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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:42 pm 
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What state will be next? I'm sure our elected officials are excited.

Governor Walker's Victory Spells Doom For Public Sector Unions

Public sector unions have reached their high water mark. Let the cleanup begin as the red ink recedes.

Despite a last-minute smear campaign accusing Scott Walker of fathering an illegitimate love child, the governor’s recall election victory sends a clear message that should resonate around the nation: The fiscal cancer devouring state budgets has a cure, and he has found it. The costly defeat for the entrenched union interests that tried to oust Walker in retribution for challenging their power was marked by President Obama’s refusal to lend his weight to the campaign for fear of being stained by defeat. We’ll see how well this strategy of opportunistic detachment serves in the fall as Obama reaches out to unions for support.

This fight is not without precedent. Progressive patron saint Franklin Delano Roosevelt—who more than any other president set our country on a course away from the founding principles of limited government—knew that public sector unions would be the death of the social welfare state he worked so hard to create. Hence, he consistently opposed allowing government employees to unionize. Today, Greece sets the example of what happens when public sector unions gain the upper hand.
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In 1959 Wisconsin became the first state to allow collective bargaining by government employees. The projected cost of supporting Baby Boomer union retirees now threatens to bankrupt the state, as it does many others. Scott Walker ran for office promising change. The fiscal medicine he is administering may be bitter, but it looks like it is starting to work. The state budget has been balanced. The unemployment rate has been dropping and is now below the national average. Property taxes are down. Fraudulent sick leave policies—which allowed employees to call in sick and then work the next shift for overtime pay—have been ended. The government has stopped forcibly collecting union dues from workers’ paychecks.

Best of all, the myth that union bosses represent their members’ interests has been exposed as a lie. Now that union dues are voluntary, tens of thousands of union members have stopped paying them. Membership in the Wisconsin chapter of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees union (AFSCME) has dropped by half. Membership in the stat’s American Federation of Teachers (AFT) is down by over a third. Given unions’ influential role in most elections, the national implications of this trend are staggering.

Walker’s message is clear: The key to bringing balance back to public sector labor relations and balance state budgets is to break the iron triangle of closed-shop mandatory unionization, compulsory dues collection, and oversized campaign donations to politicians that promise to do the unions’ bidding. If other governors take his cue and take up the cause, that giant sucking sound you hear will be the air coming out of union bosses’ bloated political action budgets.

The work in Wisconsin is not complete. The controversial law exempted police and firefighters, a political concession to get the legislation passed. Federal courts have zeroed in on this anomaly, striking down certain sections of the law because they do not treat workers equally. This needs to be repaired— by rescinding the exemption for public safety workers. With the recall election behind him, Walker may be sufficiently emboldened to do just that.

The power of private sector unions was long ago broken by many heavily unionized companies going bankrupt. While this was painful for both workers and shareholders, the economy motored on as nimbler non-union competitors picked up the slack. This approach is problematic for the public sector because bankrupt state and local governments cannot be replaced by competitors waiting in the wings. Yes, citizens can always vote with their feet, emptying out cities like Detroit, leaving the blighted wreckage behind. But isn’t Walker’s targeted fiscal retrenchment less painful than scorched-earth abandonment?

Chicago machine candidate Barack Obama rode into office to the tune of Hail to the Chief, promising the unions that backed him the gift of card check elections, ending the secret ballot that shields employees from union intimidation. He may well ride into retirement to the tune of On Wisconsin as the era of closed shop unionism comes to an end.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:50 pm 
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They were only defeated because of the Koch Brothers money and rampant republican vote fraud. Wake up people...

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:59 pm 
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rampant republican vote fraud


There is no such thing.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:06 am 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
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rampant republican vote fraud


There is no such thing.

You must be a shill for Diebold. Only Republicans commit vote fraud. Why do you think they are the ones who are against voter ID laws?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:32 am 
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Regardless of one's politics, how he or she feels about unions or unions for government workers, or Scott Walker himself, the very fact this recall election even took place should be of great concern. A precedent has been set whereby an opposing party can demand a "do-over" based on nothing more than an unfavorable result. It strikes at the very heart of the republic.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:40 am 
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conns7901 wrote:
...Property taxes are down....


This line totally invalidates the entire article.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:46 am 
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The recall of Gray Davis in California was also pretty bad, from that perspective.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:43 am 
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Beebo wrote:
The recall of Gray Davis in California was also pretty bad, from that perspective.


Seeing as that the man that replaced him didn't do all that great of a job....


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:27 pm 
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Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Regardless of one's politics, how he or she feels about unions or unions for government workers, or Scott Walker himself, the very fact this recall election even took place should be of great concern. A precedent has been set whereby an opposing party can demand a "do-over" based on nothing more than an unfavorable result. It strikes at the very heart of the republic.


+1. To me it started with the walk outs in Wisconsin and Indiana. The idea of an entire government shutting down because one party can take their ball and go home is absolutely repugnant. The fact that every single politician that walked out was not bounced in recent elections show how misguided the American voter has become.
Sad.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:30 pm 
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Vincent Antonelli wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Regardless of one's politics, how he or she feels about unions or unions for government workers, or Scott Walker himself, the very fact this recall election even took place should be of great concern. A precedent has been set whereby an opposing party can demand a "do-over" based on nothing more than an unfavorable result. It strikes at the very heart of the republic.


+1. To me it started with the walk outs in Wisconsin and Indiana. The idea of an entire government shutting down because one party can take their ball and go home is absolutely repugnant. The fact that every single politician that walked out was not bounced in recent elections show how misguided the American voter has become.
Sad.

So you're against the fillibuster too?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:32 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Vincent Antonelli wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Regardless of one's politics, how he or she feels about unions or unions for government workers, or Scott Walker himself, the very fact this recall election even took place should be of great concern. A precedent has been set whereby an opposing party can demand a "do-over" based on nothing more than an unfavorable result. It strikes at the very heart of the republic.


+1. To me it started with the walk outs in Wisconsin and Indiana. The idea of an entire government shutting down because one party can take their ball and go home is absolutely repugnant. The fact that every single politician that walked out was not bounced in recent elections show how misguided the American voter has become.
Sad.

So you're against the fillibuster too?


A filibuster is different. These people just took off and fled the state.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:34 pm 
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Hank Scorpio wrote:
A filibuster is different. These people just took off and fled the state.

It's completely the same thing.

People are not moving, but it's bringing government to a screeching halt in exactly the same way.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:35 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Vincent Antonelli wrote:
Joe Orr Road Rod wrote:
Regardless of one's politics, how he or she feels about unions or unions for government workers, or Scott Walker himself, the very fact this recall election even took place should be of great concern. A precedent has been set whereby an opposing party can demand a "do-over" based on nothing more than an unfavorable result. It strikes at the very heart of the republic.


+1. To me it started with the walk outs in Wisconsin and Indiana. The idea of an entire government shutting down because one party can take their ball and go home is absolutely repugnant. The fact that every single politician that walked out was not bounced in recent elections show how misguided the American voter has become.
Sad.

So you're against the fillibuster too?


As usual Hank is right. A fillibuster is different because they are still in the building and following the rules of protocol. Walking out and hiding in a different state is not in the same ballpark.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:51 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Hank Scorpio wrote:
A filibuster is different. These people just took off and fled the state.

It's completely the same thing.

People are not moving, but it's bringing government to a screeching halt in exactly the same way.


That is like saying an amendment to the constitution is the same thing as breaking the rules of the constitution. An amendment is the legal process to change the original document, much like a filibuster is the legal process to attempt to block a law from being passed.

Those politicians ran out of the state while congress was in session, that is against the law. They should have been thrown in jail but Mitch Daniels knew it would have really inflamed the situation.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:54 pm 
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Mr. Reason wrote:
Jaw Breaker wrote:
Quote:
rampant republican vote fraud


There is no such thing.

You must be a shill for Diebold. Only Republicans commit vote fraud. Why do you think they are the ones who are against voter ID laws?


Reason, I hope you're kidding about this. Republicans have been trying to create laws to force people to shows ids to vote. They just passed a sweeping law in FL.


Florida Ground Zero in Fight Over Voter ID Laws


Originally published on Sat June 2, 2012 3:32 pm

As both parties turn to the general election, and the potentially pivotal role of minority voters, battles over voter identification and other new state election laws are intensifying.

Voting rights groups, who say the new laws discriminate against minority voters, won a key victory Thursday with a federal judge's decision to strike down portions of a Florida law that tightened rules for third-party groups that register voters. In his opinion, U.S. District Court Judge Robert L. Hinkle said:

"Together speech and voting are constitutional rights of special significance; they are the rights most protective of all others, joined in this respect by the ability to vindicate one's rights in a federal court. ...[W]hen a plaintiff loses an opportunity to register a voter, the opportunity is gone forever ... And allowing responsible organizations to conduct voter-registration drives — thus making it easier for citizens to register and vote — promotes democracy."

