Not sure that's true. I'm guessing there are more suicides in Winnetka and Highland Park than Streamwood and Englewood.

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Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Agreed...if people don't want to maximize income, that's great. There are better goals in life.

Interesting how the White House and liberal media are spinning the CBO report: the labor force will be reduced by 2.5m people thanks to the "liberating" effect of Obamacare. But you can't make the case for government giving subsidies to increase leisure time and at the same time complain that we have a wealth inequality problem.

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I would expect you to hate the analogy. It forces you to think outside the confines of the current dynamic in which you exist, which you are clearly never comfortable with, no matter the issue.

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Your responses are sad and predictable.

Every post you make doesn't have to include some grand pronouncement about me.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

A great number of billionaires are nothing but lucky, the Sam Zell argument not withstanding.

Billionaires are typically born rich. They can purchase companies and bankrupt them and face no repercussions. They face no repercussions because they have created our current power dynamic. If Sam Zell or Donald Trump or the idiot who wrote "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" bankrupt a company, they are insulated from any loss because they have lawyers and corporations and laws they created.

If you or I "bankrupt" our family or fail to pay our mortgage, we are broke. That's because we don't get to make laws and we weren't born into money that allowed us to make laws. Oh... but maybe we can just work harder and make up the difference.

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I wouldn't if you weren't SO predictable. And I mean that. You are absolutely 100% predictable in every discussion we ever have.

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There we go again.

Does it make you feel better to say things like that?

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Really? I think you are assuming a lot of things here. There is a woman who serves coffee at 7-11 where I live... HARD worker. She will never be financially secure because she works at 7-11 and her skills probably aren't "transferrable." Is she any more likely to make a ton of money than the guy at 7-11 who slacks off?

Anyway, that's not even the argument. As JORR stated, Sam Zell just insulted everyone on this board and in society who isn't a 1%er. And yet, a lot of you stand up for the 1%ers despite your hard work and expertise. Why are you defending Sam Zell?

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A little. It's funny because I think you view the world from the perspective of Ward Cleaver.

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Interesting how you misread/misconstrue the CBO report. And then use that to oddly insert talking points unrelated to this thread.

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

Sounds like you spend a lot of time thinking about me.

I think you view the world by taking down others because your posts lack the content or thought to stand on their own.

Even now, you are basically parroting things JORR has said multiple times. Oh, some billionaires inherited wealth! What an amazing thought! A 7-11 clerk works hard! WOW! I never could have thought of such a thing.

I guess we both have very little respect for how the other person thinks which is cool. I'll survive with you thinking that I'm simply a guy who follows whatever is considered the popular answer and be just fine with it.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

JawB is usually pretty level headed. Id like him to expound on that.

Specifically, were not losing 2.5m jobs. The CBO reports shows a netgain

The argument isn't whether we here at CSFMB are happy and secure and make enough money. It is whether Sam Zell's proclomation that everyone should emulate the 1% and look up to them as heroes...

When did bankrupting companies and laying people off become a virtue in our society? When did cutthroat bullshit perpetrated by spoiled little brats born with silver spoons become something to strive for? Maybe it was always. Maybe I am naive. But if it's not new, I look down on past generations for not calling the "successful ones" earlier.

And my problem (and most people's problems) isn't the fact that billionaires exist and the middle class exists. It's that there are tremendous billionaires in this world and there are also kids who have to sleep without heat or struggle to find meals. If these billionaires aren't tremendous philanthropists, they are akin to terrorists, IMO.

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Do you need a tissue?

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At least you didn't steal more of JORR's material for that one!

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

So are there actually parents here who are teaching their kids that hard work & diligence doesn't matter & that their success will simply be a matter of luck, timing & who they might meet?

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

I don't think he is asking the 99% to treat the 1% as heros. I agree, people like Zell have had to work hard. As I said in a previous post, work doesn't mean actual labor or even work directly related to a task. Working hard includes leadership, philanthropy, building financial and industrial expertise, etc. Most people I work with come to work every day from 9 to 5 and care little about these factors. They just want to do their tasks and get paid for it.

This drives into a key point. Companies going bankrupt and laying people off are not virtues. Businesses of all sizes are competing in a global market like no time before. Many feel little to no ethical responsibility to the people who work for them, nor the people who consume their products. We can argue whether or not this is right, but the reality is that people like Zell need to stay ahead in this ultra-competitive environment, and as a result, need workers to do more than just come to work from 9 to 5 and do their tasks. These problems are not the fault of silver spoons or playboy billionaires. These problems are the result of capitalism's shakeout in a global arena.

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As usual, your comprehension gets in the way.


No one has said hard work doesnt matter. Not one person.


Hard work is not a guarantee of anything, as you've said.

I don't know. JORR does tend to make you look foolish quite often. The philosophy is similar, at least.

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Ok. Now lets tackle abortion, the death penalty, & religion!

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

Once you reach a certain point you forget that there were breaks that fell your way. You just focus on what you did and think you 'made your own luck'. That's an easy way to think when you have been on top for a good portion of your adult life.

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This is a great statement. It's easy to stand on the mountain top and yell down at those at the bottom about hard work. Would Sam Zell confidently go back to his childhood and have faith that he would end up in the same place?

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And sometimes we dont even understand how good we have it. There were periods of my life where I thought I was poor. Then I saw what poor actually is and realized I was middle class.

Of course he would. Guys like that operate on confidence/delusion.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Absolutely true. It also works the other way. I would imagine most people on this board make less than half a mil a year. Proportionally, here is what we all look like on a wealth chart:

Sam Zell
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|<--------Us
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|<--------Poor Lady on food stamps

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Ultimately, this is the lesson Sam Zell was trying to teach all of us in his own special way.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

It's not to say that he didnt work hard to get where he is. I just think the more successful you are the more you forget the help you got getting there, because right now he doesnt need help. He is at the economic scale where he does truly make his own luck. If he needs a law changed he lobbies for it, if he needs a permit he knows a politician to fast track it, if he needs to bankrupt a company he does it.

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You're probably off by a couple of ticks...

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

Sam Zell
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|Dr Ken
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| Where Scorehead tells everybody he is
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|Where Scorehead actually is
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| Where Frank actually is
|<--------Poor Lady on food stamps
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| Where Ikesouth is. No food stamps, No government checks, and I'm out of milk.

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the world will always the world. your entire existence is defined by your response.