i'll take an endless quest over the "fighting pits" debate in DWD any day.

Ding! Ding! Ding!
At least it is not a fight over trade embargoes or tax codes though.
The story line I like the most is Arya's;

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Arya's and Jon's are the most interesting at this point.

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i'm only at the beginning of book 3, but so far through the first 2 and what I've read of 3 the only character I dislike in the whole world is Robb Stark. He sucks and of all the characters in the story he's had the least character development. I feel like I know nothing about the guy and so far he just comes off like an idiot.

And Catelyn annoys me too. Her chapters are too whiny. I wish her dad would fucking die already so I can stop hearing about it.

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Yeah it does drag on.

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Catelyn is terrible but the poor woman has had to suffer some terrible losses. And just when you think you get a reprieve from her bullshit...

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Back off, Warchild. Seriously.

So I'm starting to realize that the author of this series is just a big fat pedophile and I'm 87% sure that's his sole motivation for writing these books, so he can get away with writing kiddie porn in the mainstream.

It seems like every other scene involves some old guy fucking a 14 year old girl, or girl on girl action with a 15 year old, or who knows what else, I'm only in book 3. I'm assuming Tomenon and Ricken double team Mycella in book 4, but don't tell me if I'm right, I don't want to spoil it.

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boy you are slow aren't you?

one of these days you'll see McC.

The first time I saw a picture of the guy I thought to myself, "giant porkish virgin who masturbates incessantly to tentacle anime."

However, I think the reason for the ages in the books is more because of the short life expectancy in the society of Westeros.

Why let the author throw you off? There's not nearly as much fucking/sexuality in the books as there is in the show, IMHO.

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I think it's a combination of appeasing the mouth-breathing eternal virgins as well as HBO's "Show tits because we can" deal.

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cos it's written by a 13 year old boy of course.

http://www.tvfanatic.com/videos/game-of-thrones-skit-on-saturday-night-live/

OK, so on the show they have to cut out some people, no big deal. I guess my issue is that when Osha takes off with Rickon, and Bran takes off with the Reeds, I always assumed that Rickon would pop up again. By Martin allowing them to both go off together I think that might be him admitting he has no idea the direction of the books and Rickon will be just a footnote somewhere in book 7. Even though the kid is the only fully functional living Stark male.

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They technically never even left. They hid in the crypts.

Without the Reeds they all have to stay together and that means that either Martin allowed it because Rickon has no bearing on the future of the story or Martin really has no clue what to do and is just cashing checks while he still can.

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I've said it before and I'll say it again, it's clear that Martin has lost his way. He had a plan, and lost it...which is when the books were being cranked out. The first three came out within five years...3000 pages in less than five years is fucking impressive, in the last twelve years he has written two books in the series and they were rambling and not up to the first three. He needs an editor or someone to bounce ideas off of because it is still salvageable and I don't want to see it go the way of, for example, Robert Jordan's last two books he wrote before he died (which were terrible, though the new author who has taken over has actually written the 2 best books of the series).

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I'm OK with the show cutting corners. There is a shitload of material to work with. I'm not going to be OK with them changing whole storylines and neither should Martin. With all the deviations it makes me think he really has no clue what is going to happen.

I'm waiting for Dany to find some mute deaf kid to draw a picture of her sitting on the Iron Throne and BOOM! Story over.

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I haven't gotten passed A Storm of Swords yet but I've read what your saying in many places....which pisses me the fuck off. These 1st 3 books are amazing but it seems he MAY have gotten some writers block or he just doesn't know what to do and where to go and how to finish.

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I is a sad panda.

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And I think that may be the crux of it which, as I said, is scary because the 1st 3 books are awesome. It is taking him longer and longer to pump out the rest of the story, is he just writing now with no arc at all?

I think the new book is being titled "Winds of Winter" and it won't be out for a long, long while.

If that is the case, then unleashing this series now is just stupid. If he doesnt know how he wants it to go then he shouldnt be allowing them to alter the storylines. I think he is stuck beyond belief and someone pitched him this HBO series and he thought "I get to make a pile of cash and I can ignore my true work for a while. The fanboys are happy, I'm rich bitch and with any luck I will be dead before they realize I didnt write a conclusion to my epic story."

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Continued thoughts from the show's changes based on the books (through book 3, at least) SPOILERS BE BELOW!!!!!:









Expediting the Dany story was always going to happen. She spends the better part of two novels walking/sailing all over the place, and ultimately in book two going into the balls-tripping House of the Undying. It takes too long to get her established and they can't develop her character if she's constantly on the move, especially in the restraints of a television show budget. The dragonnapping is simply a plot device that will allow Dany/her dragons to unleash their wrath, but may or may not juxtapose meeting Strong Belwas/Arstan Whitebeard to season 3.

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I marked my post with spoilers very clearly, and the ambiguous rules of where/what to post aren't defined enough to make me care, much less coming from you during this tirade you're on.

Just to follow up, not trying to say "IMU's a douche" or anything - not at all. I've just caught the scent that IMU got harassed for spoilers or something, and people got pissed, so I'm assuming this faux-disciplinary post was part of the aftermath.

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My problem is that it fundamentally changes her character. She goes from a strong queen to a mewling child.

And the dragons aren't just her pets. She considers them her children.

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The majority of Dany's character development in the book involves a ton of internal dialogue that simply can't be translated onto the screen. In the books (through book 3, anyway) she puts on a very different outward appearance than she is within, and the show has to account for all of her doubts and insecurities.

Anyway, I'm of the mind that Dany's growth into the Dany that I perceive at least will happen in season 3. There's only so many times you can show her gritting her teeth and whining more angrily with each progressing syllable. Once the dragons torch the fuck out of the House of the Undying I think we'll see a much stronger Dany.

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Hopefully you're right.

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from what i recall, GRRM originally conceived this series as a trilogy, then expanded it because he saw more opportunities.

but it's clearly bloated, especially with book 5. there's a lot of circling the wagons that i didn't care for. that wasn't writing, that was just typing.

he can still wrap up a nice story with the next 2 novels. but WOW is going to need a lot of action.

Yup He actually conceived it as a trilogy, then extended to four book series, then six...Then book four was broken up to two books so now it's seven...that's what floors me FFC and DWD was originally supposed to be one book but he couldn't cut it down. Really? There might actually be one good book there is he put forth effort and cut out about 1000 pages.

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somewhat reminds me of what chase did with "the sopranos". was conceived as a 4 season show, then it expanded, and there was all kinds of filler...leading up to...the worst pay off in TV series history.

i really hope GRRM doesn't do that to us. he's set up way too much good stuff.

the only example i know of where a show was conceived and executed to its full intent was "babylon 5".

The Office, UK could be added to that list.

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so in the books..nobody steals the dragons?

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