The ruling comes as Florida faces similar challenges to its effort to purge its voter rolls of potential noncitizens. The Justice Department has filed suit to stop the practice, arguing that it violates the 1965 Voting Rights Act, which protects minorities, and the 1993 National Voter Registration Act, which governs voter purges.

The Tampa Bay Times reported that Florida officials are considering fighting the lawsuit:

"We are firmly committed to doing the right thing and preventing ineligible voters from being able to cast a ballot," said Chris Cate, spokesman for Secretary of State Ken Detzner.

Florida also has been criticized for reversing rules that had made it easier for former felons to vote.

Since 2008, controversial changes to state election laws have spread across the nation to restrict voter registration drives, scale back early voting periods or stop people from registering to vote on Election Day. Before the changes, all three practices were credited with helping to increase the young and minority voter turnout in 2008 that elected President Obama.

Young and minority voters are expected to again be key in this year's election. That's why Obama's re-election campaign recently launched an effort to educate voters about the new requirements.

The campaign's new website, www.gottavote.org, helps voters register, lays out legal changes in all the states, and asks lawyers to volunteer their expertise in election law.

The effort is designed mainly to address the roughly 31 states that now have laws requiring voters to present identification at the polls. About 15 of the states have adopted the strictest rules, requiring people to show state-issued photo IDs.

The voter ID and other laws are the result of a push mostly by Republicans who say they want to prevent election fraud. Democrats and voting rights activists argue that they are unnecessary because voter fraud is rare — often citing the findings of a federal panel.

Opponents also say the laws are part of a Republican strategy to suppress turnout among eligible voters — particularly the young, the poor and African-Americans — who tend to favor Democratic candidates.

The Brennan Center for Justice at New York University, which opposes the laws, says as many as 5 million voters could be turned away at the polls. About 18 percent of seniors and 25 percent of African-Americans don't have state-issued photo identification, according to the center.

The Brennan Center, which represented plaintiffs in the Florida lawsuit, found the laws have passed primarily in presidential battleground states. The voter ID states hold 171 electoral votes, or 63 percent of the 270 votes needed to win the presidency.

Voter ID advocates cite numerous polls showing strong support among both Democrats and Republicans. A Rasmussen Reports survey in April found that 73 percent of respondents believe the ID requirement isn't discriminatory.

Supporters also say voter ID laws aren't intended to discourage voters, but to protect the authenticity of their ballots. In Virginia, after Gov. Bob McDonnell signed a new voter ID bill recently, he issued an executive order directing the state to send new registration cards to every active voter.

The move by McDonnell, a Republican, is unusual among voter ID states and is widely seen as an effort to blunt accusations that the state is trying to suppress voter turnout. McDonnell wrote in his executive order:

"All eligible voters regardless of income, race, age, and other factors should be able to have equal access to the electoral process and should be made aware of any changes that may impact their ability to vote."

At the center of many of these legal challenges is Attorney General Eric Holder. His Justice Department has gone to court to overturn numerous state laws and blocked implementation of voter ID laws in states such as South Carolina. In each case, the Justice Department has argued that the laws would disenfranchise minority voters.

On Wednesday, Holder told a gathering of the Congressional Black Caucus that "both overt and subtle forms of discrimination remain all too common and have not yet been relegated to the pages of history."

Holder continued:

"If a state passes a new voting law and meets its burden of showing that the law is not discriminatory, we will follow the law and will approve that change. ... When a jurisdiction fails to meet its burden in proving that a voting change will not have a racially discriminatory effect, we will object, as we have in 15 different cases."

Critics complain that Holder is taking an unabashedly, and unethically, political stance against voter ID laws. They say that, as the nation's top law enforcement officer, Holder instead should be enforcing these laws, particularly since the Supreme Court upheld Indiana's voter ID measure in 2008.

That ruling found that requiring voters to produce identification is not unconstitutional, and that states have a "valid interest" in improving election procedures and deterring fraud. Supporters believe the decision should have settled the controversy.

On Friday, The Wall Street Journal's conservative editorial board accused Holder, who is African-American, of trying to "inflame racial antagonism":

"The United States of America has a black President whose chief law enforcement officer, Attorney General Eric Holder, is also black. They have a lot of political power. So how are they using it? Well, one way is to assert to black audiences that voter ID laws are really attempts to disenfranchise black Americans. And liberals think Donald Trump's birther fantasies are offensive?"

"... The two most powerful men in America are black, two of the last three Secretaries of State were black, numerous corporate CEOs and other executives are black, and minorities of many races now win statewide elections in states that belonged to the Confederacy, but the AG implies that Jim Crow is on the cusp of a comeback."

