Nah my Cubs thought was crazy and in that case you are attacking my opinion. I am cool with that. I razzed you too much for taking the arrows on the Cubs stuff, and I have since backed off at your request. I got upset in this thread because the implication of me being rich is that my opinion does not count due to my income bracket. That is such a weak counter argument, in my opinion.

It's a message board, and you are more than welcome to attack me personally. I know the drill. I was just asking that you respond to my post and not the poster. My right to do so as well.

And yes we are all good. I like that we all have different opinions. I enjoy political and economic debates, but personally, I prefer that tilt intellectual lest we turn into Ted Cruz.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

My record of responding to the post and not the poster is as good as anyone here.


And saying :It's a message board and you're free to attack me" is bullshit. No one attacked you.


Also, even if KD meant that as a shot. Im fairly certain he is saying "he's looking out for his own rich interests, not the middle class" instead of "his opinion doesnt count"


I think you're reading into things too much

Couple of things. I actually asked Governor Quinn through the Daily Herald editorial board why he didn't just change the Constitution (or propose to do so) to get rid of the entire issue. His response was, let's see if the fix we passed will pass Constitutional muster. I think we should just change that piece of the IL Constitution.

Short of that, there have been other approaches. One such approach is employees and pensioners electing individually to trade the current deal for a different deal, like a buyout. That should pass muster. The other one outlined by Rauner today was to collectively bargain the changes, so that the employer and union agree to the changes. I think these are sound approaches.

What previously passed is probably not Constitutional, although there is an argument to be made that the dire financial position of the state is more important the Constitutional pension guarantee.

In all cases, I believe in the ideals of the Constitution, so my proposal is change it. I think we are only one of three states with that clause in the Constitution. In Michigan they have the clause, but Detroit was allowed to break it through the b/k courts because federal law preempts state law. But states cannot take advantage of the b/k code.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

A well established record at that!

You're right.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Sorry I'm a vapid leech on my husband's gravy train. He is taxed enough and it effects the way the household works. I am responsible for taxes on goods I purchase and property I'm part owner of even though I have no income to pay them with. He and I are taxed enough.

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Sex isn't dirty, sex isn't a crime. It's a loving act between two or more consenting adults.

-Hank Kingsley

This girl gets it.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Enough for what? The state taxes are very low and considering you are young and have school aged kids you benefit quite a bit from your property and local taxes. It's unlikely those have gone up substantially (if at all) over the past 6 years that I've seen you repeat this. By now I would assume that you all have a great idea what your taxes will be every year. You probably even know what your tax credits will look like.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

From Reboot Illinois site. I highlighted a few pension related items.

http://www.rebootillinois.com/2015/02/1 ... ers/33250/

$32.1 billion Total projected state revenue, FY 2016.

$37.8 billion Estimated spending, FY 2016.

$5.2 billion/35.3 percent Amount of decline in state income tax revenue from FY 2014 to FY 2016.

$6.4 billion Estimated amount of unpaid bills on June 30,2015.

$9.9 billion Projected backlog of unpaid bills by end of FY 2016.

$6.8 billion Owed to pension funds in FY 2015.

$3.6 billion/86.7 percent Amount by which pension costs grew from 2010 to 2014.

25 percent Portion of state-generated income that goes toward pensions.

$5.4 billion Amount saved in pension payments from FY 2016-2019 if Illinois Supreme Court upholds pension reform law

$650 million Amount borrowed from special state funds for 2015 budget that must be repaid in 2016 budget

$789 million Amount of 2015 spending pulled from FY 2015 budget and placed into FY 2014 to hide spending.

$1.439 billion total hidden spending/borrowing from current budget that must be paid back in FY 2016.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

A mixture of higher taxes and budget cuts are needed. Lower taxes and budget cuts won't get it done.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Rauner has hinted on a sales tax increase by making services subject to state sales taxes. I think that will be part of the negotiations.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I don't know about everyone else, but I sure do feel under-taxed!

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

It worked so well for the nation when Reagan did it..

Just did my taxes over the weekend...but I am happy to pay my (less than ) fair share.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Exactly right.

No one likes paying more in taxes but you also have to be reasonable when things are going bad and tough solutions are required.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

What about taxing all internet sales? It's gonna happen at some point.

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

I'm sure we all wouldn't like to pay any taxes. Unfortunately 0 % isn't an option for anyone.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Good point. Why should you have to cut back? Sock it to those mooching poor people. If it weren't for them we wouldn't have this problem.

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Mr. Trump is unfit for our nation’s highest office.- JD Vance
If you committed violence on that day, obviously, you shouldn’t be pardoned.- JD Vance on the J-6 insurrectionists

I think maybe you making these "what is my fair share" statements might lead some to believe you arent middle class.


I mean, no one is yelling for the middle class to "pay their share"

fucking property taxes are killing me. state income tax is way less.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

Aww come on, I already admitted you were right. Do I have to do so twice in one day?

How about this? You tell me your definition of middle class either by income or wealth, and I will let you know if I am middle class.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I WOULD PREFER YOU JUST POST YOUR W-2.

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Denis, Im not chiding you or arguing. Im saying that statements like that might cause confusion.


I dont know. I was going to ask you and KD, what are we defining as middle class in 2015?

The link I gave in my original post had an excellent comparison of IL income taxes vs the surrounding states. It is right in the mix on that metric. I think property taxes are what that really pushes Illinois up the tables on total tax take.

My problem is that even with all the taxes we pay, the budget and pension are still facing big holes.

As I have asked in the past, how much do I have to pay in percentage terms so that no left leaning person will say more taxes are the answer? I am willing to pay that percentage, which I believe 75% was the number I got last time. I will pay that much if Elizabeth Warren wants. Then when we are still short of funds for schools, roads, military, healthcare, etc, I will smile politely and die a happy man.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

I only know what you post on here, but when you posted about making a killing on stocks, paying capital gains taxes, paying 4 figures for travel teams, and sending kids to private schools you'll understand if I don't think you're middle class. However Nas is in charge of W2 requests on this site.

Middle class used to mean that your earnings were +/- 50% of the median household income in a given area. I believe that the median income in Chicago is about $40K.

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CSFMB 2014 Nascar Pick 'em Champion

We don’t have a trillion-dollar debt because we haven’t taxed enough; we have a trillion-dollar debt because we spend too much. — Ronald Reagan

http://money.cnn.com/interactive/economy/are-you-middle-class/

Middle class in
Cook County, Illinois is
$41,506—$67,823

Oh I gotcha. I have seen ones with incomes as low as $125,000-ish in annual household income. Obviously (to me) that is way too low. When I think of rich, I would say someone making in excess of $1,000,000 annually or with wealth probably on the order of $5,000,000 or more. At that point you live in another world. Now when you look at the middle class, there is a huge difference between a family making $50,000 and $500,000, but rich to me is owning multiple homes, flying first class, big boat, and other very expensive items.

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Hawaii (fuck) You

Oh ok, well there's the disconnect.

I think KD probably views it differently. No problem.

husband and wife each making $60K is easily middle class.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest