If a kid hasn't done any of the "big things" wrong then they really can't be expelled. He'd have to have brought a weapon or drugs to school, assulted an employee, or been convicted of a felony.

A student may also be expelled for other misconduct, such as:

Bullying, or using threats, intimidation or violence
Gang activity
Using violence, threats or intimidation
Stealing
Making bomb threats
Arson
Sex crimes
Fighting
Kidnapping

This is not all of the reasons why a student may be expelled. Nor will a student definitely be expelled for all of these reasons. The school board has broad discretion to decide when and for how long to expel a student. An expulsion cannot be longer than two years in Illinois. In some cases, the school may also call the police. For details, see your school district’s disciplinary handbook, which you and your child should have received at the beginning of the school year. Although given broad discretion in disciplinary matters, school districts can abuse that discretion according to Illinois case law if they do not consider a range of mitigating factors or comply with certain basic procedural due process requirements. (See What should you do if the school wants to expel your child?)
What must the school do before expelling your child?

Before expelling your child, a school must give you and your child an opportunity to have a hearing, which is more formal than the meeting to appeal a suspension.
If your child attends a non-charter public school, the school must send you notice of the expulsion hearing in writing and by certified or registered mail. The notice must state the time, place, and reason for the hearing. If your child attends a charter school, you should review the school’s disciplinary handbook regarding the school’s expulsion procedures.
At the hearing, the school must give you reasons for your child’s expulsion and the date when the expulsion will start.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I know I've told the story before, but I was very fortunate that the administration basically gave me a free pass to kick a kid in the mouth for bullying me. I would not get that free pass if I were a 5th-grader today. I mean, I missed a recess and I wasn't allowed to go to an ice cream social for kids with no disciplinary infractions, but I certainly wasn't handcuffed and suspended/expelled like I would be today. And I ended up getting along really well with the kid I hurt because I realized in a big group talk that his family life was shit and siding with other bullies was the only way he could inoculate himself from taking the sort of shit I had to take. It was a good sense of perspective that I probably wouldn't have gotten if I had just reported my trouble to The Proper Authorities.

Kids aren't dumb, they're just culturally and hormonally mixed up and need to blow off some steam. If we're going to operate American public education on the principle that it's not about the imparting of knowledge so much as proper socialization (and let's not kid ourselves, we are and we have for years), then part of that socialization means learning that you can't give and take shit indefinitely. Better it be settled with some stupid flailing than another kid shooting everyone.

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I think I need to get Panther's take on all this.

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It almost never happens if it's not one of the big ones. It's really hard to get an expulsion and he's in 3rd grade.



Agree. They don't work thru anything anymore. Sadness, failure, anger...everybody fixes their problem and makes them"happy" again. They grow up in their own bubble and that's what they know.

my mind is not comprehending. socialization = not tormenting people. do that in real life and you wind up fired or in jail. should be lesson #1 in life.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

I bet the the little bastard has had all of his vaccinations.

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I was about to say getting all his vaccines should be his punishment.

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Well played.

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I'm surprised nobody has asked this before:

What would be the upside for a school to ignore 20+ cases of physical assault against an 8 year old?
Why would dozens of physical assaults against the child of somebody that worked in the same school be ignored by school staff?



I like the whole "we are filing suit against an 8 year old" in order to "get the 8 year old the help he needs". While the atty is saying they want to garnish his wages for 20 years. They may want to huddle a little before calling the TV station next time. Also - the schools never, ever, ever want the media to get involved - because they can never, ever say their side of the story. Nothing good happens (for the school) from being on TV.

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This happened at Frost? C'mon now. We never really considered them to be in Mt. P.

Side note: Good thing the parents put their 8 year old on TV to get interviewed. That is definitely something that parents do when trying to keep their kid from getting negative attention.

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Assault isn't clearly defined. I don't know if he is pummeling the kid everyday or he pushed him while they were in line at lunch. If it's the latter, a note goes home, a parent gets called or called in. The parents care or they don't but they don't have control. What can they really do to punish a 3rd grader and make him behave? There are a couple walking disasters in my son's class. I feel like a lot of times they pacify those kids to not disrupt the rest of the class.

suing for $50K? WTF? Try $500K for starters to get somebody's attention.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

No no. The going on GMA is for attention.

I'm just checking to make sure I understand - If an 8 year old pushes another 8 year old in the lunch line, you think the parents should be called in for that? Have you seen groups of 8 year olds line up in unstructured situations? 50%+ of them "push" or "elbow" or something to that extent. That's their mindset - gotta get in line "first". It's not meant to harm or injure, that's just the way an 8 year old mind works.
They can be taught better practices over time (especially in the controlled setting of a classroom with their regular teacher, but once they are in cafeteria, gym, bus, etc, that structure disappears and the behavior changes).