The editorial says Holder's strategy is to scare minorities into seeing voter ID laws as a threat, hopefully energizing them to turn out for Obama in large numbers in November.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:56 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
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You must be a shill for Diebold. Only Republicans commit vote fraud. Why do you think they are the ones who are against voter ID laws?


Reason, I hope you're kidding about this. Republicans have been trying to create laws to force people to shows ids to vote.

He was kidding.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:59 pm 
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Yeah, I figured.....but read it a couple times and wasn't sure. I thought it was pretty obvious that repubs are trying to tighten the rolls and dems are worried about eligible voters being disenfranchised. Both are reasonable concerns given our country's history.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:59 pm 
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FWIW Indiana has a pretty good voter ID law. You have to show it when you vote but You get free IDs at the BMV if you are 18 or older and dont have a DL. You just have to show the proper documentation, Birth certificate, ss card, etc. There is really no excuse not to have one.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:00 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Yeah, I figured.....but read it a couple times and wasn't sure. I thought it was pretty obvious that repubs are trying to tighten the rolls and dems are worried about eligible voters being disenfranchised. Both are reasonable concerns given our country's history.

I agree with the idea of needing an ID to cast a ballot, but when the state charges you money to get an ID, wouldn't that be considered a poll tax? That's really my only issue with this.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:09 pm 
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Yeap agree. I want every eligible person to vote. The best thing about yesterday's election was the turnout. It is great when people take part in the process.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:12 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
Yeap agree. I want every eligible person to vote. The best thing about yesterday's election was the turnout. It is great when people take part in the process.

Yes. Its great when people get together and waste a bunch of time, money, and resources to unsuccessfully try and undo their previous vote because....the state is short on time, money, and resources.


Well done, Wisco!


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:14 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
denisdman wrote:
Yeah, I figured.....but read it a couple times and wasn't sure. I thought it was pretty obvious that repubs are trying to tighten the rolls and dems are worried about eligible voters being disenfranchised. Both are reasonable concerns given our country's history.

I agree with the idea of needing an ID to cast a ballot, but when the state charges you money to get an ID, wouldn't that be considered a poll tax? That's really my only issue with this.


See my post above. That is how IN got around the 'poll tax' issue.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:15 pm 
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That aside, there was an election and people took part. The recall thing is allowed under the law, and 900k folks signed up to make it happen. It is silly to do, but that is the state of partisan politics in this country.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:16 pm 
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Hank Scorpio wrote:
Douchebag wrote:
denisdman wrote:
Yeah, I figured.....but read it a couple times and wasn't sure. I thought it was pretty obvious that repubs are trying to tighten the rolls and dems are worried about eligible voters being disenfranchised. Both are reasonable concerns given our country's history.

I agree with the idea of needing an ID to cast a ballot, but when the state charges you money to get an ID, wouldn't that be considered a poll tax? That's really my only issue with this.


See my post above. That is how IN got around the 'poll tax' issue.

That's a great idea, but I don't see states like IL or other places giving away free IDs anytime soon.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:18 pm 
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Hank Scorpio wrote:
FWIW Indiana has a pretty good voter ID law. You have to show it when you vote but You get free IDs at the BMV if you are 18 or older and dont have a DL. You just have to show the proper documentation, Birth certificate, ss card, etc. There is really no excuse not to have one.


Why this isn't the national model is far, far beyond me.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:19 pm 
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Well they cant all be bastions of freedom like the good State of Indiana.

Image

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:21 pm 
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They had that as law here, and the federal judges overruled it. They were Democrats, stating that people may not have transportation to get there to get the free I.D. That was unbelievable.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:23 pm 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
They had that as law here, and the federal judges overruled it. They were Democrats, stating that people may not have transportation to get there to get the free I.D. That was unbelievable.

How do they get to the polls then? :scratch:

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:27 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
They had that as law here, and the federal judges overruled it. They were Democrats, stating that people may not have transportation to get there to get the free I.D. That was unbelievable.

How do they get to the polls then? :scratch:

That is the same question thousands of people were asking here.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:28 pm 
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Douchebag wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
They had that as law here, and the federal judges overruled it. They were Democrats, stating that people may not have transportation to get there to get the free I.D. That was unbelievable.

How do they get to the polls then? :scratch:


:lol: :lol: They are picked up in the big buses and handed the slate to vote for obviously.

They even keep the BMV open from 6-6 (the Election hours in IN) just to ensure that everyone can come in if they were turned away at the polls

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