Well played SG

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He proposed to lock in all earned benefits and then change the formula going forward for pensions (two tiers as he called it). He is also offering buyouts to current pensioners. This is common practice in the private sector.


Trickle down is a loaded term. Let me put it this way, if you had two countries one with a 15% average tax burden on society and one with a 25% average tax burden on society with all else being equal, which one is more likely to attract investment capital? As a consequence of capital flowing to one over the other, which economy would grow faster.


I'll even ask it another way. Say you were given the option to invest in two types of bonds that paid 4%. The first bond is taxed at 15% and the second at 25%. Which would you choose all else being equal?

Of course the one with lower taxes.

Trickle down is the concept that higher growth from lower taxes will lead to either neutral or increased tax revenue. It is a flawed theory because each situation is different. In most cases lower tax rates lead to lower revenue.

The other thing is I am not sure why you continue to attack me personally with words like crazy and educated accountant (in a negative light) among other comments you've made in the past. Can't you just state your opinion without involving an assessment of my personal characteristics?

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Any reasonably sane person knows that you can't make a dent in this state's problems without raising taxes--a lot--at least temporarily (not that I'm complaining, what do I care?) I think his seriousness as a human being can be gauged by the lengths to which he will go to avoid saying that out loud. He's angling to be Scott Walker's running mate.

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Soccer 1,2,3
Spanish Honor Society 1,2,3,4
Forensics 1,2,3,4

"Smiles with Nostrils"

"...no Hmong, go find some blacks"

He doesn't?

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

That's just silly.

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

You could have just answered "Yes, I believe in the trickle down theory"


Are you fucking kidding?

You spent weeks on this site popping into threads to say "Oh look rpb is sucked into another Cubs debate lololololol"

My response to that is to point out your very....unique....take on the Cubs being the 90s Braves. (which is ultra relevant since Im usually defending the overall fandom from being labeled unrealistic dreamers who say stuff like that about the Braves) Im sorry you didnt like me returning the fire.


My comment about you being an educated accountant was not a shot. I really dont know how someone in your job could support Rauner's ideas.

I'm only half-kidding. I think he wants to run for President, though he'll be like 70 once Walker's 8 years are done.

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Soccer 1,2,3
Spanish Honor Society 1,2,3,4
Forensics 1,2,3,4

"Smiles with Nostrils"

"...no Hmong, go find some blacks"

Because Dmans not middle class, that's how he can support Rauner's ideas.

He seems like an honest man. I honestly dont see how anyone can argue FOR the trickle down myth at this point.


I like denis. I think he's intelligent and honest. We disagree on a lot of things though.

Where are you getting this from?

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

RPB,

What is the alternative method to fixing this state? Do you feel that we are under-taxed? Should we have just continues with the previous approach? What would you do?

_________________
CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

No, he doesnt. He thinks he works for the ultra rich. He works for all Illinois citizens.


I understand why you like him knowing what you value. We just disagree.

I would attempt to strengthen the middle class. He is killing the middle class.


Trickle down economics do not work. They never have. Been trying it for over 100 years.

Rauner thinks that it works. That's a big problem.

When your state is run like shit for 30+ years of freebies, guess what....you need to pay at some point.

Cant just keep getting new credit cards.

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"That's what the internet is for. Slandering others anonymously." Banky
“Been that way since one monkey looked at the sun and told the other monkey ‘He said for you to give me your fuckin’ share.’”

We will get a new credit card in the end. Veto proof majority my friend.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I am most certainly middle class. And came from very humble origins. Yet none of that matters. I simply respect your opinion and RPB's, and I would ask that you respect mine. I continue to put out my sincere thoughts on issues and try to engage in intellectual arguments in the political threads. This site makes that damn near impossible because guys want to take personal shots. It'd be great if you could respond to the ideas in the post rather than the poster.

I support giving Rauner a chance to fix the long term structural problems in this state. The pensions are $111B unfunded, we are $7B behind on our bills, and the 2016 fiscal year is facing an 8% decline in revenues. If you'd prefer the career politicians we've had in the governor's office, then good luck with that.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

+1000

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

I disagree. I think many on this site have proven that they can have an adult debate without taking personal shots.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

You are being overly sensitive lately, Denis.

If you think someone calling a sports prediction crazy = personal shots, then I dont know what to tell you. Its just not.

Also, KD saying you're not middle class is also NOT A SHOT

Whats your deal man? It's a message board. People are going to disagree with you. Seems like you're not used to that.



Fine. Give him a chance. It looks awful so far, I guess we'll see.


The line about career politicians is lazy. No one is advocating that.

RPB loves to use the lazy term, it is his thang.

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2018
#ExtendLafleur
10 More Wins

Denis is counting me calling his prediction (that the Cubs will turn into the 90s Braves) "crazy" as a personal shot


Also KD saying he's not middle class.

weird

I'm taxed enough. I'd rather see some budget cuts and no family and friend jobs.

Not really. You're confusing me with Nas who said that to you last week.


But what word would you use to describe someone who uses strawmen?

I have seen you use it enough, no worries it is not a shot.

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2018
#ExtendLafleur
10 More Wins

Hopefully the state Supreme Court will find the obviously unconstitutional pension reform bill unconstitutional.

not me, i want to shake up Springfield

Some of the cuts are fine but the pension thing is the main issue and that is not going to pass.



Also, cutting Mental Health Care seems like a bad idea.

You don't work. A combination of both is always best.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

They will. And the beautiful thing is that Illinois is going to be the test case for what to do with a bankrupt state. There are no provisions in the federal bankruptcy code for state reorganizations. At that point, the state will not be able to pay its full pensions for lack of funds, and everyone is going to wonder how it got to this point. Well, the fixes were ruled unconstitutional.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Correct me if Im wrong, but you are saying that we need Unconstitutional fixes at this point?