Yeah, that's probably why.

It makes me feel better about Sammy also to think that Kerry Wood and Mark Prior probably did PEDs as well.

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You know me like that.

Dr. Ken, you have dared to touch the sacred cow.

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Out of curiosity, where did you expect this to go?

Did you think my 20-year-old suspicion that Frank Thomas had some artificial assistance would somehow disappear based on no additional information?

As you correctly point out, most people seem to agree with you which is why he was voted in. Why does it matter to you that some people have doubts?

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You know me like that.

Frank Thomas Credits Recent Power Surge To Steroids
Baseball • ISSUE 42•39 • Sep 28, 2006

OAKLAND, CA—After two seasons marked by nagging injuries and sub-par home-run totals, Frank Thomas credited his career rejuvenation and rediscovered power stroke "strictly to my weekly cycle of injecting myself with anabolic steroids." "People ask me all the time what's my secret, how have I stayed in such good shape and been so consistent this season, and I tell them the same thing every time: It's the steroids," said Thomas, who has 19 homers and a league-high 62 RBI since the All-Star break. "I give the steroids all the credit. It's not even just the muscle and the power, but the confidence I have when I step up to the plate knowing I have a total competitive advantage. I just wish I knew about this miracle drug earlier in my career." MLB officials later announced that, should Thomas test positive for steroid use in a random drug test before season's end, his punishment would be significantly reduced for being open and honest about it beforehand.

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You know me like that.

Are you asking why I would ever expect you to change your mind on anything?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Yes, in this case. There's isn't anything new here.

I'm willing to reassess things but there's nothing here that earth-shaking that I hadn't considered when I formed the opinion in the first place.

Did you just want me to change my mind because you think that I should?

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You know me like that.

Baseball is seen as an everyman's game whereas football is seen as a freakshow.

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If your point is that you made up your mind while he was at Auburn and you won't change it then I guess I shouldn't have expected anything.

And to think I'm called stubborn.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I'd be happy to change it.

What information did you give me to change it other than you disagree with my thoughts on it?

I didn't realize the definition of being stubborn is "not changing to Boilermaker Rick's point of view".

I'm not asking you to believe that he did PEDs. You asked if someone believed that he did and I generally do.

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You know me like that.

I believe the moon is made of green cheese. Who fucking cares?

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

What if it were made of ribs? Would you eat it then?

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What if you were a hot dog? Would you try to eat yourself?

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i like green cheese, ribs, AND hot dogs. no ketchup though.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I'd slather myself with spicy brown mustard. Hell, I'd be delicious.

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New information? We are talking about things that there is no evidence of occurring in the 80s? Are we supposed to get more information on something we have no information actually occurred?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Do you assume that everyone in baseball is clean until you get documented evidence that they used PEDs?

I wish I looked at things as black and white as you do, Rick.

I guess I'm far too suspicious of things for my own good.

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You know me like that.

Its a simple question, even a baby could answer it! Would you eat the moon if it was made of barbeque spare ribs?

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No. I just think there are valid reasons to think that Frank most likely didn't. You think there are valid reasons to think he most likely did.

I'm just surprised someone can be so confident about it when the rationale is they played a season of college football. I just think my issue is that you give it more than a 50% chance that Frank did steroids. I think it's unfair given the evidence. If you were saying "no one from the era should be considered clean" then I'd understand completely, but then, you run into the whole Greg Maddux thing again.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Frank being in a major college football program in the 80's doesnt help the argument.

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"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

I would not be all that surprised to learn, if it was possible, that he did not. But what are the valid reasons to think that he didn't? Because he said he didn't?

It's all about what you believe. I think that PED use was pretty widespread, certainly in college football, and to a somewhat lesser extent in baseball - becoming much moreso into the 1990s. Because baseball gave me no other recourse, I was forced to draw conclusions on individuals putting up historic numbers and what they looked like in doing it based on the evidence that I had.

It's just an opinion. I'm sorry to disappoint you.

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You know me like that.

I'm not getting these. It's just supposed to be a fun discussion.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It doesn't seem like you are having fun.

You seem very confounded by my point of view.

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You know me like that.

If I had to wager, I would say frank didnt use, especially while playing baseball. However, stills leaves room for franks days as a football.

Going to guess that a majority of his football teammates did.

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"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

Jorr with a good point that not all peds are muscle builders. Did Maddux ever miss a start? Remarkably durable


Rick, your reasons are not any more valid The the Auburn stuff


We already know for a fact players have been pro testing and still using, so that's out

And career arcs and he was always big are not valid either

It was said a million times that users ruined it for everyone in the era.

Not sure why some think Frank or anyone else is immune

So, you think Frank probably used steroids?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

This is a logically coherent train of thought. I agree.

In MY opinion, being of age to have pretty much read every article written about him and interview the guy did while with the Sox, I ask myself, is this guy capable of pulling of this rather intricate ruse? Being at the forefront demanding steroid testing to cover his own steroid use? My conclusion is, no, he is not. He was never calculating, never capable of the simplest of white lies in order to benefit his own career. He was a whiner, complainer, sullen, selfish, would say stupid shit. I remember one time he was complaining about having to carry his own bags at the hotel. A walking PR disaster. So no, I don't think he had the acumen or ability to pull off this big lie.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Of course no one is immune. We don't have to talk in 100% certainties here. We can think someone likely did or likely didn't with the acknowledgement that it's always possible the other side is possible.

I think it's fair to give Frank and Maddux more of a benefit of a doubt than others. That's it.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I can only divide into three classes:
10% of players, I'm positive of
80% I think probably, why not?
10% I think, I sure as hell doubt it, but who knows??

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Rod Beck never went on the DL with pulled fat.

That's a good argument in Frank's favor. Too dumb to do steroids!

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don