Huh? Even for you, that's tangential thinking.

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I never heard that Michael was told to defer. Was that in a book? Who said that?

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

I still think MJ did that to create some space for himself.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

Remember, Jordan scored 63 against the Celtics and LOST.
I believe he felt it made the stronger to distribute the ball to others for scoring opportunities.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

I also love this utterly unchallenged assumption that LeBron is this big, goofy kid who just wants to have fun. Putting aside the insultingly infantalizing racial coding of it, LeBron has spent a significant portion of his adult life constructing monuments to his own vainglory. But hey, he clowned around with Craig Sager's kid, so there's that. Maybe athletes are only assholes when Chicago fans root for them.

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The Bulls haven't done anything wrong, and they're not going to do anything wrong.

B&B love when racists expose themselves. Paul Dean, Mel Gibson and countless others.

I think their joy over these "gotcha" episodes is really them celebrating how they have kept their racism from being exposed while being public figures.

I suggest also reading "When Nothing Else Matters".
My lone contention is that Jordan was an a-hole, but that fierce competitive nature is what made him the best-ever basketball player.
I do agree that Van Gundy is hardly objective with his criticism. I just think there are more than a few circumstances where Jordan was a jerk to teammates or others.
Walter Payton wasn't a saint either -- I still don't believe it takes away in either case what they did on the field of play.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

This is in no way surprising. The primary function of Miami sports media is public relations. If you're looking for a good laugh, check out Armando Salguero sometime.

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The Bulls haven't done anything wrong, and they're not going to do anything wrong.

Trolling, again. I'd also go to twitter with these thoughts -- works for Bernsie.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

This is precisely what these two idiots are omitting from their sermons on LeBron. There was all kinds of disturbing stories, mostly around 2010, about LeBron and the ways in which he held the Cavs hostage to his own whims. All the stuff about forcing the team to give access to his entourage, changing practice times based on his party schedule, having his assistants respond to the questions of reporters/photographers even when he was standing right next to them, all of this stuff undercuts the image about LBJ being a fun loving guy who only made one or two mistakes, as they said today.

Now, this doesn't make James a horrible human being or whatever, I mean we're not talking about criminal activity or anything. But in failing to present the totality of his character, they are being less than honest.

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Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

It isn't exactly Back of the Yards either.

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I believe LeBron is an amazing athlete -- but that's not going to make me filter out his negative attributes.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

B&B always decry the image, the facade, the narratives, the legend, the protection that was "constructed" for Jordan. They hate the protectors, the ALS and such.....

Yet they are doing pretty much the exact same thing with and for LeBron.

No there isn't. It's just that Chicago fans aren't willing to change their thoughts because Lebron won. Much of the rest of the country that hated Lebron seemed to give up on it because he won a title.

If you hated Lebron in 2010, why not hate him now?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Where do you hear all this hate and vitriol from Chicago fans? A couple listeners who call into B&B who were handpicked to be mocked and destroyed? I haven't been listening so I don't know, but I've seen from the comments during the games on for instance Yahoo, the hate for Lebron is national. And I haven't been able to isolate any of it to a particular city.

I think the people on this board can't stand him simply because Dan and his cronies hype him up all the time. If they hyped up anyone to this degree, I think people would be sick of that person too.

Well, it was more than flirting. Many thought the Bulls had a good chance of landing him or Wade. After they declared intent to sign with Miami and celebrated in everyone's face, even cities that had no chance of signing one of them turned against the Heat and especially James. I doubt the fans here have a problem with James and the Heat if they were a bit more modest about everything. If you replace the Heat with the Spurs, and imagine Duncan leaving a city to join the Spurs, there's no chance in hell we're booing Duncan and Parker on every possession, or tuning in to Spurs vs Generic Team X only to root against them.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY

Pretty much how it went.

Larry: Dan and Teary, I really, really, really enjoyed the part of the show where you sucked off Lebron James and ripped the hell out of MJ. It was really, really great.

Terry: Ya know Laurence, at my age, I don't remember what I said a minute ago. So I'll take your word that it was good.

Larry: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. You're sooooooooooooooooo funny, Teary. I love you, Uncle Teary. I really, really, really do.

Dan: Dude.

Larry: What?

Dan: Nothing.

The bottom line is that Jordan never deferred. Yes he would drive and kick out to Pax or Kerr for those shots or BJ whatever. The defer thing is that Lebron sits back and wants to let others make things happen. There is a difference between what he does and Jordan decoying on some plays.

Make no mistake when the time is to be a killer and the job needs to be done MJ and Kobe will take it up your ass and make you like it. I am still not convinced James will always have that killer mentality.

That said he won another championship so what?

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Elections have consequences.

So what? People like the underdog. Always have. Always will.

