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2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

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Bucky Chris

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:39 am

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Scorehead wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Well, here's my thought. And maybe I'm old-fashioned.

But, the best QB, by far, that we've had in the last 2-1/2 to 3 decades was a guy that lost his job to the deadly combo of Andre Ware and Rodney Peete. And, depending on your opinion of the punky QB, that might have been the best QB in like 7 decades.

So, please forgive me if I'm hesitant to think we can just find some guy to replace a QB that just set the franchise yard record in about 4 years. Tons of dudes. Shouldn't be a problem.

I guess I'm the only one with a memory.

But Ken, the league has changed. The old days of drafting a QB & having him be the understudy on the bench for a few years are over. Guys are drafted & play right away. I never ever would have trusted Lovie & Tice to draft a QB & coach him up to start right away, but you give an offensive guru like Trestman Arron Murray, Derek Carr, or maybe even Jimmy Garoppolo, & they will put up numbers similar to Cutlers. Teams that settle for mediocrity & who are afraid to improve don't win anything.

I think people are significantly overplaying the "league has changed" narrative. Yes a lot of QBs are drafted and play, but a lot of them suck. And aren't going to have a long starting career in the NFL.

The bottom line that is still the same... it's VERY difficult to find a QB that can be your starter for a long time. Just because they are starting, doesn't mean they are good enough to stay starting.

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Jaw Breaker

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:47 am

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With a good o-line, elite receivers, above-average RB, a quarterback whisperer coach, and league rules that almost guarantee success in the passing game, Cutler put up another sub-90 ratings year (89.2) to continue his history of NEVER surpassing 90. He went 0-2 against two horrible defenses with the season on the line. And he is clearly injury prone. Rewarding him with a multiyear deal would be negligent, but that's how the Bears operate. They are afraid that Marshall will pout without Jay, so they will cave.

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Bucky Chris

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:00 am

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:29 am
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Jaw Breaker wrote:

They are afraid that Marshall will pout without Jay, so they will cave.

You don't know that. I think anyone paying attention realizes that Trestman wants Cutler because he likes Cutler.

O-Line also isn't even that good. Run blocking was probably "ok" but pass pro is graded very very poorly. They actually graded worse overall than last year. Play calling just suited them better.

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Jaw Breaker

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:10 am

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Bucky Chris wrote:

O-Line also isn't even that good. Run blocking was probably "ok" but pass pro is graded very very poorly. They actually graded worse overall than last year. Play calling just suited them better.

Bears QBs were sacked less than most QBs.

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To IkeSouth, bigfan wrote:

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Bucky Chris

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:18 am

Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:29 am
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Jaw Breaker wrote:

Bucky Chris wrote:

O-Line also isn't even that good. Run blocking was probably "ok" but pass pro is graded very very poorly. They actually graded worse overall than last year. Play calling just suited them better.

Bears QBs were sacked less than most QBs.

That doesn't mean they don't give up pressure, hurries, etc. The grading system takes in to account more than sacks.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:18 am

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Bucky Chris wrote:

I think anyone paying attention realizes that Trestman wants Cutler because he likes Cutler.

Yes. That's the irony of the Quarterback Whisperer argument. Your QB Whisperer wants Cutler and you guys don't want to give Cutler to the guy.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:20 am

Scorehead wrote:

you give an offensive guru like Trestman Arron Murray, Derek Carr, or maybe even Jimmy Garoppolo, & they will put up numbers similar to Cutlers.

There's no way you can be anywhere close to certain of that. Aaron Murray might suck to the high heavens and odds are pretty good that he will.

I want to draft a QB but I am not at all confident that the guy would be any good. Odds are against it.

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Bucky Chris

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:25 am

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Scorehead wrote:

you give an offensive guru like Trestman Arron Murray, Derek Carr, or maybe even Jimmy Garoppolo, & they will put up numbers similar to Cutlers.

I'm really uncomfortable with this thought process as well. People assume anyone can plug in because McCown had success. First, it could just be that McCown was in the right place at the right time and had the exact skillset that would work. It also could be that he wouldn't have had the same success in the long term, which is exceedingly possible considering the shitty defenses he played against.

