I ALREADY SAID ARTAX.

He was more of a turf horse.

I'm not sure if the gender gap really is so much smaller in horses than in humans. Yeah, an exceptional mare can beat colts when she has been pointed to it for a particular race, but if she had to go up against the boys race in and race out they would just wear her down. Even the most brutish mare is going to have trouble racing colts on a consistent basis.

And that's even taking into account the steroids that these race fillies get. Some of them are so masculine it's shocking to see that they lack a cock and balls. I think that's why great race mares are so often less than great as broodmares and their less accomplished sisters are the ones that keep the families going.

Also, with regard to specialty gaits in harness racing, it's quite odd that mares can't really compete on the pace, but they have been able to dominate colts on the trot. I'm not sure anyone really has a good explanation for that, but I would think it has to do with the nature of the trotting gait.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

According to my Father: Sweep @ the Daily Racing Forum for 35 years. Swale. He actually cried when he passed.

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

Well here's hoping that Zenyatta's sister Eblouissante is a hell of a broodmare because her racing career is in the dumps currently.

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Swale was a pretty great horse, but I'm not sure how you could say he was better than Spectacular Bid or even Risen Star or Point Given. He wasn't even considered the best three year old colt in his own barn until after Devil's Bag was retired. But I'll grant you a trainer's opinion on a horse isn't always right and he's generally going to be biased in favor of the horse that cost more and/or has better conformation which is usually the same thing.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

And they run better in the summer heat because "it's in their blood".

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Big Brown was a monster as well with bad feet. He won 7 races in 8 starts with his only loss being the Belmont. Leading up to the Belmont, he has a cracked hoof that they tried to repair and the combination of the foot and having a rough trip caused Desormeaux to pull him up in that race. He ran huge in the Derby, winning from the 20 post and won the Preakness for fun.

His career ended in the fall of the three old campaign after he sustained another foot injury.

His trainer Dutrow was a known doper - having a ton of suspension and fines based on his liberal use of steroids. He is currently suspended 10 years.

Thanks Vince, I knew there was some story to this horse.

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2018
#ExtendLafleur
10 More Wins

HEY HEY!!

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Thunderbolt



Only Don Tiny will understand this

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Was coming to post some variation of that



Check out this gif of SJP turning into a horse

Hey JORR, how about harness?

I always think of Varenne as one of the greats. But he never raced here until he was older. Moni Maker (best filly/mare). She won the Oaks.

Riyadh was one of my favorites as a kid. He could dominate on any length of track and almost won the TC. Think he lost the Jug to Life Sign or Fake Left. He also set the pace during Jenna's Beach Boy's world record.

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Back off, Warchild. Seriously.

Varenne was a killer. I was at the Meadowlands the day he took his record. They started playing that ridiculous theme song and all those Italians were running around waving the Italian flag.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWmTphbRtjM

I loved Riyadh. He could leave like a jet. One of my favorites. He was on the lead in the great Jug won by Life Sign over Presidential Ball.

Fake Left upset Western Hanover. As I was walking out of the grandstand that day, two guys were rushing in and they asked who won the Jug. When my partner said Fake Left, I heard one guy say to the other, "That guy is drunk. He doesn't know what he's talking about. We'll find out inside."

I like Continentalvictory better than Moni Maker. But maybe Ron Gurfein and I are the only ones who do.

If we're talking all-time greats, I'm going with Niatross and Somebeachsomewhere on the pace and Greyhound, Mack Lobell and Nevele Pride on the trot. Maybe Peace Corps too.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Man, I've always had a thing for her. So would...

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"I'm not smiling because I thought what you said was humorous. I'm smiling because one day I know you'll be dead..."

Dearie

31 grand in her career! She kept Terry, the Brightwells, and Brian Carpenter flush with cash.

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/dearie6

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

_________________
I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

Zenyatta/Alyadar ( Nice Vince) Forego/John Henry.Saw Bid at Arlington had a Bid Hold your Tricks exacta ...I think it was $2.60

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

From a sheer speed standpoint, I've never seen anything like CR Kay Suzie. This is just awesome and one of the greatest race calls of all time by Larry Lederman:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJcW-feGuKM

Moni Maker was obviously a great mare. Going to Europe and crushing the best older horses at 2700 meters in the Prix d'Amerique is something else. But she is from the same generation as Continentalvictory. While Moni Maker was beating up on the fillies at three, Continentalvictory was whipping the colts in the Hambletonian and the Yonkers Trot. She likely would have won the Triple Crown if she had been able to race in the Kentucky Futurity. But she had to go three tough heats to beat the boys in 110 degree weather at DuQuoin and she was never the same after that. Also, Act Of Grace is the forgotten mare from that generation. She was awfully good herself and faced the colts in the Hambletonian as well but jumped it off in the final.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0QAZ-DX-vg

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

For me harness is so hard to pick a greatest since 1) I never saw the greats since I started watching it in the 80's and 2) harness was never mainstream and didn't get to see the best until they started simulcasting in the 90's

For me, I remember seeing Life Sign, Presidential Ball, Super Bowl, Beach Towel, Rambling Willie, Moni Maker and No Nukes

You know, I like both thoroughbreds and harness, but in the pre-simulcast days, I could never understand why people would get so much more excited for "B" and "C" type horses racing at Arlington when you had an "A" harness meet all summer long at Sportsman's Park. Sportsman's wasn't the Meadowlands but it was a good second and most of the great horses made their way to Chicago to race in the American-Nationals.