If they took a poll like that during the Bulls title runs, Illinois would be the only blue state. Bulls were hated too. Maybe the percentage would be a little lower, but America was rooting for the Bulls opponents in the finals.

Same if you took that poll for the Yankees title runs.

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The whole deference angle deals with LeBron not coming through in the clutch. hoping someone else would make a shot because he didn't have the stones to do it himself. I call that finding an open teammate -- but it was just another tool for James' haters to pounce on.
This theory is plain false. Doesn't mean he's better than Jordan mind you, it's just that LeBron has the ability to make clutch shots.
It's a no-win situation for King James. Shoot too much = ball hog, selfish player; pass the ball to teammates = no sack, not heart to step up.
Jordan lovers have nothing to worry about. LeBron might be one of the best-ever -- but he certainly hasn't done enough to belong at the top.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

I disagree. I think it's completely rational and warranted. Lebron is often compared to Jordan, which gives Chicago fans an obvious angle, but even more than that, Lebron came off as a huge douche during The Decision. Personally, I enjoy rooting against him. If it weren't for Lebron, I wouldn't have a rooting interest in the NBA Finals. I would watch, but I wouldn't enjoy it as much.

Let me ask you this question... and it isn't aimed at you in particular, KS, but... why do so many people get upset when others dislike a particular team or person or radio announcer? I'm genuinely curious. Disdain drives ratings more than admiration, so it's good for business. Does it make you uncomfortable? I just don't get it.

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Jordan being the favorite player f like 80% of fans in that generation tells me you're wrong

I'm sure there was a lot of hate but it wasn't like the Yankees, ND etc

And certainly not 49-1


Anyway Buster's point was thst the hate is not a Chicago thing

Jordan was more loved by America than Lebron. But that doesn't mean America wanted to see the Bulls win. They still wanted the underdog. It's like Jeter. I think most of American sports fan like him but wanted to see the Yankees to lose the World Series in the late 90s. That's not a perfect example cuz Jeter is no where near the level of MJ or LBJ. Nor did he have as much influence on his team winning as a basketball star does.

But I think it would have been 60-40 Americans against the Bulls winning in their finals trips. Especially after they won their 2nd in a row. For MJs first title, most of America was rooting for the Bulls. Especially cuz it was against Magic's Lakers. He had won 5 at that point and people were sick of the Lakers always winning.

jordan just wanted it more. lebron expects to win, and is only now starting to get a feeling what its like to try as if your life depends on it. i dont think lebron will ever play at full potential every game for a season, whereas jordan played as if every minute was his life.

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the world will always the world. your entire existence is defined by your response.

It's just a tough comparison at this point. Jordan's career is over, Kobe is almost done, while LeBron might be halfway (?) through his career. When it comes to titles, they could be pretty close together. Hard to say. Styles? Totally different. In the end, all three are very unique in their talents.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

As usual, the straw man B & B present is wrong. They are trying to tie together likeability/talent/career accomplishments when they are all separate things. With the "greatest ever" arguments, I would personally break it down into three categories:

First, do you like the player?

This has nothing to do with how good they are at - in this case - basketball. They are two completely different arguments. People who hate on Lebron or root against him aren't necessarily saying he's not great or not as great as Jordan. They're just saying they don't like him. I am in this category. He is great at basketball, he is physically amazing, but I think he's a douche and is very immature. Therefore, I don't like him.

After likeability, I still think "greatness" can be broken down into two categories:

First, how good at basketball was the person at the peak of their powers (at any one moment in time)?

This would be like comparing a 28 or 29 year old Lebron to a 28 or 29 year old MJ. They are presumably at the peak of their powers at this time. So, the question becomes, which one would you want on your team if you could freeze them at this age? With the MJ/Lebron debate, I think this one is pretty close, and I don't know who I'd pick.

And lastly, how great was the player's entire career?

To me, this is clearly Michael currently, but it could change. When the "greatest ever" is evaluated, it tends to turn into this hybrid of greatness at a given time and greatness as a body of work, which I think is impossible to compare. You have to break them each out.

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I'd add change in rules and quality of competition, although that's difficult to determine. Players in the '70s competed against less teams than players in the '80s, and players in the '80s competed against less teams than those in the '90s, and so on. I'd love to see some contraction so the quality of the average team increases substantially, but I know that won't happen. It's just fun to think of how the landscape may change if players like Cousins, Gay, Ellis, Jennings, Evans, Eric Gordon, Anthony Davis, etc. were redistributed throughout the league via a draft.

_________________
Successful calls:

Kyrie Irving will never win anything as a team's alpha: check
T.rubisky is a bust: check
Ben Simmons is a liability: check
The Fields Cult is dumb: double check

2013 CSFMB ROY