Pacifying kids that continually disrupt the the rest of the class does the opposite of pacifying the rest of the class. It continues the disruptions.

If a kid is a genuine threat/behavior problem, why would a teacher/principal/etc actually want them in their class as much as possible?

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Suits filed in law division must be asking for more than $50,000 in damages. All suits list damages in excess of 50k, you don't ask for an actual number in the complaint.

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The kid came home with black eyes repeatedly. You know who would have paid good $$$ for a pic or two of those black eyes???

I gotta stop now. I genuinely hope that the kid wasn't being picked on all year long, nobody should suffer that - but nothing adds up in this situation.

Shakes is assuming that nothing will come of the lawsuit, which means at that point we will have the following people that are saying the bullying didn't happen:

teacher
principal
supt
school board
police
judge/jury (?)

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Actually, they've been asking those questions all year and after every incident. At least the first one. Don't see the relevance to the second one.

FYI, mom worked in the school cafeteria. The real problem here is the principal who knew about this for a long time and did nothing. School board only got involved recently and they too did nothing.

As for the police, as they stated, the reports were filed for documentation. I told them to do that when the school wasn't doing anything just in case the school wasn't even documenting the incidents. I also told them to give their kid a pillow case full of soda cans and to baseball swing the other kid in the head, but that advice wasn't followed.

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My assumption that nothing will come from the lawsuit has nothing to do with whether or not the bullying happened. It has to do with the willful and wanton standard that must be met in a case vs a school, very tough to prove. If they can get past the summary judgment stage then I assume the school will want to settle immediately rather than face a trial.

Also, no one at the school has denied that the bullying happened so not sure where you are getting that from. They are saying that they took measures to stop it which they didn't.

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So you have all levels of administration and the police doing nothing. Something tells me there's more to the story here that we're not gonna get from you as their lawyer. Or from Good Morning America.

This never would have happened in District 57.

I'm getting it from this:

SEVERAL levels of school personnel have been asked to stop the bullying - and in essentially everybody's report - nothing has been done. That means (to me) that there was nothing to stop. Repeatedly reporting that someone is bullying you does not equal bullying.
If there is nothing to stop, then.........it's going to continue?

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Police were only brought in to document the incidents. They wanted to leave it up to the school to handle it. but, other than that, yes, no one else did anything.

And I'm not their lawyer, just a close friend who gave them some advice along the way. I don't handle these types of cases.

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But there are kids who do it maliciously if this kid was also calling names or was having other issues then it's going to be reported. The teachers/principal can't do much because I agree the pushing type stuff isn't a huge deal unless it is accompanied by other stuff. But that's what I'm saying what's assault?

I agree pacifying often facilities other disruptions, but they can't send the kid away everyday. What do you do and how do you discipline a kid that doesn't give a shit? Especially if they have anger issues or whatever?

There was a kid in my son's grade but in the other class. Completely obnoxious, disruptive, would do things and piss off other kids. Around the last month or so kids did not want to play with him or be near him. Who's fault is that? How do you change it if he won't change his behavior?

The problem here is what do you do? How do you make a nine year old kid behave?

What? So you have no proof that anyone denied the bullying happened other than your naive assumption that if bullying did happen someone at the school would've done something about it???


No offense, but you're coming off as a bit of an idiot in this thread. I suggest you wait for actual facts before making blind assertions based on nothing more than how YOU would handle the situation if it was brought to your attention.

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Is the only real way to stand up to a bully fighting back? No other method seems to work. Even if you take your beatings, should the kid fight back?
What do you parents think?
My experience says that the only time you stop getting bullied is to throw a punch. That's just me, though. It's my opinion that bullies pick kids that they think won't fight back.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Well, that may be true, I usually do - but then again I didn't sue an 8 year old at the school that just fired me with the idea of garnishing his wages for the next 20 years. So I got that going for me.

Come on shakes, it has nothing to do with me. Look how many levels of people "did nothing". Schools aren't much different than other businesses at a certain point - if a problem that should be relatively minor reaches a certain level - one of the head honchos tells the lower employee "do whatever the hell you can to make this go away". But nobody did that.

What do you honestly think goes on in schools - do teachers/principals try to foster an environment of abuse/bullying/violence among 8 year olds? I'd be stunned if you think they really do.

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Shakes....there's no proof of anything at this point.
On either side.
That's one of my main points.

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I think so. It's hard for them to stand up for themselves now because they are scared they will get in trouble. They don't know how to handle it. You don't have to fight, I never did. I just said shitty things to people.

Spanky, I don't feel it's always the school's fault. Sometimes they don't have the power.