Next, Trestman has had one year. Who's to say teams won't start to "figure out" the offense?

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Urlacher's missing neck

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:28 am

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Scorehead wrote:

you give an offensive guru like Trestman Arron Murray, Derek Carr, or maybe even Jimmy Garoppolo, & they will put up numbers similar to Cutlers.

Derek Carr might as well be called David Klingler. His stupid hand clap snap count mechanic is just about as annoying as it gets.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:34 am

rogers park bryan wrote:

I think that's a terrible way of thinking. You make the best decisiion for the team regardless of the ghosts of management past having trouble with the position.

Also, Cutler is an 85 rtg QB. Always has been. Always will be. Need better than that.

So, a history that clearly demonstrates how difficult it is to find a QB should be ignored in favor of just assuming we can find a guy? That's a terrible way of thinking.

And Cutler had his best season ever at 89.2 in yet another 1st year in an offense where he missed considerable practice time. So he already is better than you portray him. You should be excited.

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jimmypasta

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:37 am

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

rogers park bryan wrote:

Doc,
YOU ARE WRONG! The bad way of thinking is we got this guy and we better stick with him because it was so hard to find him. You can't move forward looking in the rearview mirror.

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Hatchetman

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:38 am

Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 11:19 am
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cutler is coming back so all you dreamers can whistle dixie.

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:38 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

rogers park bryan wrote:

So, a history that clearly demonstrates how difficult it is to find a QB should be ignored in favor of just assuming we can find a guy? That's a terrible way of thinking.

No, youre not talking about it being difficult to find a QB, youre talking about the BEARS not finding one. That is a terrible way of thinking. Past Bears GM's mistakes have ZERO to do with this.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

And Cutler had his best season ever at 89.2 in yet another 1st year in an offense where he missed considerable practice time. So he already is better than you portray him. You should be excited.

84.6 for his career. Yes it will fluctuate about 5 points. Please save the excuses. He's had 8 years. He is what he is.

And what he is = Not good enough.

Raise your expectations. We need a top 10 QB, not a guy who has top 10 tools but never reaches potential.

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jimmypasta

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:40 am

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RPB,
100% correct. Also throw in his career record against GB.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:41 am

jimmypasta wrote:

RPB,
100% correct. Also throw in his career record against GB.

RPB can't do that because we can't learn anything from the past.

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:44 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

jimmypasta wrote:

RPB,
100% correct. Also throw in his career record against GB.

RPB can't do that because we can't learn anything from the past.

You filling in for Rick?

I didnt say that at all. I said that using your teams past failures (that are specific to your team) is a bad way of looking at things.

I agree Qb's are hard to find. The fact that Cutler is the best the Bears have had in a while should not enter into the discussion.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:48 am

rogers park bryan wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

jimmypasta wrote:

RPB,
100% correct. Also throw in his career record against GB.

RPB can't do that because we can't learn anything from the past.

It wasn't just one guy or two guys. It was numerous football people over the years - many that had proven successful at finding talent. Many got the Bears to playoffs and even a Super Bowl and they couldn't "find" a QB.

They weren't unsuccessful because they were on the Bears. They were unsuccessful because it's damn hard to find a good QB.

Your last sentence makes no sense to me. You agree that it's hard to find one. But, the fact that you've found one shouldn't matter?

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:51 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

They weren't unsuccessful because they were on the Bears. They were unsuccessful because it's damn hard to find a good QB.

I disagree. I think they've had a history of mismanagement and never valued the QB position as much as they should have.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

Your last sentence makes no sense to me. You agree that it's hard to find one. But, the fact that you've found one shouldn't matter?

Im saying that Jerry Angelo's inability to find a QB shouldnt factor in the discussion.

You compare Cutler to the current NFL, not the Bears past.

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jimmypasta

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:51 am

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The one they " found" shattered about 2 or 3 Bear QB records and won games. He had a better winning % in starts than Cutler this season.

It's Josh!

