Explain it. How did the vignettes tie into Jericho's returning character?

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On the title switching hands all the time, this could be where they get hurt with their Brand Extension. Smackdown your set, turning Byran heel, good guy Sheamus wins the RUmble and go on to win the title at Mania.

On the Raw side, your stuck, like I put before, does Jericho win the title in the Chamber, then Punk win a month later. One of the reasons I have Jericho winning, is to have a heel Champ at Mania, can make it more intresting when the good guy is the challenger and wins the belt, then having a heel pretty much cheat.

If they made Sheamus pick and pretty much agreed the Smackdown side, then he gets the winner of their Elimination Chamber match, then you could take Punk out of the Raw side and the winner there faces Punk for the belt at Mania.

Let's face it, Punk or Jericho getting pinned and somebody's foot could be on the rope for the match to end, because that could be the way to sell a rematch.

At Mania, they will have to sell the match between Punk-Jericho and we have already seen them lose the ppv before.

Did I miss Stephanie coming out on Raw last week?

What it'll be chalked up to now is "The vignettes were more of Jericho trolling the fans." Which is a shitty way to treat your fans.

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So the end of the world was almost winning the Rumble. Got it.



Insert clever retort and emoticon here.

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It's probably my fault for expecting too much.

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You are becoming the schmitty of the wrestling section.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

+1. The match will be good but they clearly had no idea how they were going to get there. The vignettes were pointless and Stef is not coming back.

I'm not convinced they should have given Punk the title at Survivor Series. I understand if Edge had to win at Mania last year, but in my world ADR would have gone Mania to Mania as champ and lost it to someone this year. Have a face champ on one brand and a heel on the other, both with extended runs to give the title some credibility again. I have no idea if punk is a face or a heel or even a tweener. Bryan is supposed to be a heel i think, but the heel announcer rips him the entire time. things seem to fall into place a little easier when they pay attention to the small details like continuity and clearly defined characters. i would love to see some Russo swerves once in a while. The problem is you can't turn guys if you don't know whose side they are on to begin with. I have NO idea how Sheamus went from heel to face..? Did they just book him against heels on Smackdown? I don't remember an angle. D/X are faces, but they give stretcher jobs to midgets. Punk is a face, but he's the biggest bully on the roster.

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+ infinity

Its like you two are in my head - get out! Pass me a beer on your way though.

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Thank God we are not living in your world then. Del Rio on top for a year would be as exciting as watching paint dry.

And weren't you another one not too long ago saying Punk should have an extended run with the title, but now he should not have won it at SS?

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

That's fine.

I'll continue to look critically at something I enjoy. You can do otherwise.

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If I said Punk should have the title for a year I believe you 100%, but I have no recollection of that whatsoever. I'd be interested to see what a 9-12 month title reign would do for any good heel, especially ADR. He had all the tools, gimmick, manager, etc. I'm looking at the title reign list for the wwe title (raw) and since Trips lost the title in April 2008 after 210 days, no one has held the title for even 100 days except for the Miz, who had it for 160 days, mainly as a prop for Mania in 2011. Prior to that, rko for 203 days and Juan Cena for 380 days and he only lost it when vacated due to injury.

My point is, they've done it, can do it, but haven't done it in awhile. There's definitely several other factors as well, but it seems like ratings and buy rates were better back then. Since Vince doesn't seem to take Smackdown seriously (see natalya fart jokes), they might as well try it over there. Have ADR defend the title for 3 months, then really build him up vs all comers for another 6 months, then feud with one guy with a big chase for another 3 months to lead into Mania. Whoever beats him should be pretty hot after that. I would like to see them try some continuity for once.

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This entire post is brutally incorrect. First, if you look back from about July on, I've been trying to get everyone to let the entire angle to play out. I've asked we don't criticize one week of a three month angle. Speeps tells me I'm wrong and it isn't going everywhere. The problem is there is no three month angle. They are trying to act like it, but they decide every week on the day of RAW or the PPV. That has made me wrong, simply because I'm hoping for something that is non-existent. Keeping Score is wrong again. Speeps and I definitely can both be that stupid. Just not in this case.

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Granted I am not a big ADR fan, so I don't think it would go very well. But even if they went that direction, I have no doubt that some of you would be bitching about it a few weeks into the deal. They wouldn't set it up right. They wouldn't carry it out right. This whole Jericho thing has been a perfect example of it. People have been clamoring for his return for months and they finally get what they want and it isn't right.

I really wish Vince would let a few of you do the booking for a couple years so we would be guaranteed the greatest time in wrestling since the Attitude Era.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Believe me it has kept me up at nights wondering where I have went wrong to actually agree with you.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Reading this is like trying to follow how the actual return has been bad. If you know you aren't going to change the world at Rumble, you don't say I'm going to change the world. Also, it doesn't make him look strong. It made him into another guy on the top of the roster. Not a special returning superstar, heading into a match with your hottest existing guy at WM.