Just in our time there were at least two great horses I can think of that were based in Chicago- Falcon Seelster and Jate Lobell. I don't know if I would call them all-time "best of the best" types, but they were awfully close.

Were you out there on this night?:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inJ3xGoZh4M

Man, I loved Jate Lobell. When I started buying yearlings, I bought a lot of his sons and daughters. About ten or twelve years ago I was down at Southern Oaks in central Florida where we used to train in the winter and I got into a conversation with Myron Bell, the racing manager for Brittany Farms. He said, "What is it with you Midwestern guys and Jate Lobell?" Of course I sang Jate's praises as a stallion. And Myron said to me, "Jate Lobell isn't going to get you to the altar. You need an Artsplace or a Western Hanover for that." And I said, "I don't have deep pockets like you, Myron. I don't need to get to the altar. I'm just trying to get an invitation to the reception." And Myron replied, "Yeah, Jate might get you to the reception, but he might take you to the funeral too."

Anyway, the two best horses I ever owned were Jate Lobells:

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/roaring+good+time

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/i+scoot+hanover

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I was not there that night, but was a BIGFAN of Sportsman Park. We were there religously from about 88 until 92 and then would go back in the summers while in college. They had the best racing around.

I was there the night Keystone Raider was starting in the second tier in the American National Pace against a big chalk Dorun Bluegrass. Paisley pulled the horse behind the favorite after the gates opened and took a two hole trip and nipped him at the end.

Also was at Maywood in 1991 when Precious Bunny who I believe was second in money earned at the time to Beach Towl won the Windy City Pace. He set a track record but would have been even faster if it wasn't muddy.

Don't make me relive that. I bet a bunch on Dorunrun that night. I think he was 3/5. Horrible.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Look at this harness grab ass session we have. I was also there the night Keystone Raider won the AN against Dorunrun Bluegrass! Didn't Dorunrun win the US Pacing that year? Might have been a week or two before. Herve Filion was driving. A bunch of big horses showed up. Topnotcher with Doug Brown was the one my father bet for me. He got creamed. One of the better aged pacers didn't come in. TK's Skipper? I think he won the US Pacing leg at the Big M. Or maybe Yonkers. It used to be three legs back then.

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Back off, Warchild. Seriously.

That was in 1990 I think? I believe TK's Skipper did win the Meadowlands leg for Mike LaChance. I think that was the year I went to Pompano for the Breeder's Crown and Topnotcher was like 1/5 and got beat by a crazy longshot named Bay's Fella.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Yeah 90 or 91. Topnotcher was a good horse. Dominant in the FFA races in Canada (Greenwood/Mohawk). Think he won the Canadian Pacing Derby that year.

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Back off, Warchild. Seriously.

Yeah, he was good. Never one of my favorites though. I liked Camluck a lot. Odds Against was tough. Then there was Staying Together and of course, Artsplace. Bob McIntosh had the market cornered on top free-for-allers for a few years there. The one he has right now, Thinking Out Loud, I believe is better than most people realize just yet.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Did Julia Roberts ever win?

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This is my signature...

Keystone Raider was a great local horse....Hothead, Falcon Seelster like you mentioned....Buck and Wing.

I loved that Keystone Raider race. I was on him that night and when I saw Paisley duck behind the 2, it was awesome. If I remember the 1 was a dog.

Yeah, I cashed a big bet on Keystone Raider one afternoon at Hawthorne. I think he was 3/1 or something. It was pretty memorable because most of the time I remember getting killed on those Saturday day cards at Hawthorne.

I was never a big fan of Hothead. I tried to beat him a bunch of times when he was on that long winning streak to start his career and I never could. Then finally they all ganged up on him at Maywood and Doug Hamilton beat him with a horse called Laura's Speed King. Of course I didn't bet that thing. I remember when Hothead was four and Black Shadow was five and racing for Bob Farrington they were in a series together at Hawthorne and I bet a bunch on Black Shadow and finally beat Hothead.

I used to get a kick out of Gil Levine when he would call Buck And Wing "The Buck And The Wing". That's the Buck and the Wing out there. Walter Paisley goes to the whip. Out in the middle of the track here comes Heal B. Flashy and he's modockin'!!!!!!

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don