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 Post subject: The great Scott baker!
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:50 am 
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Yes, I am ok with signing a starting pitcher for $5 m, but just as I ripped on the cocky south side gm, I would say TheoJedJason get no major credit if the guy pans out. They are rolling the dice on a injured player and if it works, great, doesn't take any super baseball jeanus too shop in the bargain section and try and get a steal, because most times it doesn't work out.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:40 pm 
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The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:03 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.


He rejected Minnesota because they insisted on the option. I would have like that as well, but I'll settle and take IMU's option.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:17 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.

They didn't sign Baker to have Baker for the long-term.

They signed Baker to obtain young prospects to have for the long-term.

He is Paul Maholm 2013.


Paul Maholm had a team option

This is more like the Dempster reclaimation.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:20 am 
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Drop In wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.


He rejected Minnesota because they insisted on the option. I would have like that as well, but I'll settle and take IMU's option.


That's Hendryesque negotiating. It's not like they just absolutely had to have the great Scott Baker.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:49 am 
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Coming off a 100+ loss season and sign a guy coming off an arm replacement.

All part of the grand plan I suppose!

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:10 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
immessedup17 wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.

They didn't sign Baker to have Baker for the long-term.

They signed Baker to obtain young prospects to have for the long-term.

He is Paul Maholm 2013.


Paul Maholm had a team option

This is more like the Dempster reclaimation.

No.

Ryan Dempster was 26 when they signed him.

Scott Baker is 31.

Long term made sense for Dempster. It does not for Baker. He would be 33 by the time the Cubs are in any sort of competition.


Two years isn't long term. A team option isn't long term. All the team option does is compensate the team should the guy break out after the team invested seed money in his reclamation.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:17 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Drop In wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
The O fucked up by not getting a team option for a second year. He gets healthy on your dime and then has no obligation to the club.


He rejected Minnesota because they insisted on the option. I would have like that as well, but I'll settle and take IMU's option.


That's Hendryesque negotiating. It's not like they just absolutely had to have the great Scott Baker.


He has a no-trade?!?!

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:19 am 
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If Baker pitches well this year, the Cubs are going to trade him at the deadline anyways. THEY DON'T WANT HIM LONG TERM. If he doesn't pitch well, they won't resign him anyways. The only reason they signed him was the possibility of him being valuable to another team at the deadline and at the same time provide the Cubs with some competitiveness during the season.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:41 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Two years isn't long term. A team option isn't long term. All the team option does is compensate the team should the guy break out after the team invested seed money in his reclamation.

But it is already known that he was going to sign a contract with a team option on it. So...why are you arguing that? Sure, it would have been nice. It also would have been nice to sign him for $2M rather than $5.5M. And I'd like for Starlin to have signed a 15 year - $75M contract last year.


My original post states my point pretty clearly. This wasn't a particularly well considered/negotiated signing by the infalliable management team.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:43 am 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
If Baker pitches well this year, the Cubs are going to trade him at the deadline anyways. THEY DON'T WANT HIM LONG TERM. If he doesn't pitch well, they won't resign him anyways. The only reason they signed him was the possibility of him being valuable to another team at the deadline and at the same time provide the Cubs with some competitiveness during the season.


AGAIN, a team option is not long term. It is a one year contract unless the team picks up the option. The team option also makes him more valuable on the trade market.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:46 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
If Baker pitches well this year, the Cubs are going to trade him at the deadline anyways. THEY DON'T WANT HIM LONG TERM. If he doesn't pitch well, they won't resign him anyways. The only reason they signed him was the possibility of him being valuable to another team at the deadline and at the same time provide the Cubs with some competitiveness during the season.


AGAIN, a team option is not long term. It is a one year contract unless the team picks up the option. The team option also makes him more valuable on the trade market.


You act like the Cubs are negotiating with themselves. The guy doesn't have to sign any old contract thrown in front of him. He clearly did not want a contract with any team that had a team option in it. So what are you going to do? Pout about it?


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:48 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
FACT: Hahn makes the same deal and you are ecstatic.
:lol: :lol: Jealousy. Sox have at least 4, possibly 5 starters better than Baker.


immessedup17 wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
If Baker pitches well this year, the Cubs are going to trade him at the deadline anyways. THEY DON'T WANT HIM LONG TERM. If he doesn't pitch well, they won't resign him anyways. The only reason they signed him was the possibility of him being valuable to another team at the deadline and at the same time provide the Cubs with some competitiveness during the season.
Image
So they sign the guy just to try and move him? Then you get the same scrub-like guys pitching after the AS break like you had last year. I guess Theo's plan is to lose 95+ games again this year, and you all seem to be ok with that.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:52 am 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
If Baker pitches well this year, the Cubs are going to trade him at the deadline anyways. THEY DON'T WANT HIM LONG TERM. If he doesn't pitch well, they won't resign him anyways. The only reason they signed him was the possibility of him being valuable to another team at the deadline and at the same time provide the Cubs with some competitiveness during the season.


AGAIN, a team option is not long term. It is a one year contract unless the team picks up the option. The team option also makes him more valuable on the trade market.


You act like the Cubs are negotiating with themselves. The guy doesn't have to sign any old contract thrown in front of him. He clearly did not want a contract with any team that had a team option in it. So what are you going to do? Pout about it?


Do what the Twins chose to do and sign one of the dozens of other Scott Baker types out there instead. You have said he is a fungible item to next year's team, well treat him like it.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:53 am 
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I would say that going from 103 losses one season to 85 losses the following season is a fairly marked improvement. Which is exactly why that even though both clubs fell short of the ultimate goal, the 2007 Cubs and the 2008 White Sox were very successful seasons.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:26 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
There is value to be placed in 1) recognizing which gambles are better to take and 2) selling a player on your organization and future or dollars, whether they are hurt or not.

I'm sure Scott Baker got the same, or similar offers, from several teams. There is something to be said for him coming here.


Really, thats how gambling works? You try to find the wager you think will work out the way you want? OK, now I got it.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 12:18 am 
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Scott Baker is this years Paul Maholm which means he'll help them to a last place finish and they'll flip him for more damaged goods. 2016 here we come.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 12:22 am 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
Coming off a 100+ loss season and sign a guy coming off an arm replacement.



Image???

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:57 am 
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Of all the injuries to be coming off of, this one (Tommy John surgery to repair it) has the most predictable results. Baker may well be more effective that he has ever been, with increased velocity on his fastball. Yes, he is only a rental, who will VERY likely be traded before the deadline. But until the team is ready to contend, this is the perfect kind of player to sign. Low salary, with good potential to prove himself worthy of a good prospect in return for his services at the deadline. The team is surely not done, as they need 1, probably 2 more starters to fill out the rotation. They need to have some depth in the event an injury occurs in spring training. Thats what they did last season, when Volstad and Wells were sent to the minors after competing for jobs in the rotation and I expect they will operate similarly this year as well. Dempster and/ or Marcum would be nice additions. Gotta be on deals of only 1-2 years though.

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