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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 2:55 pm 
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rogers park bryan wrote:
Nas wrote:
The Cubs will have to substantially overpay sign Lester. I believe he wants to play for a team that has a chance to win the WS.

I disagree.

I think he'll get about 20-25 mil regardless of where he signs


Nas, where would you spend the money?


I wouldn't. I would wait 1 more year and then splurge. I want to make sure I know what I have and at this point there are a few question marks. I would be active in the trade market.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:05 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
I believe many of you will come out of this off-season surprised.

Some in a positive sense, some in a negative sense.


The army of IMU's will carry us through.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:25 pm 
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I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:26 pm 
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America wrote:
I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


400 posts in a month....and your posting value has declined with each one.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:31 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
America wrote:
I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


400 posts in a month....and your posting value has declined with each one.


Don't hate.

He's got Cub zombies and delusionites on the run.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:32 pm 
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denisdman wrote:
America wrote:
I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


400 posts in a month....and your posting value has declined with each one.

WHY DO CUBS FANS DEFEND JON LESTER AGAINST ANY AND ALL CRITICISM WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS?

Seriously! This drives me fucking nuts!


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:35 pm 
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Nas wrote:
rogers park bryan wrote:
Nas wrote:
The Cubs will have to substantially overpay sign Lester. I believe he wants to play for a team that has a chance to win the WS.

I disagree.

I think he'll get about 20-25 mil regardless of where he signs


Nas, where would you spend the money?


I wouldn't. I would wait 1 more year and then splurge. I want to make sure I know what I have and at this point there are a few question marks. I would be active in the trade market.


I agree with this approach at this point. They may have their rotation in house or they may have nothing. It may sound mocking but at this point, what's another year? Backlash against losing hasn't reached a tipping point and the seals will continue to clap when you bring up another prospect or two next year.

On the other hand, you don't just boom, steak dinner a rotation. If they want a good one for 2016, they need to start now.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:36 pm 
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America wrote:
denisdman wrote:
America wrote:
I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


400 posts in a month....and your posting value has declined with each one.

WHY DO CUBS FANS DEFEND JON LESTER AGAINST ANY AND ALL CRITICISM WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS?

Seriously! This drives me fucking nuts!

yar


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:39 pm 
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America wrote:
denisdman wrote:
America wrote:
I just read that Jon Lester, a lefthander, hasnt even attempted a pickoff at 1st this. HASNT EVEN ATTEMPTED.

Yikes.


400 posts in a month....and your posting value has declined with each one.

WHY DO CUBS FANS DEFEND JON LESTER AGAINST ANY AND ALL CRITICISM WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS?

Seriously! This drives me fucking nuts!


WHY DOES AMERICA CRITICIZE JON LESTER ABOUT STUPID SHIT WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS YET?


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:41 pm 
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the reality is the Cubs are not the affirmative choice for any of these guys

If they are the highest bidder they MAY get them but pursuit will most likely end like Girardi, Sanchez and Tanaka.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:48 pm 
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John Danks was one of the league leaders in pickoff attempts.

How did his season benefit from that?

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:48 pm 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
WHY DOES AMERICA CRITICIZE JON LESTER ABOUT STUPID SHIT WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS YET?

Because Jon Lester is going to be 31 next Spring Training and giving him a bunch of money is stupid. If the White Sox do it for Scherzer or Lester I'm going to be pissed. If they do it for Shields I'll still consider being pissed, but something about James Shields makes me think he wont break down into a flaming pile of garbage right away the other two will. I go back and forth on Shields.

What happens in 2 years when this whole prospect thing is **supposed** to be really taking off? When Lester is eating 26m a year with a 4+ ERA?


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:51 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
John Danks was one of the league leaders in pickoff attempts.

How did his season benefit from that?

Unless Lester pitched a perfect game in every game all season (my research indicates that he did not) it'd be very nice to see him at least try to hold a runner. Watch tonight's game against the Royals, who run run run run. In the NL it's even more of a problem.

Of course pitchers shouldnt be leading the league in pickoff attempts, because that usually means they are giving up way too many baserunners, but Mark Buehrle has taught us that holding runners at 1st is very advantageous. Not being to hold them at all creates RISP for the opponent.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:56 pm 
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His SB% against is lower than the MLB average for his career. Yet he hasn't picked a guy off since 2011.

Apparently, he is doing fine?

And he hasn't even had good defensive catchers.

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Last edited by IMU on Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:57 pm 
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America wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
WHY DOES AMERICA CRITICIZE JON LESTER ABOUT STUPID SHIT WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS YET?

Because Jon Lester is going to be 31 next Spring Training and giving him a bunch of money is stupid. If the White Sox do it for Scherzer or Lester I'm going to be pissed. If they do it for Shields I'll still consider being pissed, but something about James Shields makes me think he wont break down into a flaming pile of garbage right away the other two will. I go back and forth on Shields.

What happens in 2 years when this whole prospect thing is **supposed** to be really taking off? When Lester is eating 26m a year with a 4+ ERA?


What do you give a shit? You hate the Cubs.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:58 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
His SB% against is lower than the MLB average for his career. Yet he hasn't picked a guy off since 2011.

Apparently, he is doing fine?

Are the Cubs going to acquire Jarrod Saltalamacchia and David Ross too?


