Actually I took them to Andys Jazz Club on Hubbard & I sat in on Drums for a few tunes, after dinner at Ruths Chris.

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

Whoa Joe,that hurts! I like Lee Dewyze and the Blues Brothers Bar.

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favrefan said:"Chris Coghlan isn't gonna pay your rent, Jimmy."

2008 Cubs averaged 40,743
2013 Cubs averaged 32,625

What does a bad Cubs team draw in the suburbs after a stadium has been around 5-10 years?

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Well, I think those on the other side of the argument are going to use those numbers to say that Wrigley isn't the draw it once was. Maybe that's the case, but I doubt it. Wrigley is one of the big things helping them maintain 30,000+ a game when they are putting teams on the field that belong in Des Moines. It isn't the tourists that have stopped coming. It's the great fanbase that is waiting for Bryant and Baez.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

You live 2 hours from the city?

And the 40$ thing is slight exaggeration. There are many 20$ lots within a few blocks.

Or you could just park west of Ashland for free and walk off last night's short rib risotto from Cooper's Hawk.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

No, I didn't. I said the Jets and Giants fled East Rutherford for a new stadium right across the street. Point is that they were already in the 'burbs.

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It isn't going to change though. It just isn't. It's just like I'll never become a Giants or Jets fan even if I live here forever. Maybe my kids will but given how easy it is to follow and watch your team from outside the geographic area that is unlikely too. The Cubs built a fan base when it was pretty much the only available option and they aren't going to lose unless somehow it becomes impossible to watch the Cubs and only the White Sox are shown.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Wrong again. The pieces are falling into to place to change it right now. It's cyclical, like everything. If I walked you around Lakeview in 1979 you probably would have said "this is a shithole, it will never change." That wouldn't make you an idiot. That's exactly what most people thought. I'm not even sure George Loukas thought differently. Maybe he just figured he could grab a lot of property cheap and got lucky. Or maybe he was a prescient genius. I don't know. But I do know that taking a time machine back, you could never imagine Lakeview/Lincoln Park would become what they have.

If you look at what's happening demographically with all the building and young families moving into the South Loop and West Loop, the Robert Taylor homes coming down and the eventual building of some type of middle class housing on that property, you can see that there is a base in place for the Sox to move back onto level terms or even move ahead in the coming years.

Now, I don't think a guy like IMU's kid is ever going to be a Sox fan no matter where IMU lives and no matter how cool the White Sox get. And yeah, there are a lot of hardcore fans like that. But there are a lot more like dan bernstein who are just lukewarm. And their kids are going to adopt the team that is closer, the team that is cooler, and/or the team that is the winner. It remains to be seen how it all plays out over the next twenty years, but I think the educated guess would be that the two teams return to near equality with the more popular one simply being the won that is winning a little more at a given time. The way it has been for the majority of the history of the franchises.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

More people live outside of the city limits than in it. It is much easier to get to places in the suburbs than in the city. For every city dweller that would stop going to a suburban stadium, two suburbanites will start going weekly.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Eh, not so sure about that.

I'm sure if you think for about three seconds you will see the fallacy in that statement.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

This would happen with or without the Cubs moving from Wrigley though. It still won't be enough. The Cubs are the dominant team in the city. That won't change unless they move the team full time to Iowa.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

For the most part yes. But a suburban park would force 25K-35K converge via car. That'd be a nightmare.

I think you're mistaken about that. And I usually don't like to act like the wise old guy when talking to younger people, but in this case I'll have to cite experience and things I've seen and lived through that you haven't. At one time DePaul basketball was the dominant team in the city. It was over. A dynasty. They owned Chicago. Then things changed. Coincidentally- or maybe not- they moved to the suburbs.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

Well, any halfway decent plan would still have public transportation and some amount of local housing.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

The world of sports has changed though. I watched every Bears game last year in the middle of Jets/Giants country. I could have watched every Sox game, but obviously didn't. This just wasn't possible before.

The major Cubs advantage was that they were far more available when television started to matter. The Sox would need some sort of major advantage to overcome that. I mean, maybe they go on to win 5 World Series titles in the next 20 years and it could happen but that really is independent. The Cubs may lose out on some tourists by moving out of Wrigley but they probably are going to lose out on them anyways as they build a modern stadium on the skeleton of an old one.

At best, what we would see would be more dual fandoms. In many ways, it's more logical to be a fan of both teams but that is a different discussion.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Rick, he's older and has seen and experienced things you haven't. Case closed. No argument can be made against that power move.

How bout this crazy thought


The cubs are done drawing big numbers with shitty teams no matter where they play

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Yup. What would I know about the reasons people become Sox or Cubs fans?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

This is a real possibility. I have explained in the past my thoughts on no longer having a fan feeder system via WGN/Superstation. Maybe someone has the numbers to verify but I would bet a lot that the bus trips/tourist fans have decreased in last 5 years and will continue.

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Elections have consequences.

Thought about it. Feel even more strongly now.

That is my demographic. I think I know. There are countless times we've considered going and said "fuck it" when it came time to make the decision because of the hassle of driving down there and paying the stupid easy out parking, or meeting up and taking the blue line / 152.

I still go to Wrigley at least 3-4 times a year. That number would easily be double digits if the park were somewhere in the suburbs.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

That is YOU though. YOU do not speak for all Cubs fans. For a lot of people, Wrigley would be a lot harder to get to in Arlington Heights or Schaumburg.

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Are you saying experience doesn't matter? Maybe you should give your job to a twelve year old. Obviously his thoughts are uninformed by history. I'll give you both a fuckin' history lesson if you need it.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

My partners and I have $30,000 in tickets. We ain't buying them in Schaumburg. Are IMU and Scorehead picking up the slack?

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

No, I wasn't saying that at all. Didn't even infer it. I was simply mocking you.

Well, it was dumb. The world isn't simply what you've known in your tiny lifespan.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don

I've got plenty of experience as to why people choose to be Sox or Cub fans. Probably more than you since you are so old and you don't know how things work in modern times.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Okay, Rick. You obviously don't know anything except what's right in front of you.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Matthew, Tulsi, and Don