per seat to get on the list.

_________________
"I honestly don't see a good bet on the board here."


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:19 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 9:46 pm
Posts: 450
Location: Western Illinois
pizza_Place: Gioacchinos
Ciminos
Glad to see Ruskell comes with the "deer in the headlights" look already :lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 12:46 pm 
Offline
1000 CLUB
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:55 pm
Posts: 29461
pizza_Place: Zaffiro's
I suspect that the Bears will not hire Ruskell. Unfortunately, however, there is a good chance the guy they do hire will be worse than Ruskell.

My understanding is that many within the McCaskey family would like to sell the team. Virginia has prevented the sale from taking place.

_________________
Antonio Gramsci wrote:
The crisis consists precisely in the fact that the old is dying and the new cannot be born; in this interregnum a great variety of morbid symptoms appear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:01 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625
Its not gonna be Ruskell. I mean if they wanted that they could have forced the retirement of Angelo and made it like he was willing the job to Ruskell.

I believe they WANT something new. They want to at least appear to be making changes.


My guess is they promote some guy from another organizations player personell dept who isn't ready. Someone who will be greatful for the undeserved oppurtunity.


Lovie being GM would be worse case scenario, but thought they ruled that out at the press conference



A LOT of damage can be done in one year by a GM. Set ya back years.




The talent gap in the division will widen before it shrinks


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:29 am
Posts: 8116
Location: South Elgin
pizza_Place: Ian's Pizza
IMO, Ruskell is an option but everything is pointing to them getting somebody from outside the organization.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:29 pm 
Offline
1000 CLUB
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:55 pm
Posts: 29461
pizza_Place: Zaffiro's
rogers park bryan wrote:
Its not gonna be Ruskell. I mean if they wanted that they could have forced the retirement of Angelo and made it like he was willing the job to Ruskell.

I believe they WANT something new. They want to at least appear to be making changes.



It is a mistake to assume that the Bears won't hire Ruskell because they haven't done so already.

A couple years ago everyone was sure that Marinelli wouldn't be promoted to defensive coordinator because the Bears were conducting an external search to fill their opening. After they failed with their initial top choices, Marinelli became the defensive coordinator. Something similar can happen hear.

The problem is that Phillips, like Lovie, is not a visionary--his passivity allows circumstance to define his managerial strategy when his managerial strategy should instead attempt to redefine the circumstances in which the team operates.

_________________
Antonio Gramsci wrote:
The crisis consists precisely in the fact that the old is dying and the new cannot be born; in this interregnum a great variety of morbid symptoms appear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 9:33 pm
Posts: 16484
Location: Chicago, Illinois
pizza_Place: Salernos, Oak Park
Bucky Chris wrote:
IMO, Ruskell is an option but everything is pointing to them getting somebody from outside the organization.


But is sure is quiet with the Bears right now. I cant find any news about who the Bears might be interested in, besides Sneed in Atlanta. Decosta would have been a great hire. If the Bears would have let him make the decision on Lovie, I think he takes the job, then maybe those of you who are fans of Brian Billick might also have been happy too when he replaced Lovie,

_________________
CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:57 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
Tim Ruskell is Bears’ in-house candidate for GM job
By Sean Jensen sjensen@suntimes.com January 9, 2012 10:44PM
Reprints
1


Bears interim general manager Tim Ruskell was brought in by recently ousted GM Jerry Angelo in 2010. | AP
TIM RUSKELL’S HIGHS AND LOWS WITH THE SEAHAWKS

HIGHS

• Selected USC linebacker Lofa Tatupu in the second round of the 2005 NFL draft. He would be selected to three consecutive Pro Bowls.

• Traded a high second-round pick in the 2009 draft to the Broncos for what would become the 14th overall pick in the 2010 draft. The Seahawks selected safety Earl Thomas.

• Traded safety Michael Boulware to the Texans for defensive end Jason Babin. But Babin only played four games in two seasons because of Mike Holmgren’s issues with Ruskell. Babin has since become a two-time Pro Bowl selection.

• Max Unger, a second-round pick in 2009, has developed into one of the league’s better centers.

• Signed receiver Joe Jurevicius, who scored 10 touchdowns in his first season.

LOWS

• Traded a first-round pick to the Patriots for Super Bowl MVP Deion Branch, then awarded the receiver a contract that included $13 million in guarantees. Branch scored four touchdowns in his first three seasons.

• Instead of a franchise tag, he put a transition tag on All-Pro guard Steve Hutchinson. The Vikings drafted a contract the Seahawks couldn’t match and signed the future Hall of Famer away.

• Gave MVP Shaun Alexander a contract that included $13 million in guarantees. But he never topped 1,000 rushing yards after that.

• Hired Jim Mora Jr. as coach before Holmgren was officially ousted.

• Selected linebacker Aaron Curry, who had only 5½ sacks, with the fourth overall pick in 2009.

Updated: January 10, 2012 2:14AM

As Bears president Ted Phillips consults trusted advisers throughout the league, player personnel director Tim Ruskell quietly serves as the interim general manager.

He’d like to remove the interim tag and replace Jerry Angelo on a permanent basis.

The thought might not sit well with some in the Bears’ fan base given Ruskell’s friendship and history with Angelo, who hired him in April 2010.

But five league sources familiar with Ruskell and the Seattle Sea-hawks insist that he’s his own man, and he wouldn’t be Angelo 2.0. He’s respected for his player evaluation, leadership and character, a quality that became apparent when he didn’t feel the need to defend himself from critics or explain his side of the awkward clash for power in Seattle with Mike Holmgren.