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:53 am

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

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jimmypasta

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:55 am

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

Beat GB at GB. Orchestrated 2 drives over 80 yards in doing it,too.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:56 am

jimmypasta wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

Beat GB at GB. Orchestrated 2 drives over 80 yards in doing it,too.

Preachin' to the choir, jimmy.

No need for context for this guy over here.

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jimmypasta

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:58 am

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Sorry.

Maybe Josh in the long term isn't the answer,but I felt he would have been the answer for the rest of this season.

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:00 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

Look, if Cutler was reasonably priced or signed thru another year, that would be one thing.

He's gonna take up way too much money to bring back either way.

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Hatchetman

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:01 am

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Get it through your thick skulls -- he's coming back! Post-game, did that sound like a guy that was not planning on returning?

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:03 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625

Hatchetman wrote:

Get it through your thick skulls -- he's coming back! Post-game, did that sound like a guy that was not planning on returning?

So what?

It hasnt happened yet. Nothing is set in stone.

Jay Cutler and the Chicago Bears likely parting ways
December 29, 2013

Word is that Jay Cutler isn’t likely to return to the Chicago Bears.

A source close to Mark Block, the head of both the Mark Block agency and the Jay Cutler Foundation told The Sports Bank this morning that the Chicago Bears are likely to move in a different direction. This information was brought to my attention today before the home loss to the Green Bay Packers in the regular season finale. The defeat obviously eliminated Cutler and the Chicago Bears from playoff contention.

I
t’s very public knowledge that Bears GM Phil Emery is not a huge fan of Jay Cutler. He’s not Emery’s guy. He didn’t draft, sign or trade for him. That’s not news.
My source said that the team feels Cutler’s five year body of work has been enough of an evaluation period. Jay has had four different offensive coordinators during that five year span. This news does give a somewhat plausible explanation for Cutler’s tone at his weekly press conference this past Thursday. He was perceived by some in the media to be rather terse and clipped with his responses.
Although, one person really enjoyed Cutler’s mannerisms during the presser.
chicago-bears-jay-cutler

I was also told this morning that the organization will likely move to retain Josh McCown and focus on rebuilding the defense in the NFL draft in May. There was no indication that the Bears have any interested in drafting a quarterback in 2014. Sources also said that the Bears are possibly interested in pursuing Matt Schaub.
Pro Football Talk’s Mike Florio outlines the most efficient way that the Houston Texans can escape Schaub’s contract this off-season.
Cutler’s favorite wide receiver, Brandon Marshall said the opposite after the game, telling the media “Jay will be back. You know how I feel about Jay. That’s my quarterback. We’re attached at the hip.”
Stay tuned.

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:04 am

rogers park bryan wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

Look, if Cutler was reasonably priced or signed thru another year, that would be one thing.

He's gonna take up way too much money to bring back either way.

What if Trestman ID'd a guy that he had to have as a QB. How much is too much to spend for Tresty's guy?

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FavreFan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:39 am

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rogers park bryan wrote:

It’s very public knowledge that Bears GM Phil Emery is not a huge fan of Jay Cutler.

Is this a true statement? I don't think that it is.

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rogers park bryan

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:41 am

Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:16 pm
Posts: 81625

FavreFan wrote:

rogers park bryan wrote:

It’s very public knowledge that Bears GM Phil Emery is not a huge fan of Jay Cutler.

Is this a true statement? I don't think that it is.

I dont know.

Im not sure if Yardbarker is a reputable site or what

He's not HIS guy.

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Nas

Post subject: Re: 2013 Bears (And Cutler is probably coming back)

Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:47 pm

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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

rogers park bryan wrote:

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:

OK, fine. Let's just move on with Josh McCown.

I'm not going to argue it.

Look, if Cutler was reasonably priced or signed thru another year, that would be one thing.

He's gonna take up way too much money to bring back either way.

What if Trestman ID'd a guy that he had to have as a QB. How much is too much to spend for Tresty's guy?

I think Cutler's people are banking on this. There is no doubt Trestman loves him or he's a world class bullshitter.

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