Last edited by America on Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:00 pm 
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Big Chicagoan wrote:
America wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
WHY DOES AMERICA CRITICIZE JON LESTER ABOUT STUPID SHIT WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS YET?

Because Jon Lester is going to be 31 next Spring Training and giving him a bunch of money is stupid. If the White Sox do it for Scherzer or Lester I'm going to be pissed. If they do it for Shields I'll still consider being pissed, but something about James Shields makes me think he wont break down into a flaming pile of garbage right away the other two will. I go back and forth on Shields.

What happens in 2 years when this whole prospect thing is **supposed** to be really taking off? When Lester is eating 26m a year with a 4+ ERA?


What do you give a shit? You hate the Cubs.

I do! I should actually be rooting for them to get Lester!

But, I've convinced myself into a temporary pity party because Ricketts is ravaging everything redeeming about the franchise. So at least for now I'd like to see Cubs not get burned bad by a terrible FA.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:00 pm 
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By the time America gets to 500 posts, he'll be writing like Mini Ditka or SHARK.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:03 pm 
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America wrote:
What happens in 2 years when this whole prospect thing is **supposed** to be really taking off? When Lester is eating 26m a year with a 4+ ERA?

Mentoring future World Series MVPs Jen-Ho Tseng and Duane Underwood. Duh


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:10 pm 
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Jake Arrieta
Jon Lester
Kyle Hendricks
Neil Ramirez
CJ Edwards
Carson Sands
Corey Black
Duane Underwood
Pierce Johnson
Jen Ho Tseng
Paul Blackburn
Jeferson Mejia

YOU GOTTA BE BLEEPIN ME. THAT IS THE GREATEST PITCHING SURPLUS I EVER SAW

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:11 pm 
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America wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
America wrote:
Big Chicagoan wrote:
WHY DOES AMERICA CRITICIZE JON LESTER ABOUT STUPID SHIT WHEN HE ISN'T EVEN ON THE CUBS YET?

Because Jon Lester is going to be 31 next Spring Training and giving him a bunch of money is stupid. If the White Sox do it for Scherzer or Lester I'm going to be pissed. If they do it for Shields I'll still consider being pissed, but something about James Shields makes me think he wont break down into a flaming pile of garbage right away the other two will. I go back and forth on Shields.

What happens in 2 years when this whole prospect thing is **supposed** to be really taking off? When Lester is eating 26m a year with a 4+ ERA?


What do you give a shit? You hate the Cubs.

I do! I should actually be rooting for them to get Lester!

But, I've convinced myself into a temporary pity party because Ricketts is ravaging everything redeeming about the franchise. So at least for now I'd like to see Cubs not get burned bad by a terrible FA.

if you're not a Cubs fan, your opinion about what is being "ravaged" is invalid.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:13 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
Jake Arrieta
Jon Lester
Kyle Hendricks
Neil Ramirez
CJ Edwards
Carson Sands
Corey Black
Duane Underwood
Pierce Johnson
Jen Ho Tseng
Paul Blackburn
Jeferson Mejia

YOU GOTTA BE BLEEPIN ME. THAT IS THE GREATEST PITCHING SURPLUS I EVER SAW

My guy Junior will pull a Marmol and become a lights out reliever. It'll save me from turning his shirsey into a dish rag.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:55 am 
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Not being able to hold runners doesnt matter.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 6:13 am 
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America wrote:
Not being able to hold runners doesnt matter.

Not being able to get outs matters more. 15 hits and 3 walk braj.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 5:40 pm 
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cpguy wrote:
OK Cubs fans.

Should we offer 5/100? 5/125? 6/140 or don't go beyond 4/80??

The guy has the pedigree and they need a top shelf starter but is this the guy they bite the bullet with and cough up the cash??


No. 5 years for a pitcher is too many. If he were Kershaw or someone of that ilk at the prime of his career, unlikely to fall off anytime soon, you make an exception. Lester's best has probably been produced already. He's still solid, but not special. No deal at those numbers.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 6:35 pm 
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immessedup17 wrote:
His SB% against is lower than the MLB average for his career. Yet he hasn't picked a guy off since 2011.

Apparently, he is doing fine?

And he hasn't even had good defensive catchers.


America wants baseball games to be 5 hours long so he's a bigfan of infinite pickoff attempts.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:27 pm 
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David Ross, the guy who typically caught Jon Lester while in Boston, is one of the better throwing catchers in baseball.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:46 pm 
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Jon Lester GS per catcher:

91 Jason Varitek (known for being bad defensively)
64 Jarrod Saltalamacchia (known for being bad defensively)
29 Davis Ross
27 Victor Martinez (known for being bad defensively)

Sit down, child, and let the grown-ups talk.

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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:30 am 
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immessedup17 wrote:
Jon Lester GS per catcher:

91 Jason Varitek (known for being bad defensively)
64 Jarrod Saltalamacchia (known for being bad defensively)
29 Davis Ross
27 Victor Martinez (known for being bad defensively)

Sit down, child, and let the grown-ups talk.

No AJ? He missed out.


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 Post subject: Re: Jon Lester
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 1:20 am 
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Well, until this year, he bothered trying to pick off runners. He at least tried. So his career stats overwhelmingly represent years when he tried to pick off runners, something he does not do anymore. You're looking at the wrong numbers.

This year David Ross, a very good defensive catcher, caught most of his games. That's why his CSR is 2% below league average.


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