A veteran of more than two decades in the NFL, Ruskell mostly has worked for winners, starting at Tampa Bay with a scouting department assembled by Rich McKay — now president of the Atlanta Falcons — that turned the Buccaneers from laughingstocks to Super Bowl champions.

Ruskell was at the center of that rebuilding as the Bucs’ college scouting director. After Angelo was named Bears general manager in 2001, Ruskell replaced him as director of player personnel.

He won a Super Bowl ring with the Bucs in that capacity after the 2002 season.

When McKay headed to the Falcons, he hired Ruskell as his assistant general manager, and they turned a 5-11 team into the NFC South champion, drafting players such as cornerback DeAngelo Hall, quarterback Matt Schaub, wide receiver Michael Jenkins and linebacker Demorrio Williams.

He was then hired as president of football operations and general manager of the Seahawks before the 2005 season.

Owner Paul Allen — the co-founder of Microsoft — created a less-than-ideal working environment for his football staff. Mike Holmgren, who led the Green Bay Packers to two Super Bowls, including a victory, was hired as the Seahawks’ executive vice president/general manager and coach in 1998. He had full authority on all personnel decisions.

But he was stripped of that power the year before Ruskell was brought onboard.

Two sources said Ruskell immediately cleaned up the organization, parting ways with character-challenged players such as wide receiver Koren Robinson.

In 2005, the Seahawks drafted two linebackers who quickly upgraded a defense that had ranked 26th in yards. Leroy Hill, a third-round selection, contributed 7½ sacks, and middle linebacker Lofa Tatupu headed to the Pro Bowl as a rookie. They also signed veteran receiver Joe Jurevicius, who had a career-high 10 touchdowns that season.

The Seahawks were seventh in points allowed, and the offense ranked second in the NFL.

Seattle, 9-7 in 2004, went 13-3, won the NFC West and reached Super Bowl XL, where it was defeated by the Pittsburgh Steelers.

The high, though, was temporary.

The Seahawks were adversely affected by two decisions the following offseason. First, they rewarded running back Shaun Alexander — the reigning MVP — with an eight-year contract that included $15 million in guarantees. Second, they put a transition tag on perennial All-Pro guard Steve Hutchinson, and the Minnesota Vikings used the infamous “poison pill” to ensure the Seahawks couldn’t match their lucrative contract offer.

The Seahawks, though, claimed the NFC West in 2006 and 2007, and they at least reached the divisional playoff round both times.

By 2007, tension between Holm-gren and Ruskell came to a head, and defensive end Jason Babin was one of the players caught in the middle, Babin said last month.

Ruskell shipped safety Michael Boulware to the Houston Texans and acquired Babin, a 2004 first-round pick.

Babin couldn’t get out of Holm-gren’s doghouse and appeared in only four games in two seasons with the Seahawks. In 2010 and ’11 , Babin was picked for the Pro Bowl and totaled 30½ sacks.

Phillips isn’t believed to have any front-runners for the GM vacancy, whether in-house or out of house. But he’ll investigate and interview some of the young, up-and-coming personnel executives projected to be NFL general managers.

But of the current options, Ruskell is one of the few who already has been in that seat with a track record that can be discussed and analyzed.

During his interview, Ruskell has to explain how he has learned from his mistakes and why he’ll do better than the friend who hired him.

If his arguments are convincing, then Phillips ultimately might remove the interim tag from his title.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:17 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
:lol: @ those "highs"..how can jensen even write that with a straight face

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:25 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625
312player wrote:
:lol: @ those "highs"..how can jensen even write that with a straight face

Which ones dont you like? I thought they were all decent moves...just way too few of them


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
i could make a list of angelo's "highs" that trump that...he is no better than angelo and maybe worse..i think this guy is the front runner.part of me wants him to get the job and fail miserably so a new team pres and g.m. are brought in to clean this mess up.

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:10 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625
312player wrote:
i could make a list of angelo's "highs" that trump that...he is no better than angelo and maybe worse..i think this guy is the front runner.part of me wants him to get the job and fail miserably so a new team pres and g.m. are brought in to clean this mess up.

Oh ok. I thought you were saying those moves werent good.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:13 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 27591
pizza_Place: nick n vito's
is lofa tatupu even in the league anymore?...very similar to tommie harris

_________________
The Original Kid Cairo wrote:
Laurence Holmes is a fucking weirdo, a nerd in denial, and a wannabe. Not a very good radio host either.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:39 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 2:35 pm
Posts: 82231
Lofa was hurt last year. The Bears brought him in for a visit but I don't think he passed the physical.

_________________
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:17 am
Posts: 72380
Location: Palatine
pizza_Place: Lou Malnatis
When signing Joe Jurevicious is considered a highlight on a GM's resume it might be a good idea to look elsewhere.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 11:44 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 10:08 am
Posts: 14018
Location: Underneath the Grace of Timothy Richard Tebow
pizza_Place: ------
FavreFan wrote:
When signing Joe Jurevicious is considered a highlight on a GM's resume it might be a good idea to look elsewhere.

BIGBO

_________________
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
rpb is wrong. Phil McCracken is useful.

Chus wrote:
RPB is right. You suck. :lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 2:02 pm
Posts: 1
Location: Chicago, IL
pizza_Place: pizza_Place
Killer V wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
What are the odds the Bears will end up appointing Ruskell as the new GM?


No need for odds. It's gonna happen. Then the euphoria that Bears fans felt after the Angelo firing will effectively be cancelled out.


Completely agreed! Are fan base will be so frustrated

_________________
Chicago Sports News


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 38 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: a retard and 21 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group