I understand your point about Jericho "not deserving" to win. They shouldn't have him in there at all if that's how they feel. It did give Sheamus a rub, and I think I'm one of the only guys that's acknowledged the growing response he's been getting over the last three months.

If Jericho had no alternative but to interrupt in a match, it means he wasn't big enough to get to Punk earlier. He's having to try new things every week to finally get to the champion. It sounds like a face going after a heel.

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You know what we would have?

Continuity. Something that is sorely lacking from the "creative" team today.

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I'd be fine with the last part. The Jericho thing is a perfect example of what people complain about. THEY built this up. I didn't go to a Connecticut school and start filming kids in a school. I didn't have him use a very original way to piss people off by being silent. I didn't waste all of that, have no real plan, and make Jericho go out and try to explain it.

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BS.

You guys flip flop more than Romney. One day it is Punk needs to have an extended run. The next it is why the fuck does Punk have the title? One day it is Jericho and Punk needs to happen at Mania. The next it is this whole Punk and Jericho thing is fucked up.

Next thing you know you got Drop In dressed up like the Shockmaster tripping over himself coming through the wall.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

Summer of Punk. I kept saying things like "you'll have to tune in next week to see what happens." Suggesting people not take week to week so seriously, allow it to go somewhere. The problem is it doesn't go anywhere. I was using a traditional way of thinking.

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When I actually picture this in my head, it's about the funniest thing i've ever seen in my life.

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Maybe some people flip flop as much as the writing team. I'm sorry for blowing your mind. What?

Also, as soon as you say you guys, you are combining the thoughts of everyone that perhaps feels creative could be better. Of course it seems like a flip flop.

That helmet would definitely fall off. I'm not Spanky. Take that wrestling section hatter.

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I agree catering to Internet fans is worse than what they are currently doing. In retrospect, it started to become obvious they were taking it nowhere by August. Don't get me wrong, from the promo to MITB was outstanding. My point in using this example is I'm not always bitching about stuff. I'm often the guy on here saying give it a chance. Technically, I still am with the Jericho return. But it's impossible to argue Jericho's return has made sense. I wasn't kidding when I thought you were messing with me, just blindly saying "I told you this would all come together."

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RFDC and KS are exactly the fans Vince caters to now. Don't pay attention to anything that may have happened last week. This is what matters now.

Last week: HHH has the power to fire Laurinitis and we build a whole show around it.
This week: The Board of Directors now has the power to fire Laurinitis and HHH blows it with a "whatever".

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Has anyone else ever wondered if they enjoyed wrestling more years ago when they were kids because you just sat back and watched it.

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That's my purse! I don't know you!

I don't remember when it was, but Sheamus came out one week and everyone was cheering. I was so confused. I let it go because he did seem to really be getting over as a face. But to the KS point, book an angle to make him a storyline face.

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Seriously link it here so we can see how "right" you were.

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Absolutely.

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I seriously don't even think Jericho and Punk believe what you're saying.

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Just to prove that Speeps and I always agree.

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I agree 100% with all of it. We would bitch about because they would screw it up. Look at their recent track record and you know they'd screw it up. I can't think of one angle they've done beginning to end successfully in recent years. They were close on a few (punk vs rey) or maybe a couple, but either they screw it up after a hot start or they just drop it instead of fixing it or paying something off. When they did the "who is VKM's illegitimate kid" storyline and Kennedy messed it up and ruined it, they still paid it off with giving you the midget as Vince's kid. Nowadays they'd just drop it and pretend it didn't happen 1 week after.

If people here did the booking, of course it would be better, read the CSFMBWA threads. I can think of 5 angles off the top of my head you can do with ADR without even trying. If you remember threads from 2-3 years ago about booking WrestleMania, we all came up with better stuff than what they did. All of our fantasy/guest booking is better. Really look at what they've done in just the last few weeks (weeks of fart jokes, the kane/cena angle will go into the wrestlecrap hof and that's without Ryder changing the tire, sledgehammers, broken backs), its all crap.

I've been behind Sheamus since day 1. He's awesome, legit total package. Mic skills, size, he can work, main event experience, unique look, worked a lot with Trips/Cena, kids love him, wise ass message board trolls like myself love him, huge international marketability, can make public appearances without being a dick (Fallon, connan, etc), has a good look without a ton of bad tattoos, has a catch saying with Fella, he's young, his body doesn't scream steroids, no history of injuries i'm aware of, seems to work safe in the ring, has the blessing of Trips, you never hear his name negatively in the news (unlike all the Tampa DUI's), what else are they looking for..?

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